High SQ Subwoofers for around $200: 8", 500W amp. ID, SA, Dayton, JL

[Excelsius 10+ year member]

Hi guys,

It's been a while, but my 7 year old Ascendant Audio Assasin 8" woofer (250W RMS, 4Ohm) is dead. I was told that this happened supposedly because my JL Audio 500/1 v1 Monoblock Sub Amp (500W, driving only the one sub) was too powerful. I don't know how true this is since my install was done by pros.

In either case, I don't have much space in my trunk (2007 Civic Coupe) and was to stick to 8" subs and keep my current enclosure: 11x10x7.5” (7.5” deep) 0.7” thick, 8.2” hole diameter. After reading a lot, it seems that Daytons are really highly regarded. They have a 5 year warranty and are geared towards high end home audio systems. Image Dynamics is also supposed to be great, but I read that they had some company worker/ownership issues and it seems that Daytons are considered to be higher SQ, which is far more important for me than SPL. These are the subs I'm considering:

1. JL Audio 8W3v3-4 8” 250W, 4Ohm, 518.4 cu in (10x10x9.5" sealed) $190
   
2. JL Audio 10W3v3-2 10” 500W, 2Ohm, 1080 cu in (17.87x11x9 sealed) $200
   
3. Sundown Audio SA-8 v2 D2 500W, 3.36Ohm, 6.65x8.375 (cut out 7.375) $180
   
4. Dayton RSS210HO-4 8" $150.
   
5. Image Dynamics ID8D4 v3. $180. These guys are just 20 miles from me. What I don't understand is that the specs for this sub say that it's 8ohm, but the site says it's 4.
   

It seems to me that I should go with the Dayton. Do you guys think that the 500W amp is too high for it? Also, are there any other brands I should look at? I mostly play classical, altertnative, rock, with hip hop here and there.

Here is my full set up:

• Pioneer Premier FH-800BT CD Receiver
  
• ZED Audio Draconia I
  
• JL Audio 500/1 v1 Monoblock Woofer Amp
  
• Rainbow Soundline SLC 265.25 NG speakers in the front
  
• Rainbow Dreamline KX 165 Coax Woofers in the back
  
• Ascendant Audio Assasin 8” Sub in a sealed enclosure made by AA as well
  

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[Vertex Audio Pro Seller]

The Ultra ALV 8" woofer would work great for your available power and budget.

Here is a link: http://www.caraudio.com/forums/supporting-vendors-*new*/592919-new-ultra-alv-8-sql-goodness.html

@keep_hope_alive

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

i agree the PRM is a beefy sub and should be added to your list (i would use it over a dayton) and it could make use of the power available. You don't want to overpower the dayton, that rating is on purpose.

Sundown has some beefy 8's but i wouldn't rely on them for SQ.

Even an Alpine Type-R 8" could work and sound decent.

you'll need to consider your existing enclosure volume and compare against mfr recommendations fr Q=0.707

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

http://www.caraudio.com/forums/subwoofer-classifieds/594613-tc-sounds-epic-8-a.html TC sounds aint too shabby either, a much more budget option if your willing to buy LNIB

 

[Excelsius 10+ year member]

I've never heard of Ultra's. It was pretty hard to find their website and it mentions nothing about the PRM line. I can't find any official specs, MSRP, or even where to buy it. There are no dealers in CA either. Why do you think it's better than Dayton? Based on the specs, Dayton should perform better, especially as far as resonant frequency (Fs) is concerned. Slight concerns about resale value as well in case I decide I don't like it and want to change the sub in the future.

Are there any other suggestions? If not, I will have to talk to Dayton and see what they say about my amp. I'd rather go up to 10" and upgrade my enclosure if I can't find anything good at 8" that can be pushed by my 500W amp.

 

[bbeljefe]

If you're worried about SQ and you want to re use your existing box, forget about mounting holes and look at xmax and EBP. If you're running a sealed box and you buy the Sundown SA-8 you'll just wind up claiming it can't do SQ when in reality, it won't do anything well in a sealed box... especially a large one. However, in a properly designed box, the SA-8 will produce as much sound quality as you can hear without an anechoic chamber and an RTA to influence you.

Likewise, if you shove that Dayton sub in a tiny ported box, you'll not be happy with it and it will be for sale with a bad review.

The box makes more difference than the sub and the amplifier settings make more difference than the power handling.

If it were me, I'd pick a sub that fit my budget and allowed my amp ~25% headroom and then I'd design an enclosure that fit the sub and my goals the best.

 

[Excelsius 10+ year member]

Bbel, thanks for injecting some scientific input here. I did a lot of reading about what you said. The Ultra I was recommended has an EPB of 104.1, higher than even the SA8 (98.9), and is likely far more suitable in a ported box, which I mentioned I do not want. I also read that lower Qts is another indicator of SQ. As far as my amp goes, I heard back from JL and now know how to set it up properly, something that my expensive a** installers should have known. My amp can provide 250W by simply adjusting the voltage. Also, if I get the ID8D4, I can run it at 8Ohms and my amp will drop to 250W. The issue is that the ID8 seems to have only a 150W RMS, otherwise I would have just gotten it. So right now it's between the Dayton and JL and I think I'm leaning more towards Dayton. It will fit my box fine to boot.

Both Dayton and JL confirmed that overpowering the sub isn't an issue, especially with properly adjusted voltage, which I will do personally with my voltmeter. Most of these car stereo experts obviously don't know much about the basic physics of the audio systems.

 

[04silverz 10+ year member]

I thought Dayton wanted small box? Pretty sure most reviews lean that way

That said, I was looking at ho8 and was warned away from them. Forget why though. Ended up with 12s

 

[bbeljefe]

Bbel, thanks for injecting some scientific input here. I did a lot of reading about what you said. The Ultra I was recommended has an EPB of 104.1, higher than even the SA8 (98.9), and is likely far more suitable in a ported box, which I mentioned I do not want. I also read that lower Qts is another indicator of SQ. As far as my amp goes, I heard back from JL and now know how to set it up properly, something that my expensive a** installers should have known. My amp can provide 250W by simply adjusting the voltage. Also, if I get the ID8D4, I can run it at 8Ohms and my amp will drop to 250W. The issue is that the ID8 seems to have only a 150W RMS, otherwise I would have just gotten it. So right now it's between the Dayton and JL and I think I'm leaning more towards Dayton. It will fit my box fine to boot.
Both Dayton and JL confirmed that overpowering the sub isn't an issue, especially with properly adjusted voltage, which I will do personally with my voltmeter. Most of these car stereo experts obviously don't know much about the basic physics of the audio systems.

The Dayton sub you linked to in your OP has an EBP of 59.45. And I've looked at several other of the Ultras (I think all of them) and none of them are high EBP subs... unless there's something I've not seen.

 

[Excelsius 10+ year member]

The Dayton sub you linked to in your OP has an EBP of 59.45. And I've looked at several other of the Ultras (I think all of them) and none of them are high EBP subs... unless there's something I've not seen.

Did you see the link posted by Vertex Audio? http://www.caraudio.com/forums/supporting-vendors-*new*/592919-new-ultra-alv-8-sql-goodness.html

According to that Ultra PRM 8 has an EBP of 104.1. I still wouldn't buy anything that has no official specs and isn't even listed on the official webpage.

I read that Qts is more important than EBP for determining sealed vs ported. Can anyone shed some light on this?

 

[Excelsius 10+ year member]

I thought Dayton wanted small box? Pretty sure most reviews lean that way
That said, I was looking at ho8 and was warned away from them. Forget why though. Ended up with 12s

Yes, that's the point. I will be putting the sub in a 0.37 cubic ft sealed box. I'd be curious to know as to why you were told that the Dayton HO isn't good.

 

[bbeljefe]

Did you see the link posted by Vertex Audio? http://www.caraudio.com/forums/supporting-vendors-*new*/592919-new-ultra-alv-8-sql-goodness.html
According to that Ultra PRM 8 has an EBP of 104.1. I still wouldn't buy anything that has no official specs and isn't even listed on the official webpage.

I read that Qts is more important than EBP for determining sealed vs ported. Can anyone shed some light on this?

Oh shite, sorry about that. I was confusing the Dayton HO with the Ultra.

As for Qts, it is important for determining how well a sub will perform in a given box. EBP will tell you whether the sub is gonna want a large or small enclosure and, in my experience, how it will perform in a given enclosure type.

Higher EBP subs work in smaller enclosures regardless the alignment but low EBP subs (again, in my experience) don't do well in ported enclosures.

 

[™Caveman 10+ year member]

Can't you get another aa assassin 8?

 

[UsAmpsFreak]

You could also check out Diamond Audio, they make some very nice sounding speakers.

 

[04silverz 10+ year member]

Yes, that's the point. I will be putting the sub in a 0.37 cubic ft sealed box. I'd be curious to know as to why you were told that the Dayton HO isn't good.

I didn't say they're not good

Iirc, the 8 needs a large box proportionately compared to the 10 or 12

I originally wanted 4 8s but was warned against it. Ended up with 2 12s and may get 2 more