out of phase

[NoMoneyMike]

Ok.... I just had my local shop install all my audio gear the other day. When I got home later that night I was messing around with settings and found that he had my speakers all crossed up. So I pulled out my driver seat and redid my hook ups for the 4 ch amp. Now I am thinking How do I know if He even hooked up the speakers correct????? How would I know if the speakers are out of phase????????? Thanks Mike

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[alpine3612 10+ year member]

you should notice a distinct difference in sound, it will almost sound as if the front speakers are farther apart if they are out of phase. Leave one channel the way it is, and swich the + and - on the other.

 

[Rattlebrain 10+ year member]

http://www.bcae1.com/speaker.htm

This might help.

 

[alpine3612 10+ year member]

and.... next time hook it up yourself, save the hassle

 

[lubetek 10+ year member]

if you had a shop do it then you should have brought it back. Why do it yourself if you already paid someone to do it the first time. (I full on rec. always doing it yourself though but since you already paid....)

 

[Cris 10+ year member]

out of phase speakers make my ears hurt, almost making my eyes tear.. its a very awkward feeling. You can't mistake it.

 

[Ben_Davis 10+ year member]

What exactly is out of phase? is it when u hook your - to +? or what? will this damage your speakers?

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

out of phase speakers make my ears hurt, almost making my eyes tear.. its a very awkward feeling. You can't mistake it.

There is a difference between out of relative phase (polarity), and out of absolute phase (acoustical phase). Just because the speakers are out of relative phase, doesn't mean that the speakers are not in absolute phase....and absolute phase is all that matters. Reversing the polarity of one of the speakers is commonly done in SQ systems to improve the absolute phase of the system.

So, without knowing what speakers you had installed, and the installers intentions when installing them, and what wires were "reversed"......there is no guaranty that it was done "wrong". It may have actually been done "right".

Geolemon has a good write-up on his site about absolute and relative phase, their differences and importance: http://betteraudio.com/geolemon/Phasing/Phasing.htm

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

What exactly is out of phase? is it when u hook your - to +?

When people typically talk about "out of phase", or "reversing the phase", they are talking about connecting the + wire to the - speaker terminal, and the - wire to the + speaker terminal. Basically just switch the wires.

will this damage your speakers?

Absolutley not. All it would do is reverse when the speakers excurts outward and excurts inward.

Grap a 9V battery and a speaker and you can see the effects of reversing the polarity. Stick the wire for the + speaker terminal to the + post of the battery, and the - speaker terminal to the - post of the battery and the speaker will excurt outwards. Now reverse the wires (+ to - and - to +), and the speaker will excurt inwards.

 

[JohnBlayz142 10+ year member]

out of phase speakers make my ears hurt, almost making my eyes tear.. its a very awkward feeling. You can't mistake it.

I've sat in many cars and gotten this feeling. A system loud enough will do this whether in phase or out. Type R just got his shit back in phase yesterday, and his system did both of these things to me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[TypeR0149 10+ year member]

I've sat in many cars and gotten this feeling. A system loud enough will do this whether in phase or out. Type R just got his shit back in phase yesterday, and his system did both of these things to me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

its wangin now for sure.

i never thought i would see a basshead like johnblayz with his fingers in his ears.

that was all i needed to know that it was loud.

trust me it has gotten out of control for me, i was playing some tones last night, and it felt like my head was being ripped off.

its amazing that 1 of my speakers being out of phase made it like 60% quiter.

but thanks for the props john

 

[JohnBlayz142 10+ year member]

its wangin now for sure.
i never thought i would see a basshead like johnblayz with his fingers in his ears.

that was all i needed to know that it was loud.

trust me it has gotten out of control for me, i was playing some tones last night, and it felt like my head was being ripped off.

its amazing that 1 of my speakers being out of phase made it like 60% quiter.

but thanks for the props john

Don't tell people I covered my ears haha. I had just cleaned them with a q-tip about 30 minutes before sitting in there. I must admit, it HURT to sit in that ride.

 

[thch 10+ year member]

There is a difference between out of relative phase (polarity), and out of absolute phase (acoustical phase). Just because the speakers are out of relative phase, doesn't mean that the speakers are not in absolute phase....and absolute phase is all that matters. Reversing the polarity of one of the speakers is commonly done in SQ systems to improve the absolute phase of the system.

So, without knowing what speakers you had installed, and the installers intentions when installing them, and what wires were "reversed"......there is no guaranty that it was done "wrong". It may have actually been done "right".

Geolemon has a good write-up on his site about absolute and relative phase, their differences and importance: http://betteraudio.com/geolemon/Phasing/Phasing.htm

i hate that link. geo seems to have made up some phrases to describe things. then he put it online and it almost lends credibility to using these terms in the context on the site.

Absolute phase - This has everything to do with how the sound generated from the speakers reaches your head, which may have very little to do with how they are actually wired. If you had exactly the same pathlength between your two speakers, the sound would always reach your head at the same time from your two speakers. This would mean the "absolute phase" of the two speakers would be perfect.

this is a made up definition. this is still relative phase. absolute phase could be ANYTHING. for instance, the wave may make 2 full cycles before reaching your head. this means the wave is 720 degrees out of phase. really, there is no need to distinguish between absolute and relative phase at any point in the imaging article, as relative phase is the only thing that ever matters -- the phase difference of the sound from speaker A and speaker B at a point S is all that matters. no need to reference the input signal ever.

it makes more sense if you express waves correctly as f(S,t) -- as a function that varies with time and position. then you can compare F1( S1, t) vs F2( S2,t), or F1(S,t) vs F2(S,t). (two waves at two points at a single instant for example1. two waves at a single point at a single instant for example 2).