Help with Installation

[jmbmichael]

I’m helping a neighbor kid install his sound system and running into an issue with the subs sounding awful. He purchased this kit on eBay with a Harmony amp and Kicker subs (I know super cheap but still should sound ok). I know my way around connecting everything and we have it all installed and went through the tuning steps by turning the gains all the way down, turning the volume down 50% from where the door speakers begin to distort, then slowly turning the gain up. The problem is as soon as the subs started making sound they almost sound like they’re blown and that’s only with the gain barely turned up. No adjustments on the LPF, etc helped at all. We triple checked all of the cables and connections. We turned the gain up a little more and added volume and the speakers hit hard and sound halfway decent at higher volume but as soon as turn it back down the distortion is awful. These are supposed to be new speakers and look new. The voicecoil sounds ok when pressing on the cone a little. I tested the amp by pulling a speaker out of my truck and connecting it and it did not have that distortion. I then connected one of the Kickers to my amp in my truck and it still had the same distortion at low volume. Is it possible to get two bad speakers like this or is there something else we should look at. I’m just trying to help this kid out but I feel awful for him.

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[HardofWhoring]

Thats a really poorly put together package.
Two 4 ohm SVC subs that are 150w RMS each. They should be wired together for 2 ohms.
That amp is 600w RMS at 2 ohms.
That enclosure is only half the air space those subs are minimum recommended for.

 

[HardofWhoring]

The amp has a low level and a high level input. RCAs are low level. So that button should be pushed in.

That amp doesn't go with that sub either:

That subs frequency is 27-500hz. Yet that amps low pass filter, (which doesn't look like you can turn it off) is 40hz - 180hz. Even if you turn that low pass filter up as far as you can, to 180hz, you're still cutting off 2/3rds of the frequency for that sub.

The more I look at this package the more complete horse crap it is, they tried to bundle this together. Those 3 pieces don't go together, and any two of those pieces don't go together. Seriously this package is nonsense and he needs to return it, and come back and let us piece him together something.

 

[HardofWhoring]

Those kicker comps are from 2016. They may have included the wrong ones, but more likely the are dumping off old stock to make room, and he is the sucker that bought em.

If this is me, that enclosure is going to be a giant PITA to return, and HE would have to pay for shipping. I would tell them this package doesn't go well together at all, and that's horrible that they put this together. That none of these pieces go together well.

Let say you keep the enclosure, since shipping that *****, and subs and an amp are easier to find something different. Here is WHAT THEY SHOULD HAVE INCLUDED. These are actually the right air space for that enclosure, and these are the right wattage for that amp. Being kicker, they should have the same mounting bolt pattern, and they will fit in that enclosure depth.

Comp RT 12" 4 Ohm Subwoofer | KICKER®

KICKER produces high-performance car audio, vehicle specific solutions, marine audio, home and personal audio, and power sports products since 1973.

www.kicker.com

Here is their listing for those speakers, from this seller.

Kicker 48CWRT124 12" 4-Ohm Dual 500(Watts RMS) Voice Coil Design Subwoofer-Black 713034019190 | eBay

Bass Blockers. Subwoofer Exception : Our warranty does not cover blown voice coils, or subwoofers that have been punctured. This is considered abuse by the manufacturer and is not covered under warranty.

www.ebay.com

For $183.96

Here are the ones in the package they just bought, that this same seller has for $99.90

Kicker 43C124 Comp C12 Sub 12" 150 Watt RMS 4-Ohm SVC Car Audio Subwoofer - New 744271343755 | eBay

Impedance: 4 Ohms SVC. - Amp & Sub Combos. - Empty Sub Boxes. Subwoofer Exception : Our warranty does not cover blown voice coils, or subwoofers that have been punctured. This is considered abuse by the manufacturer and is not covered under warranty.

www.ebay.com

The difference is $84.06 each, ($168.12 for 2). I hope you're still in the 14 day window. If you are here, is what I would tell them. This package is horrible and the speakers don't fit in this enclosure, and this amp is too much for these speakers. The Correct speakers would have been ^ (and give them the item numbers). I would tell them, I think this is their fault for a bad package (and it might have been an accident, were not trying to point fingers and get people mad, we're trying to make this better), and I want them to pay for the return shipping on your subs, you pay the $168.12 difference, and then they send those other subs that can handle the power and fit in that enclosure. I guarantee he will be much happier.

Depending on that LPF being able to be shut off, I might even return the amp. You can find one through them, if you are within their 14 day return window, and "try to work with them", otherwise again, this is their package, and they should know better. It really does look like they just piled a bunch of mismatched, outdated stock together, and it looked like a good price. (But I think I've even passed on this seller before because of their return policy).

 

[HardofWhoring]

Last, if this is for a 2007-2013 Silverado, /Sierra, the voltage is regulated by the ECU and designed to run at lower than average voltage (11v running is common). You might be setting the gain at 12v off, turning it on, and the voltage drops lower than 12v.

 

[metalheadjoe 10+ year member]

The chance of two brand new subs being junk is slim but possible. A common denominator is the enclosure.

You've already narrowed it down to the subs AND enclosure. Next step is to determine if it's subs OR enclosure. Don't rule anything out. It could be something as dumb as a screw bouncing around inside the box.

 

[Jimi77 5,000+ posts]

I'll echo what others have said:
1) Sounds like the amp is okay. I think that amp is fine for those subs.
2) Enclosure is way too small for those subs. IMHO those subs belong in 1.5cuft each, if not closer to 2cuft/sub. (High QTS & VAS). Those would be good subs for an infinite baffle set up, terrible subs for an under the seat enclosure with very little airspace. That enclosure (airspace) screams 10s to me.
3) Sounds like you isolated the problem to the subs/enclosure.

The lack of airspace might be the cause of the problem but it's hard to say. Check for air leaks. Make sure the subs are wired in phase. Try disconnecting one of the subs and see if the distortion goes away. Make sure the amp is set up properly. LPF set to ~100hz. SSF to off. Make sure the hi/low input is in the correct position. Turn bass boost to 0db and boost frequency to ~30-40hz. You can use that bass boost circuit to boost the low end that the box is certainly cutting off, but I'd keep it to ~3db and no more or he'll end up cooking his subs. Try removing the subs from the enclosure and playing them free air to see if the distortion is still present.

 

[Jimi77 5,000+ posts]

The amp has a low level and a high level input. RCAs are low level. So that button should be pushed in.

I don't see where we know if he's using high or low level inputs. RCAs on that amp are both the high and low level input.

That amp doesn't go with that sub either:

That subs frequency is 27-500hz. Yet that amps low pass filter, (which doesn't look like you can turn it off) is 40hz - 180hz. Even if you turn that low pass filter up as far as you can, to 180hz, you're still cutting off 2/3rds of the frequency for that sub.

The amp goes fine with the subs. Those subs would sound like dog shyt at anything above ~200hz and nobody plays their subs up to 180hz, so it's a non-issue. The amp is fine and capable of overpowering those subs.

The more I look at this package the more complete horse crap it is, they tried to bundle this together. Those 3 pieces don't go together, and any two of those pieces don't go together. Seriously this package is nonsense and he needs to return it, and come back and let us piece him together something.

The only issue with that package is they've paired subs that are suited for infinite baffle (High QTS & VAS) or large sealed enclosures with an enclosure with limited airspace.

 

[HardofWhoring]

Yeah it'll definitely overpower them (assuming that amp is going to make rated power).
300w RMS amp to subs that peak at 300, and require twice the airspace, OR...
400w RMS (@ 1ohm) to each sub that can take 500w and meet airspace requirements with the possibility of a better amp.

It'll work, but hifiSC should be ashamed of themselves for this package. This is what you put together when it's what you have left-over from all your past builds and don't want to buy any new equipment kind of, it'll work. To me it looks like it's 100% old stock they want to dump off on someone unsuspecting. This package is fishing for suckers that if it happens is usually by some chinese seller on amazon, not a large dealer like this.

We know it "will work", but if this is still within the return window, don't even try to tell me you would keep and run this setup as is. This isn't like OP('s neighbor) pieced this together and came up with this setup. I just know that hifi sound connection is a pretty large company, and TO ME, this complete BS from a company that should 100% know better than to be doing something like this.

I'm really just trying to give OP a better idea on what and why they need to call hifi sound connection out on this BS. I'm 100% serious I'm tempted to give the OP my phone number so we can conference call this and call em out on this, and try to make this better for someone young just trying to get started with their subwoofer setup. (This is a really shitty way to be welcomed to subwoofers).

 

[spokey9]

That harmony audio amp is solid and it'll make rated...I had a ha800.1 for a few months pushing 2 ab dx154's just fine

 

[HardofWhoring]

OP, I'm going to try to write this for you so that you can copy it to them. How I would word this to them. There are two bold sections you would replace with your info.


I recently bought a subwoofer package from you item: 402319906110, INVOICE NUMBER HERE . I tried installing it in my vehicle and it just doesn't sound right. I have had some help going over the specs from the equipment in the package, and I think there is a problem with this equipment working together.

The subwoofers you included in this package are the 2016 Kicker 43C124 Comp C12 Sub 12" 150 Watt RMS 4-Ohm SVC. These are rated at 150w RMS and require 1.25 cuft of airspace. ( https://www.kicker.com/app/manuals/subwoofers/comp/2016_Comp_Rev_F.pdf )

The amplifier is rated at 600W RMS @ 2ohms. (which is what these subs are rated for at peak).
The enclosure in that package is listed at .6 cu ft per sub (which is less than half of the minimum required sealed volume).

I believe this is the reason these subs do not sound good in this enclosure with this amplifier. I do not know if this was intentional or by accident, but I think the wrong subs might have been included with this listing. I got what I paid for and what was listed, but I think this was an error on your end, and hopefully not meant to be intentional. I have found a much better option, and hoping we can both compromise to get there.

The right subs would be the Kicker 48CWRT124 12" 4-Ohm Dual 500(Watts RMS) Voice Coil Design Subwoofer-Black, your listing, eBay item number:134177017807 for $183.96. These subwoofers minimum air requirement is .55 cu ft, which will work in that enclosure, and the power has a range on their website of 350 -500w RMS in a sealed enclosure. I could then use your amp to get 800w RMS @ 1ohm, sending 400w to each subwoofer. These subwoofers will fit, just like the others and I would like to exchange them.

You have what I think are the wrong subwoofers for this enclosure and amplifier listed under another auction for $99.90
(https://www.ebay.com/itm/1318051598...d=link&campid=5335951755&toolid=20001&mkevt=1 )
That is a price difference of $84.06 each ( x 2 = $168.12).

I think these are the wrong subwoofers for this package, and because of that, I would like to return them to you, and feel you should pay for the return shipping on those. I would then like to pay the price difference of $168.12 (+tax) for the (2)Kicker 48CWRT124 12" 4-Ohm Dual Subwoofers, which would be the correct subwoofers for this enclosure and this amp.

Could we fix it this way?
Thank you, and feel free to reply by email or call me at YOUR PHONE NUMBER HERE whichever is more convenient.

 

[jmbmichael]

Just to answer a few questions, we are using low level RCA inputs.
I know what speakers sound like that are not in the correct enclosure and this is not the issue. Whether the speaker is in the box or out of the box sitting to the side, as soon as the volume is turned up to 5 or 6 out of 50 and the subs barely have any sound coming out it sounds absolutely terrible. I don’t know that I’ve ever actually heard a blown speaker so I’m not sure if that’s what this sounds like or not. But like I said when we first turned everything on we had them gain turn all the way down and slowly turned it up until we started hearing sound and this is how it sounded so I don’t see how we could’ve blown them if that’s what we are hearing.

 

[audiobaun 5,000+ posts]

Just to answer a few questions, we are using low level RCA inputs.
I know what speakers sound like that are not in the correct enclosure and this is not the issue. Whether the speaker is in the box or out of the box sitting to the side, as soon as the volume is turned up to 5 or 6 out of 50 and the subs barely have any sound coming out it sounds absolutely terrible. I don’t know that I’ve ever actually heard a blown speaker so I’m not sure if that’s what this sounds like or not. But like I said when we first turned everything on we had them gain turn all the way down and slowly turned it up until we started hearing sound and this is how it sounded so I don’t see how we could’ve blown them if that’s what we are hearing.

Pull each sub and remove wiring from the subs and check each one with a DMM to see what Ohm value each reads to see if they are within the spec limitations. There is a you tube Vid to help you with how to use a DMM to check the coils on each sub. Check your subs.

 

[audiobaun 5,000+ posts]

 

[jmbmichael]

Both speakers read 4 ohms.