Thinking about Cone area, power handling, and motor force.

dudeogo

Actually a Potato
So, my head has gotten me thinking about how these three interact. 4 15s 6 12s and 8 10s all have relatively similar cone area so I've been wondering what would be loudest in perfect conditions... Assuming they're the same exact model of sub in different basket sizes you've got the 4 15s with the highest cone area, but lowest power handling and with less woofers the least motor force. On the other side of the spectrum there is the 8 10s with the least cone area but the most power handling and I would assume therefore the most total motor force. With 6 12s Being the sweet spot. Personally I'm drawn to the 8 10s just because I like to see a lot of woofers moving and high power handling, but what do you guys have to say about this? It's kinda been driving me crazy thinking about it.

 
motorforce doesnt add together like that. Only cone area does. Motorforce is set in stone with the driver you used. More drivers doesnt mean more motorforce. It means more power handling and better coil cooling. eight 10s have more cone area than four 15s.

 
motorforce doesnt add together like that. Only cone area does. Motorforce is set in stone with the driver you used. More drivers doesnt mean more motorforce. It means more power handling and better coil cooling.
Okay, so I do always hear that cone area is King, but assuming the right box will the 8 10s be as loud or louder than the 4 15s because of their increased power handling?

 
motorforce doesnt add together like that. Only cone area does. Motorforce is set in stone with the driver you used. More drivers doesnt mean more motorforce. It means more power handling and better coil cooling. eight 10s have more cone area than four 15s.
8 10s have 628 square inches 4 15s have 706.5 square inches. From what I can see.

 
8 10s have 628 square inches 4 15s have 706.5 square inches. From what I can see.
oops i read the chart wrong lol.

Okay, so I do always hear that cone area is King, but assuming the right box will the 8 10s be as loud or louder than the 4 15s because of their increased power handling?
not really. If they are lets say we are using 1000 rms subs on a 4000 watts amp. the 4 15s on 4k will be louder than 8 10s on 4k. However you can throw 8000 watts at 8 10s and get louder.

So more drivers only get louder if you add power accordingly or else cone area is king.

The multiple sub route is just overly expensive in comparison to the lower subs and higher cone area build so it basically comes down to how much money you want to throw down the drain and how many circles you want to cut with your baffle along with how much magnet weight and battery weight you want to throw onto your car. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ up the @ss with multiple sub builds vs fewer big subs. So as for loudess+cost efficiency/results per dollar, higher cone area wins out every time.

 
oops i read the chart wrong lol.


not really. If they are lets say we are using 1000 rms subs on a 4000 watts amp. the 4 15s on 4k will be louder than 8 10s on 4k. However you can throw 8000 watts at 8 10s and get louder.

So more drivers only get louder if you add power accordingly or else cone area is king.

The multiple sub route is just overly expensive in comparison to the lower subs and higher cone area build so it basically comes down to how much money you want to throw down the drain and how many circles you want to cut with your baffle along with how much magnet weight and battery weight you want to throw onto your car. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ up the @ss with multiple sub builds vs fewer big subs. So as for loudess+cost efficiency/results per dollar, higher cone area wins out every time.
Thanks Jeff. 4 15s is the better​ Option then I suppose

 
What's gonna be louder will determine a few factors: Install, power, electrical, and either wall or enclosure. 2 10's can out-hit 4 15's....it's been done and people were amazed. Why? Because testing and enclosure with tons of power whereas the 4 15's may have had weak install overall.

I had 4 10's before the 2 15's I have now. Was gonna go 8 10's but that would require more space, new build etc. The subs themselves were obsolete.

 
Okay, so I do always hear that cone area is King, but assuming the right box will the 8 10s be as loud or louder than the 4 15s because of their increased power handling?
The adage is "no replacement for displacement", which is cone area X excursion (also includes the volume of air vibrated in your port).

You may or may not benefit from more motors. On the meter you'll find more Jeeps get impressive numbers with 2 18s than multiple smaller subs. I'm not sure the science on this, but cone area isn't always created equal especially if you're planning to wall.

Yes, you get more power handling, but Jeff makes an excellent point about adding much more weight and more complexity.

Before I walled I had used single 15, pair of 15's pair of 12's, three and four 12s and 4 10s and produced roughly the same numbers on the meter with all variations. Frequency response was quite different though as the subs behave a bit differently with different cones on them (assuming same motor). I preferred 3 12s but that might just have been me getting lucky with the box or dependent on my particular subs either.

In short, do what you like, for what you're doing the real tradeoff will be weight and complexity for power handling, just playing music loud and impressing your buddies will all wash about the same. Also be sure you can fit all of them in your baffle along with adequate port. 12s or 10s will likely only allow center horizontal slot port. If you want to keep your box simple you'll only have about 33" up and down and 40-42 side to side. Even the 15s is a tight squeeze.

Get yourself a big *** box (rent a center or similar place usually has big TV boxes they're throwing away) and mock up a front out of cardboard. Allow a few inches on every side for side walls, and see how much real estate you really have to play with.... also figure whatever you think you'll have you probably will still have a bit less when it all comes together.

 
The adage is "no replacement for displacement", which is cone area X excursion (also includes the volume of air vibrated in your port).
You may or may not benefit from more motors. On the meter you'll find more Jeeps get impressive numbers with 2 18s than multiple smaller subs. I'm not sure the science on this, but cone area isn't always created equal especially if you're planning to wall.

Yes, you get more power handling, but Jeff makes an excellent point about adding much more weight and more complexity.

Before I walled I had used single 15, pair of 15's pair of 12's, three and four 12s and 4 10s and produced roughly the same numbers on the meter with all variations. Frequency response was quite different though as the subs behave a bit differently with different cones on them (assuming same motor). I preferred 3 12s but that might just have been me getting lucky with the box or dependent on my particular subs either.

In short, do what you like, for what you're doing the real tradeoff will be weight and complexity for power handling, just playing music loud and impressing your buddies will all wash about the same. Also be sure you can fit all of them in your baffle along with adequate port. 12s or 10s will likely only allow center horizontal slot port. If you want to keep your box simple you'll only have about 33" up and down and 40-42 side to side. Even the 15s is a tight squeeze.

Get yourself a big *** box (rent a center or similar place usually has big TV boxes they're throwing away) and mock up a front out of cardboard. Allow a few inches on every side for side walls, and see how much real estate you really have to play with.... also figure whatever you think you'll have you probably will still have a bit less when it all comes together.
Informative as always. Thank you. Honestly I have no clue what I want anymore. 2 18s doesn't sound too bad. I did really want to wall but after the conversations we had I know I'll need a junker before I jump to that. Just doing cargo area right now I would think. The cardboard is an awesome idea (my dad is a distributor for motorcycle parts and accessories so we have boxes up the @$$) Thanks to everyone for the replies. This has been bugging me for a long time.

 
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