Just curious about amp SQ

[The_Quiet_One 10+ year member]

Could of swore you told me to PM you. Derailing city here.
I googled a list of things, I knew most of the brands, maybe I didn't want to be fucked with researching specific ****** brands when you can paste it, I skimmed over all those and recognized they were bad so I copied and pasted it, so you want me to type all that up myself just to prove a point?. Not even close to what I advised against. I've used Rockford & Kicker obviously its in my sig, used Hifonics, Crescendo, Alpine and Pioneer amps. Doesn't matter what I've used, he clearly just wanted to know the difference in mid to high end SQ amps. And if any difference in high end to high end amps. You don't need to have used a million amps to answer that question. 0.01 THD and 1% THD are no different.

I had a Planet Audio I forgot to mention, Believe 150w monoblock amp at 4 ohms everyone said would only push 60w. Had it benchmarked at 127w at 4 ohms. Now, they claimed1500 watts, but I know better. theyre not cea 2006 compliant.

Interesting.

I'm still confused how your first post was supposed to be constructive? A list of crappy amps does nothing for this discussion. FYI .01% THD and 1% THD are very different, by a factor of 100 if my finger math is any good:. Whether or not you can hear it in a given setup wellllll that's the one that begins to open up can of worms.. You're giving conflicting thoughts now. Assuming you have two amps with similar THD would the amps sound different or do they sound the same? If they do sound different can you measure that difference somehow? What makes a truly high end amp like a Brax or Sinfoni stand worlds apart from say a JL Audio Slash?

As far as asking what amps you have used I was curious if you had personally used any SQ oriented amps to make a comparison yourself.

If the source, speakers, and install is **** none of this matters

Hit the nail right on the head! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

If it's all DD. Then it's smooth sailing

This lol.

Sarcastic bastard

 

[MrFoca]

This lol.
Sarcastic bastard

I knew you would like //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[adulbrich 5,000+ posts]

If it's all DD. Then it's smooth sailing

Basically yes //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[tommymilan311]

Yeah, because that's totally what I said. OP was trying to - in a netshell - find out if there is a difference in two different high end amplifiers.The answer is no, but if you go from a ****** brand, or even a decent entry-level brand to high end youll see a noticeable difference. I simply stated 'some' a/b amps have an internal eq curve. I never said anything "special" about it.I could of worded my post better, but if you mistake what I said in the past any other way I put it you shouldn't be in car audio. Some random dude checking this forum post with a completely different problem/question and then using the posts here to decide for himself, also shouldn't get into car audio.

I said nothing about specifically Kicker class a/b amps being the best SQ amps. And trust me, if some dude thinks his Kicker Amp is the best in caraudioland, my forum post would have no effect on his ignorant brain, if he had any knowledge he would know better than that.

I made a comparison for brands to look for - to get clean power/signal/output. We answered his question, and I added a bit of input.

For whatever reason, you expect everyone that visits this site to be an expert.

"Hey, I'm new to this, and have been told Kicker makes the highest quality stuff."

"Just GTF out of car audio you ignorant twit."

You see what I mean? Shoot, I've only even been interested in car audio sense the beginning of the year, and knew very little before coming here. I went out and got all kinds of Alpine equipment after being told it was some of the best stuff you can buy. All type-r stuff, so pretty much top of the line for Alpine, but not top of the line for SQ, but I didn't know that before coming here. My amp sucks, because I was relying on someone who I thought knew what they were going to guide me. I was mislead into thinking Amps were underrated and can push more than they say. Well... They can, but not cleanly. So I forked out about $300 for a amp that doesn't work for what I wanted, why? because I was told it would work. It does, its the alpine MRX-1100. He said it would be just fine at 1 ohm, well, it drops wattage at one ohm and limits to 800 watt... for 2 1000 watt speakers. So thats frustrating. But it still works, I just don't have desired quality and I always know that I'm pushing my speaker 600W (per speaker) less than they can handle. So not everyone on here knows what from what, and many that come on here are noobs trying to ask questions and learn about the system. I for one am one of those guys.

I get what your saying about comparing brand, but I could easily see someone new to car audio mistaking your comment as Kicker or Alpine making HQ amps. Being more familiar with Car Audio, I understand that you were comparing them to even lesser brands.

 

[tommymilan311]

My take on it from my experience in direct swaps from good A/B to good D.
Good A/B can be pushed and maintain good dynamics with headroom.

Good class D amps don't like to be pushed to their limits.

If you must go D like I had to this time get one with more power than you need to never push it to its limit.

All the "test" done have the amps setup to sound the same. That can be done but you might be taking away from the good amps to make it happen.

Think of it like a woofer since we all know how they work.

Can you make pretty much any woofer sound good? Yes.

To do it you might have to take away some of its output potential.

If you tune a box for a flat response you have to take away some peak output.

Same goes for amps. It takes less A/B power to match output of a class D because they can be pushed farther without issues.

I personally like to pull everything back just a lil. I have no processing though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif or sound deadening //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif my sound stage is poop //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif but I'm getting there and I've learned a ton here //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[LongThrow]

[quote name='tommymilan311']For whatever reason, you expect everyone that visits this site to be an expert.

"Hey, I'm new to this, and have been told Kicker makes the highest quality stuff."

"Just GTF out of car audio you ignorant twit."

You see what I mean? Shoot, I've only even been interested in car audio sense the beginning of the year, and knew very little before coming here. I went out and got all kinds of Alpine equipment after being told it was some of the best stuff you can buy. All type-r stuff, so pretty much top of the line for Alpine, but not top of the line for SQ, but I didn't know that before coming here. My amp sucks, because I was relying on someone who I thought knew what they were going to guide me. I was mislead into thinking Amps were underrated and can push more than they say. Well... They can, but not cleanly. So I forked out about $300 for a amp that doesn't work for what I wanted, why? because I was told it would work. It does, its the alpine MRX-1100. He said it would be just fine at 1 ohm, well, it drops wattage at one ohm and limits to 800 watt... for 2 1000 watt speakers. So thats frustrating. But it still works, I just don't have desired quality and I always know that I'm pushing my speaker 600W (per speaker) less than they can handle. So not everyone on here knows what from what, and many that come on here are noobs trying to ask questions and learn about the system. I for one am one of those guys.

I get what your saying about comparing brand, but I could easily see someone new to car audio mistaking your comment as Kicker or Alpine making HQ amps. Being more familiar with Car Audio, I understand that you were comparing them to even lesser brands.[/QUOTE]

Your a much easier person to talk to than that ******. I see how what I said can be taken wrong, and the mistakes I made in my post. And I also didn't mean for it come off like I thought everyone here is an expert.

**** you @Souldrop

 

[tommymilan311]

[quote name='LongThrow']Your a much easier person to talk to than that ******. I see how what I said can be taken wrong, and the mistakes I made in my post. And I also didn't mean for it come off like I thought everyone here is an expert.

**** you @Souldrop[/QUOTE]

Yeah I get it. But just understand that some people come here know 0, or have already been steered in the wrong direction because poor advise, which was my case.

Also, I've been misinformed about Sundown. I now have personally heard one, and I'm still not a fan, but I suspect a poor build. Dude had a type z 15'. From the outside of the Tahoe it looked like the truck was trying to transform. I got in, and it was loud, but I thought it sounded like poop. I just wasn't digging the sound. Plus it didn't sound as loud as it looked like it'd be. IDK if it was because of a lack of sound deadening or what, but it had all the feel without the noise (or as much as I though it should have). Maybe it was just pushing air as it was up real high on the DB ratings (so he told me from competing). I just came away not digging the sundown. DD on the other hand has been very impressive from what I've heard, and I think they were just the redline series.

But I'm still super new to this. I'm sound deadening my door next, and the adding a processor. I've been slacking with CA as the football season is aproaching, I've been working on writing music, and I'm going to be build a '86 Monte Carlo soon. So many hobbies, so little time. LOL

I rambled, my bad, I'm gonna stop taking over this thread now.

 

[The_Quiet_One 10+ year member]

[quote name='LongThrow']Your a much easier person to talk to than that ******. I see how what I said can be taken wrong, and the mistakes I made in my post. And I also didn't mean for it come off like I thought everyone here is an expert.

**** you @Souldrop[/QUOTE]

Aww missed you too sweetcheeks:inlove: Just remember on the internet everyone is an expert. Myself emphasized :.


I also think tommy is a refreshing breath of fresh air. Hopefully this thread hasn't been killed and the OP gets an answer he is happy with.

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

Yeah I get it. But just understand that some people come here know 0, or have already been steered in the wrong direction because poor advise, which was my case.
Also, I've been misinformed about Sundown. I now have personally heard one, and I'm still not a fan, but I suspect a poor build. Dude had a type z 15'. From the outside of the Tahoe it looked like the truck was trying to transform. I got in, and it was loud, but I thought it sounded like poop. I just wasn't digging the sound. Plus it didn't sound as loud as it looked like it'd be. IDK if it was because of a lack of sound deadening or what, but it had all the feel without the noise (or as much as I though it should have). Maybe it was just pushing air as it was up real high on the DB ratings (so he told me from competing). I just came away not digging the sundown. DD on the other hand has been very impressive from what I've heard, and I think they were just the redline series.

But I'm still super new to this. I'm sound deadening my door next, and the adding a processor. I've been slacking with CA as the football season is aproaching, I've been working on writing music, and I'm going to be build a '86 Monte Carlo soon. So many hobbies, so little time. LOL

I rambled, my bad, I'm gonna stop taking over this thread now.

That's how Sundown Megafail surrounds work. That's what the kids want

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

Yeah I get it. But just understand that some people come here know 0, or have already been steered in the wrong direction because poor advise, which was my case.
Also, I've been misinformed about Sundown. I now have personally heard one, and I'm still not a fan, but I suspect a poor build. Dude had a type z 15'. From the outside of the Tahoe it looked like the truck was trying to transform. I got in, and it was loud, but I thought it sounded like poop. I just wasn't digging the sound. Plus it didn't sound as loud as it looked like it'd be. IDK if it was because of a lack of sound deadening or what, but it had all the feel without the noise (or as much as I though it should have). Maybe it was just pushing air as it was up real high on the DB ratings (so he told me from competing). I just came away not digging the sundown. DD on the other hand has been very impressive from what I've heard, and I think they were just the redline series.

But I'm still super new to this. I'm sound deadening my door next, and the adding a processor. I've been slacking with CA as the football season is aproaching, I've been working on writing music, and I'm going to be build a '86 Monte Carlo soon. So many hobbies, so little time. LOL

I rambled, my bad, I'm gonna stop taking over this thread now.

No, you are right. Those Zv4s sound like @ss to me too. Its mainly low linear bass. They sound completely different from sundown SA series. The Z series are made for a different purpose, mainly moving air, flexing vehicles and hairtricks. I've never heard a sundown Z setup that actually hurt me, last competition in march i went to, there were plenty of 4th orders and ported walls with sundown Zv4s and nightshades mainly 4 15s or more in terms of cone area, there was one with 8 18s doing 160s, here's the vid of his 2014 before he added 4 more NS-1s


. They metered loud 155s to 160s but all sounded like poo and none of them even felt that loud(never choked me out, never blurred my vision, never ear R*ped my ear drums, my ears did hurt at the end of the day but it never hurt during the demo). It did feel like a sledge hammer slapping your brains though, major headache but thats all. They dont really hit 50hz and up a lot which is where a lot of the audible bass in rock and other music is.
I've had a 149.5 db dodge ram truck with 2 18s soundqubed ported wall choke the living crap out of me and blurred my vision and crushed my lungs waay harder than these high metering cars. So whats loud to the ear and body might not be loud to the meter. Vice versa.

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

Well from my swaps of 4 channels with the EQ on flat, nothing else changes other the amp swap and matching gain. Going from a ppi 520.4 ion to a ppi p900.4, no difference other than loudness. From the 900.4 phantom to a JL audio G6600 6 channel, 75 watts x 6. There was a lot more detail in the highs, especially in the 8khz to 12khz range played with a lot less harshness/sibilance which results in much more detail in the music. Midbass was more present and midrange sounded smoother and fuller overall a lot more pleasant than the PPI. All of this together really helped out the soundstage depth and width. However it couldn't even get close to keeping up with my substage at -12 db attenuation settings. Also tried a gladen xl 150c4 Similar sound the JL but the output wasn't actually there either unless the gain was cranked high, The JL amp actually sounded better honestly. Even with the gains set clean, the output wasnt much higher than the JL and there was a bad noise floor with this amp. I would recommend getting mosconi's flagship amps over these line of gladens if anyone is looking at them..

 

[whitemax 10+ year member]

The Arc Audio amp that the OP mentioned is a solid amplifier. I've run many Arc Audio amplifiers over the years & have had great luck with them.

As long as you have a decent amplifier, there are other factors that will have much greater influence in the sound within your vehicle. I tend to focus more on installation, drivers, & tuning...properly executing these things will play a bigger role than what amplifier you run. Flea market brands excluded. The last amps I've run were Rockford Power Series, Audison LRx, Arc Audio XXK, & Boston GT. I am now running inexpensive Tarantula Nanos. This was my first venture into fullrange class D amps, & I'm pretty happy with their performance. I may change them out later as I tend to do that, but it's not because of their sound signature.

 

[dsw1204]

The Arc Audio amp that the OP mentioned is a solid amplifier. I've run many Arc Audio amplifiers over the years & have had great luck with them.
As long as you have a decent amplifier, there are other factors that will have much greater influence in the sound within your vehicle. I tend to focus more on installation, drivers, & tuning...properly executing these things will play a bigger role than what amplifier you run. Flea market brands excluded. The last amps I've run were Rockford Power Series, Audison LRx, Arc Audio XXK, & Boston GT. I am now running inexpensive Tarantula Nanos. This was my first venture into fullrange class D amps, & I'm pretty happy with their performance. I may change them out later as I tend to do that, but it's not because of their sound signature.

How important of a factor in an amplifier's performance is slew rate and damping factor? Are these specs just as vital to performance as S/N ratio and distortion numbers? I tried to find these specs on my Arc KS900.6, but can't seem to find them anywhere.

 

[evilmonstertruk Premium Member]

I think the difference in "SQ" is one amp does rated or higher RMS and the lower end amp doesn't even get close. Real power makes a HUGE difference. That's why when you switch a high end amp with another high end amp they don't sound so different.

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