Lithium LTO batts/ HO alt

[CertifiedHoodClassic]

I'm planning on using either a 5k or 8k amp with a Singer HO alt and Yinglong LTO cells. These parts are going into a minivan.

I haven't requested a quote from Singer yet but it seems the largest alt they make that fits my vehicle is 320A. There isn't a good way to fit a second alternator. This is my first build of this size and I don't know if one alt is enough to keep up with 8k. Anyone know?

As for the batteries, I'm looking at using XS power 66160 (Yinglong 40ah equivalent). The XS power seems to cost less, only reason I bring them up. I'd use the Jim's machineworx buss bars for 12 batts in 6s2p (13.8v 80 ah). I've seen conflicting information about the batts. Can I run a 6s bank at the standard 14.4v charging voltage? Do I need a balancer? Is it feasible to run an 8k on the alt and one bank or maybe two?

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[K9_Candyman]

I'm planning on using either a 5k or 8k amp with a Singer HO alt and Yinglong LTO cells. These parts are going into a minivan.

I haven't requested a quote from Singer yet but it seems the largest alt they make that fits my vehicle is 320A. There isn't a good way to fit a second alternator. This is my first build of this size and I don't know if one alt is enough to keep up with 8k. Anyone know?

As for the batteries, I'm looking at using XS power 66160 (Yinglong 40ah equivalent). The XS power seems to cost less, only reason I bring them up. I'd use the Jim's machineworx buss bars for 12 batts in 6s2p (13.8v 80 ah). I've seen conflicting information about the batts. Can I run a 6s bank at the standard 14.4v charging voltage? Do I need a balancer? Is it feasible to run an 8k on the alt and one bank or maybe two?

Hi man. at the moment i'm sitting on 144ah lto cells from audio system italy powered by a simple 120a and its working really great on my deaf bonce 8000 and 2 taramps 3k for the door speakers. take a look on my instagram @LowLow_Candyman

 

[Popwarhomie 5,000+ posts]

You will want to charge higher for them. I’m charging at 15.8 cold and 15.5 hot.

 

[CertifiedHoodClassic]

Hi man. at the moment i'm sitting on 144ah lto cells from audio system italy powered by a simple 120a and its working really great on my deaf bonce 8000 and 2 taramps 3k for the door speakers. take a look on my instagram @LowLow_Candyman

Man 144 ah of cells and a 120 amp alt runs all that? What does your voltage look like? I don't use Instagram but I followed on my burner account anyways. Sick hair tricks.

You will want to charge higher for them. I’m charging at 15.8 cold and 15.5 hot.

Is it safe to have my cars electronics connected or is there some circuit to protect them?

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

the largest alt they make that fits my vehicle is 320A

That's fine because there's no way on Earth a """320A""" alternator will make 320A for very long under real world conditions under the hood.

YingLong cells are good, though I would run more than 80AH for 8KW amp. Their "max" discharge rating is 10C and I'd suggest you'd want to stay closer to 3-5C for best results. In fact, for the price I don't know why everybody is trying to skimp on them, 240AH bank takes up only about as much space as a couple 110AH AGMs and at half the weight.

Anyway, I've had mine for a few years now and don't do any balancing and charge at normal car voltage (though that's leaving a lot of reserve on the table as opposed to charging 15.5). I figured going into this that even if they only lasted 3 years I'm still ahead of the game over buying AGM to do the same job since I only would need to replace the cells and not all the hardware/copper/nuts/etc. So far so good.

We have 240AH in my brother's Civic on stock alternator running a big 10K Korean board and the voltage barely moves with hard play. You'll melt the subs before you drop more than 0.4V. That size bank on 12K amp with a good alternator and your voltage wouldn't move more than 0.2 even going hard.

So don't cheap out here. The cycle life of these cells falls off a cliff as you start pushing them beyond 3C and it's downright dreadful running them at "max" rated charge or discharge.

 

[K9_Candyman]

charge at normal car voltage

Yes sir, i do the same. my alternator 120a charging at 14.5v and when i play heavy bass songs the lowest i have seen is 14.0v. I have 2 pride sv3 15's and a deaf bonce 8k, for sure not the most powerful, but i'm pretty happy. Maybe in the future i need to recharge them a little higher, i have a switching power supply that can charge from 12 to 16v, but i want to be honest, i don't feel the need for the moment. Engine works perfectly, and every electrical too.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

2 5s banks of 40 ah of yinglong should work for you. Unless you have a voltage regulator and want to charge over 15 v 6s isn't necessary. A 5s bank can charge up to 14.5-15v. Each cell can charge up to 2.9v. So 5 cells can easily charge up to 14.5v. My buddy is running 6K with 4 5s banks and a stock alt.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

A 5s bank can charge up to 14.5-15v

Where are you getting 15V from? 2.9V is "charge cutoff" listed in all the spec sheets I've seen.

 

[Popwarhomie 5,000+ posts]

Is it safe to have my cars electronics connected or is there some circuit to protect them?

Can't say I have ever heard of anyone having an issue.

I run a Heltec 6s balancer and a ISDT BG-8S cell monitor. The monitor is not needed I just wanted to see each cells voltage and how well they are balanced.

With my 320 amp alt and 40ah bank I don't even drop 0.1 volt when cruising.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

Where are you getting 15V from? 2.9V is "charge cutoff" listed in all the spec sheets I've seen.

2.9v X 5 cells = 14.5v. Most vehicles these days will only charge up to 14.5v unless an external regulator is used. I've seen my 5s bank get up to 14.7v. I'm pretty sure that my 5s bank could hold 15v without gassing out. My alternator won't charge it up that high so I'm not worried about it.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

2.9v X 5 cells = 14.5v. Most vehicles these days will only charge up to 14.5v unless an external regulator is used. I've seen my 5s bank get up to 14.7v. I'm pretty sure that my 5s bank could hold 15v without gassing out. My alternator won't charge it up that high so I'm not worried about it.

OK, so you're just assuming you can charge these beyond their rated charge voltage and be good in the long term. These cells will not fail catastrophically but I'm pretty sure if you abuse them they will fail prematurely.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

OK, so you're just assuming you can charge these beyond their rated charge voltage and be good in the long term. These cells will not fail catastrophically but I'm pretty sure if you abuse them they will fail prematurely.

Bro, my computer won't charge them higher then 14.5v. The computer in my truck won't allow it. In fact I have my lithium connected with an AGM so my lithium rests at about 13.0v. I'm not over charging anything. I would rather have five fully charged cells at 14.5v then 6 partially charged cells at 14.5v. But that's just me.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

I've seen my 5s bank get up to 14.7v.

my computer won't charge them higher then 14.5v

Which is it?

 

[CertifiedHoodClassic]

2 5s banks of 40 ah of yinglong should work for you. Unless you have a voltage regulator and want to charge over 15 v 6s isn't necessary. A 5s bank can charge up to 14.5-15v. Each cell can charge up to 2.9v. So 5 cells can easily charge up to 14.5v. My buddy is running 6K with 4 5s banks and a stock alt.

You can find charts comparing voltage to state of charge (SOC): https://www.researchgate.net/figure...ured-at-different-temperatures_fig4_324117029

2.8V is '100%' SOC, with 5s that's 14V, with 6 that's 16.8V. That's why people told me if I want to run 5s, drop my voltage.

You will want to charge higher for them. I’m charging at 15.8 cold and 15.5 hot.

If you run 6S at 15.5 you get ~2.6V which is >95%.

It also makes sense why people here can run 6S on the standard voltage, 14.4/6 =2.4V per cell, or ~80% capacity.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

Which is it?

I've seen my volt meter hit 14.7 for a couple of seconds. Does that mean that my 5s is going to gas out? I've also seen 5s being charged and it was up to 15.1v without a problem.