The XXX subwoofer SPL myth...

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

Keep in mind, this is simply in YOUR application. But if you knew the whole story... you'd also know Scottie gained a FUK TON switching to MT's... like... A LOT. Lawl...

nG

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

Keep in mind, this is simply in YOUR application. But if you knew the whole story... you'd also know Scottie gained a FUK TON switching to MT's... like... A LOT. Lawl...
nG

uhh, ok?

i agree 100% that for pure SPL, MTs are louder. never in debate here.

also, my app is the only one ive done a comparison on (SX vs. XXX), however it's an enclosure in a relatively small vehicle, with subs facing forwards, port facing forwards, mic on the dash.

scottie gained alot, but he also did alot more to the enclosure to gain more, so it wasnt a direct swap, imho.

my point is it gets old hearing people say the XXX is not a good SPL driver, when it is. as a matter of fact, my SXs were louder than my strokers, and the XXXs are louder than my SXs. and, that the brahma extreme is the same driver as the XXX.

so, what's your point, if i may ask?

 

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

uhh, ok?i agree 100% that for pure SPL, MTs are louder. never in debate here.

also, my app is the only one ive done a comparison on (SX vs. XXX), however it's an enclosure in a relatively small vehicle, with subs facing forwards, port facing forwards, mic on the dash.

scottie gained alot, but he also did alot more to the enclosure to gain more, so it wasnt a direct swap, imho.

my point is it gets old hearing people say the XXX is not a good SPL driver, when it is. as a matter of fact, my SXs were louder than my strokers, and the XXXs are louder than my SXs. and, that the brahma extreme is the same driver as the XXX.

so, what's your point, if i may ask?

Just stating that's there's TONS of other drivers (Including MT's) that are much better suited for SPL. Great job getting yours loud though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

nG

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

too bad it was edited so much, we're working on a little SPL setup in my 4 year olds gator

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

Just stating that's there's TONS of other drivers (Including MT's) that are much better suited for SPL. Great job getting yours loud though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif
nG

thanks for the compliments, guys.

however, i dont know if there are "tons" of drivers better suited for SPL. the stroker is "still" an excellent SPL driver, and it spanks the shiat out of it.

look at the build of the XXX: huge motor, sturdy frame, SUPER stiff cone assembly (same assembly as the MT, i might add), very high power handling, great excursion (though not strictly SPL related).

im sure this could be debated for eons, and im not trying to take anything away from you. ive been in this game for a long, long time, and while im not trying to argue with you or question your knowledge, the XXX is a capable driver. sure the MT is louder, SPL wise, but will not sound as good, imho. same can be said for the atomics, or the higher end digital designs stuff.

again, there's some drivers that are louder, but they dont sound near as good

another interesting point to consider: 90% of it is STILL install. this may sound like bragging, but im still the first person, in legal competition, to pop 150 with 2 10s. and they were JL 10W0s, with 150 watts on each, in the hatch of an escort, legal, mic on dash, car sealed up. in 1997.

not bragging, just qualifying my statements

 

[Josh #44 10+ year member]

Some sort of VT box, is my guess...

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

howd you do that?!

well, back then, everyone in SPL competition was running a tremendous amount of drivers, with huge amounts of power. but there were 2 problems:

1. the majority of competitors used either sealed boxes, or poorly designed ported boxes. people werent thinking in terms of large amounts of port area, tuned @ or near the vehicles resonant frequency. also, most ran what the manufacturer suggested for box size: too small. as an example, one highly known manufaturer recommended 3 cubes sealed for their 15, and 1.75 sealed for SPL!

2. the power that was available back then was inefficient: everyone had to use class A/B designed amps that ****** HUGE amounts of current (there were no "class d" amps back then). so, if a competitor was running a true 2kw amp, it was still very difficult to get a true 2kw to the drivers. if you think vehicles now have to have major electrical upgrades with d amps that are around 70-80% efficient, consider what it was like when amps were 35-40% efficient!

the main idea was this:

how can we take a sub, and push it to its max potential with very limited power? keep in mind, before this, i was not sponsored, and had to come up with all the cash myself.

we went thru several sealed designs, and several ported designs. what we (the shop i worked at, and the fine folks @ virtual tech), came up with, was an enclosure that would drive the sub to full output with very little input (large, but not so large as to induce enormous imedance rise), with as much port area we could fit into the design, tuned to the escorts resonant frequency. back then, i didnt even know to call it that, i just knew, when we were testing the sealed enclosures, there was ALWAYS a peak around 60 hz, so thats what we tuned the port to.

what we ended up with won me first place @ the southern invitationals in perry, ga that year, and alot of first place trophies everywhere we took it. it also opened alot of peoples eyes and minds to a new way of doing things to get high SPL.

alot of the results of this can be read on the termpro forums, in the link in my sig.

again, not bragging, just hope it helps some to understand our hobby a little better

 

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

thanks for the compliments, guys.
however, i dont know if there are "tons" of drivers better suited for SPL. the stroker is "still" an excellent SPL driver, and it spanks the shiat out of it.

look at the build of the XXX: huge motor, sturdy frame, SUPER stiff cone assembly (same assembly as the MT, i might add), very high power handling, great excursion (though not strictly SPL related).

im sure this could be debated for eons, and im not trying to take anything away from you. ive been in this game for a long, long time, and while im not trying to argue with you or question your knowledge, the XXX is a capable driver. sure the MT is louder, SPL wise, but will not sound as good, imho. same can be said for the atomics, or the higher end digital designs stuff.

again, there's some drivers that are louder, but they dont sound near as good

another interesting point to consider: 90% of it is STILL install. this may sound like bragging, but im still the first person, in legal competition, to pop 150 with 2 10s. and they were JL 10W0s, with 150 watts on each, in the hatch of an escort, legal, mic on dash, car sealed up. in 1997.

not bragging, just qualifying my statements

I'm 100% aware of all your assertions.

I've owned numerous XXX's, as well as an SX, and a few MT's. I've owned an IA DP, SI Mags new and old, eD SP, seXXX, and I have a Brahma Extreme chilling around here as well.

What the XXX lacks for in BL, it makes up in displacement. It's better for relatively low frequency SPL burps and such. Also, in 97... it still wasn't the TL //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif... but I understand what you're saying. I've done a 152.1 legal with a single MT15, street B style... just for reference. And yes, I got tired of the lack of SQ with the MT... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

nG

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

I'm 100% aware of all your assertions.
I've owned numerous XXX's, as well as an SX, and a few MT's. I've owned an IA DP, SI Mags new and old, eD SP, seXXX, and I have a Brahma Extreme chilling around here as well.

What the XXX lacks for in BL, it makes up in displacement. It's better for relatively low frequency SPL burps and such. Also, in 97... it still wasn't the TL //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif... but I understand what you're saying. I've done a 152.1 legal with a single MT15, street B style... just for reference. And yes, I got tired of the lack of SQ with the MT... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

nG

cool

im glad some people know how to debate civilly, without showing their enormous e-penis

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

something that DOES upset me:

back then we were paying 700 DEALER COST for an A/B 1kw amp.

i bought my 2500d brand new a few weeks ago for 450.

its a GREAT TIME to be car audio

 

[bigbassman Premium Member]

wished I knew something about tottie jawnson.... or competing.... or RE subs...

sniffle...

Loyd L.

 

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

wished I knew something about tottie jawnson.... or competing.... or RE subs...

sniffle...

Loyd L.

Lawl. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

nG

 

[toaster 10+ year member]

wished I knew something about tottie jawnson.... or competing.... or RE subs...

sniffle...

Loyd L.

ummm... UH-HUH

 

[80INCHES 5,000+ posts]

belive it or not the soundsplinter rl-s 15 in a 4th order banpass tuned to 55hz got really loud..it had just about the same output as a brahma extreme 15

80

just want to 2 point that out

 

[937DYTBOI 5,000+ posts]

Sweet dude ive going to have the same setup minus the 13 cubed box, but how does the SX's like the 2500d at .5 ohm, Is that setup jus for burps or also for a DD.