new 06 pioneer HU's vs Eclipse cd8445?

[ravendarat 10+ year member]

I agree it comes down to the listener, and sound is very suseptable to personal preference. BECAUSE of that I use the distortion rating to explain why I say one deck sounds better than another and Flat setting is an extremely usfull parameter being that all head unit bench tests are done with the decks set completly flat.

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

I agree it comes down to the listener, and sound is very suseptable to personal preference. BECAUSE of that I use the distortion rating to explain why I say one deck sounds better than another and Flat setting is an extremely usfull parameter being that all head unit bench tests are done with the decks set completly flat.

Fair enough. I was just driving that point home due to practical uses. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[JLCivic 10+ year member]

Well, that being said it is still up to the listeners ears to decide which sounds better just like JL Civic pointed out. I mean what difference does it make what a deck sounds like flat when NO ONE listens to their deck flat.?? So that stat doesn't really mean much if you ask me.

Every eclipse I have owned and my 8250 have always been set flat. They have sounded great just like that. IMO, not having to tweak a deck for days to get it to sound good DOES mean something.

 

[JLCivic 10+ year member]

Yeah but you're sort of missing the point of having an EQ. If your car has the acoustic properties that allows you to achieve a good response with the deck set to flat then so be it. But if you're not achieving a good response and you're leaving the deck flat then you're cheating yourself a bit don't you think? Don't get me wrong, if that is how you like it then its your deck and you can set it however the fuck you want it.LOL.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif
On a side note: I don't care for BBE at all. The only processing I use on my 860 is "comp" or BMX when I'm listening to mp3s. Other than that its the EQ only.

Here is an example of more eq not necessarily being better. For a few months, I ran a Clarion 835 in my civic that I owned. It was a good deck, but I could not get the system to sound nearly as good as it had with my previous deck(Eclipse CD8051). The shop tweaked it as much as they could and then 1 of the owners simply said, "you just need to get another eclipse." They dropped in an 8053(set flat), and all the music that had not sounded right now sounded perfect.

You can have all the eq in the world, but sometimes, all of that eq is there to mask what is not a great signal in the first place, imo.

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Every eclipse I have owned and my 8250 have always been set flat. They have sounded great just like that. IMO, not having to tweak a deck for days to get it to sound good DOES mean something.

That you're lazy.?? LOL.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

J/K. What it means is you're lucky.

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Here is an example of more eq not necessarily being better. For a few months, I ran a Clarion 835 in my civic that I owned. It was a good deck, but I could not get the system to sound nearly as good as it had with my previous deck(Eclipse CD8051). The shop tweaked it as much as they could and then 1 of the owners simply said, "you just need to get another eclipse." They dropped in an 8053(set flat), and all the music that had not sounded right now sounded perfect.
You can have all the eq in the world, but sometimes, all of that eq is there to mask what is not a great signal in the first place, imo.

I think you're sort of misunderstanding what I'm saying. Lets face it, in a perfect world you could set a deck flat and get a nice response out of your vehicle. Unfortunately we do not live in a perfect world. A vehicle's interior is an acoustic nightmare and most times needs a little tweaking. Just to let you know in my car I have a DEQ-230 and my deck has a 13band EQ. Most of the bands on both EQs are don't have much added at all. In fact most of the bands are in the negative. I actually took away more than I added which is pretty much what an eq is for.

I never said or meant that the more bands on your EQ the better the sound would be. What I meant was that the more tweaking options the better the deck had a potential to sound. Just because a deck has dual 16bands doesn't mean you have to go and boost ALL 16 bands. An EQ is not always the answer but MOST of the time a deck set to flat will yield a good response curve. Your situation was in the minority.

 

[JLCivic 10+ year member]

That you're lazy.?? LOL.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

J/K. What it means is you're lucky.

Buying nice sounding decks has nothing to do with luck

 

[JLCivic 10+ year member]

I think you're sort of misunderstanding what I'm saying. Lets face it, in a perfect world you could set a deck flat and get a nice response out of your vehicle. Unfortunately we do not live in a perfect world. A vehicle's interior is an acoustic nightmare and most times needs a little tweaking. Just to let you know in my car I have a DEQ-230 and my deck has a 13band EQ. Most of the bands on both EQs are don't have much added at all. In fact most of the bands are in the negative. I actually took away more than I added which is pretty much what an eq is for.
I never said or meant that the more bands on your EQ the better the sound would be. What I meant was that the more tweaking options the better the deck had a potential to sound. Just because a deck has dual 16bands doesn't mean you have to go and boost ALL 16 bands. An EQ is not always the answer but MOST of the time a deck set to flat will yield a good response curve. Your situation was in the minority.

Yes, a deck with more eq may give it more flexibility, BUT deck A w/more tweaking ability may not necessarily sound as good as deck B with very limited tweaking.

To me, the bottomline is the signal has to be as good as possible to begin with. With some decks, you HAVE to tweak it to get it to sound good. To me, a deck that doesn't need that has more value(and, imo, is a better sounding deck).

My 8053 had a pretty extensive eq, but I never needed it(and my setup in my civic was kind of out of the ordinary).

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Buying nice sounding decks has nothing to do with luck

Having those decks sound good in any vehicle has EVERYTHING to do with luck.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Yes, a deck with more eq may give it more flexibility, BUT deck A w/more tweaking ability may not necessarily sound as good as deck B with very limited tweaking.
To me, the bottomline is the signal has to be as good as possible to begin with. With some decks, you HAVE to tweak it to get it to sound good. To me, a deck that doesn't need that has more value(and, imo, is a better sounding deck).

My 8053 had a pretty extensive eq, but I never needed it(and my setup in my civic was kind of out of the ordinary).

Thats just it though, you never know when you're going to need more flexibility. Having a nice deck that looks good on the test bench won't do much good if the vehicle is an acoustic mess. I see your point that you're making but I wasn't suggesting taking a BOSS or Pyramid deck and saying if it had a big EQ it would sound as good as any deck out there. I was more or less talking about a new Pioneer (the 880PRS) which will definitely have that "good as possible" sound you're talking about and still have a dual 16band EQ to go with it if needed.

 

[JLCivic 10+ year member]

Having those decks sound good in any vehicle has EVERYTHING to do with luck.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

It has to do with knowing what you are doing(and having good people who know what they are doing as well).

 

[neil.schneider 10+ year member]

I have the 8445 also and it does sound good, but in the sunlight you can't see it. I have done some research and spoke to mult dealers, and they say that it is one of the best sq decks. I wish that their touch screen units sounded as good and were less $.

 

[MBrock4u 10+ year member]

Well here is my 2 cents worth. I did bench test the big 4 head units out there before I bought mine. In my opinion (lol) Herre were my conclusions. Alpine, best looking units out there. Sounded damm good to. Pioneer, lots of bells and whistles, was impressed with the sound of the eq's. Kenwood Excelon, lower units not as flashy but AMAZING sq. Last but not least, Eclipse... On flat it sounded the cleanest of them all but too expensive to get more features if I wanted them. Bench tests were done on flat and similaler eq settings on focal speakers. For the money I was looking to spend the excelon was the right choice for me. Had everthing as far as tweeking features I wanted. The new pioneer's are sweet units and I tend to agree that it would be hard pressed to top an Eclipse, but the for price, the Excelons give me the best of all worlds.

 

[954runner 10+ year member]

i was considering the 780.

went with the 8445. i love it. will not sell it. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[forbidden 10+ year member]

I would say the pioneer 880 over that eclipse deck. I have never owned that deck but have heard alot about the eclipse decline in sq in the last 2 years. that is the only pioneer i would say has better sq, well that and the 860. I do like my older Eclipse decks for SQ. as far as new pioneer all the way.

This sounds like a great episode for mythbusters. Perry even knows this and I am surprised he overlooked it as well. To Barry, the line is somewhat new too as FS has only had it for two years and with very limited head unit models. I have had the line for 11 years now. Consider this information.

- If the Eclipse from 10 years ago has the same tuner, is it going to be worse than before?

- If the laser sled is the same as 4 years ago, is it worse than before?

- If your dog and your wallet are both on a chain, you might be a redneck.

- If the internal amp is the same as it was 3 years ago, how can it be a poor performer?

- If the preamp is EXACTLY the same for all generations that have used either the 3, 5 or 8volt preouts, how can they perform any less today as compared to previous years.

- If the laser pickup is the same, how can be of lesser grade.

Basically, I find a gaping hole in your statement, no offence intended. To hear something and take it as the truth is not exactly accurate. The little things I posted above, well, please go ahead and validate them yourself for confirmation.