everyone likes papermaker

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

 

---------- Post added at 01:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:14 PM ----------

 

Oh I agree. I've never even thought about speaker design. I just use what works. Unless you got a big savings account it wouldn't matter anyway. Then you have to compete with every other weekly brand that pops up.

Plus you have to already have a established rep to go along with it.

trust me i'm more than aware of your reality.

 

[los33 10+ year member]

here is the initial email. this is the salesman. they got the basic design i wanted to get a order processed. i talked for about 2 weeks between the sales man and engineer through a chat app. as he started to model the driver i mad suggestions he modeled it and we made changes.
initially i wanted a 75mm coil with a 32mm top-plate but the after modeling the driver i decided that we could step up up the wire gauge on the coil still get meet the inductance but of course b/l would drop so we went with stronger magnets and a larger top-plate to bring the B/L up enough to compensate for the decreased L.

That it's self you just mentioned means you bought off the shelf parts.

They modeled and adapted your configuration to parts they already had available.

I've seen actual proto being modeled by new design and just to make one entire sub with a new design with off the shelf soft parts meaning a new designed motor.

It costed well over 5-8k just to design and create a test version.

That's not even a working test version as another has to be made to fix flaws off first test cut.

Either we have a different perception of proto subs or I'm just new to this.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

That it's self you just mentioned means you bought off the shelf parts.
They modeled and adapted your configuration to parts they already had available.

I've seen actual proto being modeled by new design and just to make one entire sub with a new design with off the shelf soft parts meaning a new designed motor.

It costed well over 5-8k just to design and create a test version.

That's not even a working test version as another has to be made to fix flaws off first test cut.

Either we have a different perception of proto subs or I'm just new to this.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

You don't have a clue.

Some people charge 3 to 5 k for a initial design.

A large build house can cut anything you need and wind any coil you need for around 1k.

Even a custom neo motor sub isn't 5 to 8 k.

They got ripped off. Don't believe me call a build house and ask.

The coil is custom would. The topplate and t yoke aren't standard on any platform you can order from them.

Call the yourself and see. .

Everything else is standard parts whish are fine no need for custom spiders. Although I do want a better basket the ti basket ***** for the cooling system im using which is again pretty much industry standard..

So what they did is used a program to model up the driver to try to get it close to production. Built a driver and then sent it to me. I made revisions and rebuilt the driver.

It wasn't anything stock about the motor it took two weeks to get tge coil and tge ******* because I had them modify it again. Lol

You say it's stock parts but I've yet to see a driver similar in build or spec.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

A topplate is just a metal with a thickness OD and ID.

When I say custom I don't mean exotic I mean I had a certain build philosophy in mind. Nothing they offered match so they agreeded to do something unique.

Its that simple. How ever you want to put it i dont care.

I wanted a long 4 layer coil to lower inductance and maximize thermal transfer from the higher surface area vs the typical much Smaller gap and shorter 8 layer coil.

I also wanted the to pay special attention to the inductance but by design the coil offers lower inductance.

Blah blah blah. Its not like any sub I know of.

It is handling my 3600 all day everyday unclipped and asking for more. It sounds better than alot of other woofers at any price point a build and can get loud enough to melt the wax clean out of your ears and its hard to breath(id say 143 or so) and its tuned to where it pretty flat so I can street beat it or cut te level and have a excellent sound to it.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

God I been through this too many times and these idiots refuse to understand I've done this for years testing differnt series design and build houses Parts selection parts.

If I had my own CNC mill I would be machine in my own parts unfortunately I don't have $300,000 to buy a lathe and mill.

Where are those custom drivers at? I'd like to see with costed 8k. Thats beyond retarded .

 

[los33 10+ year member]

You don't have a clue. Some people charge 3 to 5 k for a initial design.

A large build house can cut anything you need and wind any coil you need for around 1k.

Even a custom neo motor sub isn't 5 to 8 k.

They got ripped off. Don't believe me call a build house and ask.

The coil is custom would. The topplate and t yoke aren't standard on any platform you can order from them.

Call the yourself and see. .

Everything else is standard parts whish are fine no need for custom spiders. Although I do want a better basket the ti basket ***** for the cooling system im using which is again pretty much industry standard..

So what they did is used a program to model up the driver to try to get it close to production. Built a driver and then sent it to me. I made revisions and rebuilt the driver.

It wasn't anything stock about the motor it took two weeks to get tge coil and tge ******* because I had them modify it again. Lol

You say it's stock parts but I've yet to see a driver similar in build or spec.

A topplate is just a metal with a thickness OD and ID. When I say custom I don't mean exotic I mean I had a certain build philosophy in mind. Nothing they offered match so they agreeded to do something unique.

Its that simple. How ever you want to put it i dont care.

I wanted a long 4 layer coil to lower inductance and maximize thermal transfer from the higher surface area vs the typical much Smaller gap and shorter 8 layer coil.

I also wanted the to pay special attention to the inductance but by design the coil offers lower inductance.

Blah blah blah. Its not like any sub I know of.

It is handling my 3600 all day everyday unclipped and asking for more. It sounds better than alot of other woofers at any price point a build and can get loud enough to melt the wax clean out of your ears and its hard to breath(id say 143 or so) and its tuned to where it pretty flat so I can street beat it or cut te level and have a excellent sound to it.

God I been through this too many times and these idiots refuse to understand I've done this for years testing differnt series design and build houses Parts selection parts.If I had my own CNC mill I would be machine in my own parts unfortunately I don't have $300,000 to buy a lathe and mill.

Where are those custom drivers at? I'd like to see with costed 8k. Thats beyond retarded .

Lmao do you even know the process of getting the correct cuts for a model?

Then material it's self would cost nearly 600-700$.

Neo being much more expensive in chunks.

Also soft parts adapted to new motor builds don't magically create them self's based off how a cnc creates parts.

I don't care if it's a large build house or a small build house, unless you pick already available parts there is no way you will stay under 5k at any point.

Motors ALSO have readily available parts to put one together. All that is really needed is to process it thru a magnetizer which ups the cost for building a new motor not already magnetised.

If you went thru a design phase they designed it with getting as close as possible specs using readily available parts.

IA and sundown both have custom made motors, I can assure you Jacob didn't pay 1k for his motor..

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

That it's self you just mentioned means you bought off the shelf parts.
They modeled and adapted your configuration to parts they already had available.

I've seen actual proto being modeled by new design and just to make one entire sub with a new design with off the shelf soft parts meaning a new designed motor.

It costed well over 5-8k just to design and create a test version.

That's not even a working test version as another has to be made to fix flaws off first test cut.

Either we have a different perception of proto subs or I'm just new to this.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

how many woofers have you had built or built and modified and tested?

 

[los33 10+ year member]

how many woofers have you had built or built and modified and tested?

Have I claimed to have built or tested?

I just recently got trained by guys who run sub build houses out in japan, Korea, Nevada..

I now work with everything it takes to even create a sub. You can claim all day your a electrician, but end of day I am an actual machinist and work with this sh1t all day and have had a taste in seeing first hand of sub woofer production.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Lmao do you even know the process of getting the correct cuts for a model?
Then material it's self would cost nearly 600-700$.

Neo being much more expensive in chunks.

Also soft parts adapted to new motor builds don't magically create them self's based off how a cnc creates parts.

I don't care if it's a large build house or a small build house, unless you pick already available parts there is no way you will stay under 5k at any point.

Motors ALSO have readily available parts to put one together. All that is really needed is to process it thru a magnetizer which ups the cost for building a new motor not already magnetised.

If you went thru a design phase they designed it with getting as close as possible specs using readily available parts.

IA and sundown both have custom made motors, I can assure you Jacob didn't pay 1k for his motor..

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you must not understand. when you use a large build house that builds 1000s if not 10000 drivers a month its nothing to use pre order bulk steel and have it machined time permitting. I have several friends that do machining. Tooling subwoofer parts isn't extensive or time consuming.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Have I claimed to have built or tested?
I just recently got trained by guys who run sub build houses out in japan, Korea, Nevada..

I now work with everything it takes to even create a sub. You can claim all day your a electrician, but end of day I am an actual machinist and work with this sh1t all day and have had a taste in seeing first hand of sub woofer production.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

I know you are a machinist. i'm not a machinist but i've fixed cncs and have good friends that can turn a manual.

there is basically 3 stages heavy cutting/shaping, fine tooling and finishing. only really thing that take a wile is to cut the t-yoke and shape the tyoke. the top-plate is a simple bevel cut. without throwing specific prices unless you want something completely excotic and are being charge a design and build fee its not over 1k and this is a 90 pound woofer..

fyi im not an electrician Im a automation tech. its very very different..

 

[los33 10+ year member]

I know you are a machinist. i'm not a machinist but i've fixed cncs and have good friends that can turn a manual.there is basically 3 stages heavy cutting/shaping, fine tooling and finishing. only really thing that take a wile is to cut the t-yoke and shape the tyoke. the top-plate is a simple bevel cut. without throwing specific prices unless you want something completely excotic and are being charge a design and build fee its not over 1k and this is a 90 pound woofer..

fyi im not an electrician Im a automation tech. its very very different..

So again your basically throwing numbers from your guesses?

Carbide, tooling for Mills are not free. A new program or modified program is needed for new cnc adaptation cuts.

JUST for a top plate the process is

-Roughing

-Cutting/shaping (which takes 30mins to an hour)

-Fine tooling which requires depending by design drilling, then 8 round, 10 round or GB threading

-Skimming to smooth surface

-More drilling for poll/coil

Not to mention having to re-indicating when swapping from machines.

Grinding/smoothing corners/edges, threads.

Then Q/A for proper specs as even the slightest mistake will throw off specs.

IF it passes then it is ready to move on.

You really do not know the process and even a large build house will not waste 1k on that much work.

Sent from my Z970 using Tapatalk

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

So again your basically throwing numbers from your guesses?
Carbide, tooling for Mills are not free. A new program or modified program is needed for new cnc adaptation cuts.

JUST for a top plate the process is

-Roughing

-Cutting/shaping (which takes 30mins to an hour)

-Fine tooling which requires depending by design drilling, then 8 round, 10 round or GB threading

-Skimming to smooth surface

-More drilling for poll/coil

Not to mention having to re-indicating when swapping from machines.

Grinding/smoothing corners/edges, threads.

Then Q/A for proper specs as even the slightest mistake will throw off specs.

IF it passes then it is ready to move on.

You really do not know the process and even a large build house will not waste 1k on that much work.

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ok. well contact SJA JLD or an of the build houses. i've given contacts i've used feel free to contact them.

im telling you simple what ive been told and even a custom tooled motor i've never been quoted over 1k.

I don't have a problem discussing anything. I'm not bullshitting you. im telling you from experience.

I was told that the coil and motor on the donald trump i have i was told it would take around 2 weeks to build. i've posted parameters pics and videos. i showed you the original email. i can't tell you anything else except call have one built and test it. i've done the ground work. don't believe me get your hard dirty and have a few built.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

and i was throwing number around. i was told that there are basically 3 stages. if I am wrong fine. maybe he wasn't being detailed. of course you have a QA/QC on the parts but that's not very hard.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

matter FACT JLD doesn't offer a 10" diameter motor in a 3 inch coil. they are all tooled for 4" coils. do me a favor and ask. they will telll you it can be done but its going to cost more. the proptotype still didn't cost over 1k..

 

---------- Post added at 03:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------

 

JLD AUDIO - Car Audio, Pro Audio, Subwoofers, Speakers, Amplifiers,Power Cable,RCA Calbe,Wiring Kits

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

im saying. you have been warned. that's to everybody here that talks ****. once I get all my **** with the law sealed up ill be-able to have a life again. its not anybody's business but just know you where warned. I used to love to go to shows to meet people and compete. now i have 3 reason to go..i've been doing maintenance 3 days on 4 off 12 hour shifts. don't worry though. when the time is right ill be at every show unless i'm working or in jail.

what a life, care to elaborate in the thread designed specifically for you?