Egg Carton Foam Question

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

Same question I was going to ask......LOL

I'm really interested. It must be very odd hearing sound come from way outside your car like that. How stereo can exceed the limit of the furthermost speaker by a wide margin is some thing I need the hear. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

And if center stage is right in front of you, how do you aim the right side speakers so that that each side of the stage is equal in size?

If I sit in the first row on the right hand side of a concert I sure don't expect the band to get up and move in front of me. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

 

[James Bang 5,000+ posts]

If the artist is singing right in front of you, he sure is far off to the left of the stage, along with the drummer. So then the drums singer and a guitarist is on the left. The guitarist on the right is alllll by himself... poor guy, he must be lonely over there.

With time alignment, you can delay the left speakers as far as you want, but the speakers are still physically at the same place, so with left-biased cues in a song plays independent from the rest of the material (redundant, I know) the sound will NOT sound as far as you delayed the speakers to be.

Helotaxi, do yourself a favor and unsquish your stage away from the left and tell the singer and the drummer they belong centerstage... those silly guys.

You still have front row seats, you'll just be a little to the left when you're driving. But when you're parked, just turn your head the slightest to the right and you'll magically be in the in the middle.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

Where is the limit of the soundstage on a set of quality headphones? Seriously? I've never heard about anyone complaining about the narrow stage width with a set of phones. And actually my last setup that had T/A available, the left side did seem slightly wider than the pillars. Sitting in the middle is sitting in the middle. Think about is this way. It's possible to get proper staging in a narrower stage and the benefit to me is that I can be in the center of that stage. This is as opposed to having a stage width as wide as the car with me sitting at extreme audience-right.

We're talking a basic philosophical difference here guys. Its similar to the difference between "sound quality" and "pleasing." The location of center stage as defined by most of the SQ sanctioning bodies is one thing. What I prefer in my own car going down the highway is something else. I don't set my stuff up to their standards in this regard because I'm not building it for them. If they were a consideration, I'd have a preset for their listening pleasure. I'm not saying that mine is "right," for everyone but it's right for me.

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

Where is the limit of the soundstage on a set of quality headphones? Seriously? I've never heard about anyone complaining about the narrow stage width with a set of phones.

What's the stereo crosstalk on a pair of headphones? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

It's possible to get proper staging in a narrower stage and the benefit to me is that I can be in the center of that stage. This is as opposed to having a stage width as wide as the car with me sitting at extreme audience-right.

Fine. Is the sound compressed, though? What slopes do you use on the drivers to achieve this?

I'm not saying that mine is "right," for everyone but it's right for me.

Totally cool. I'm just genuinely interested in what your car sounds like because I don't think I could get mine to sound like yours if I tried. I'd have to go panned mono with some type of array on the dash.

 

[James Bang 5,000+ posts]

Figure out how far right and left your stage is. Centerstage is in the center of both sides.

If you like a left biased soundstage, then good for you.

 

[James Bang 5,000+ posts]

Let me try to put it in anoter way...

Spread your woman's legs. Where her feet/ankles are is where the left and right of the stage is. What you want to do is stick it right between her legs (center focus). If you're off to the left or right, you'll probably hit her thighs, but that's okay, because rubbing the inner thighs can arouse her, but dead center is where the spot is... for her and for you.

If you're very far off to where her feet/ankles are, then you're just ******* her toes or licking her ankles, which might get her going, but it'll do nothing for you... this is all assuming one leg isn't shorter than the other.

Lets say you want to raise your soundstage higher and ***** **** her. It'll be best if both her tits are the same size, then again, you want to sticking right in between...

Helotaxi, what you're doing is rubbing/poking her left thigh and caressing her left nipple. You might have a fetish for that, but it's not how she wants and needs it. Stop being selfish and give to her right.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Where is the limit of the soundstage on a set of quality headphones? Seriously?

Fox hit the nail on the head.

It's possible to get proper staging in a narrower stage and the benefit to me is that I can be in the center of that stage.
We're talking a basic philosophical difference here guys.

My comment wasn't meant to be condescending. But the above sentences already address my "concern". I was simply thinking that with moving the center to that far over, it would significantly narrow the soundstage. For you this is a beneficial trade-off.....more power to ya //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

Helotaxi, what you're doing is rubbing/poking her left thigh and caressing her left nipple. You might have a fetish for that, but it's not how she wants and needs it. Stop being selfish and give to her right.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Actually what you're suggesting is to hit it from the side. I'm happier with her not spreading as far, moving her right in front of me and hitting it in the middle.

 

[shaneb 10+ year member]

Wow, this should be stickied.

This is the most intelligent thread I have ever read on ca.com.

Okay, I think I have some misconceptions. I understood it so that the goal of staging and imaging would be so that the stage would be front and center of drivers seat, yes this would create a wider right stage and narrower left stage but would that not appeal to the driver best? unless you were attempting a two seat stage thus creating it to where the stage is as wide as both seats so that driver and passenger could enjoy.

Now I understand that helotaxi does it that way, because it's the best way for him to enjoy music by himself. But that is not how it is judged? The original idea of staging and imaging is to bring the stage across the whole dash of the car? thus creating the effect for both driver and passenger, and making it as though i owuld be sitting maybe 2 seats to the left, front row?

Whoa. This is fascinating.

Wait, i just reread my post, it makes it a super narrow stage the way helo is doing it...hmmm.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

I understood it so that the goal of staging and imaging would be so that the stage would be front and center of drivers seat,

No.

It's to be centered to the car itself, not the driver.

Unless you're helotaxi //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

unless you were attempting a two seat stage thus creating it to where the stage is as wide as both seats so that driver and passenger could enjoy.

The width and centering of the stage really has nothing to do with how many passengers the system was designed to please. You can create a soundstage that is centered on the car itself and wider than the car itself from the driver's seat that sounds like crap from the passenger side. Use of time alignment between left & right speakers will inherently create this effect.

Now I understand that helotaxi does it that way, because it's the best way for him to enjoy music by himself. But that is not how it is judged?

No.

The original idea of staging and imaging is to bring the stage across the whole dash of the car?

Centered on the dash and ideally extending beyond the A-pillars in width.

Again, unless you're helotaxi //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

thus creating the effect for both driver and passenger,

Again, the width and centering of the stage from one seat does not mean the opposing seat will experience identical soundstaging.

Time alignment is a perfect example of this. Time align the left and right drivers for the drivers seat, creating a centered (to the car) sound stage and the passenger side will image like crap.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

Yes, I'm just that ****ing special. Get used to it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[Horsemanwill 10+ year member]

shane was right this is one of the best reads in ca.com i've came across. and james i love your anologies lol

 

[Horsemanwill 10+ year member]

Well will that foam baffle work fine? Because using that I don't have to worry about the window being in the way.

DO not get the foam baffle thing they ****.

 

[donpisto 5,000+ posts]

Hello Pioneer, that's why auto-eqing blows. Thank you.

Can't it still be adjust with the imprint? Maybe I'm thinking of the H650, but that uses the imprint also. I could have sworn that along auto tuning you can manually fine tune it. Correct me if I'm wrong sine I was planning on going this route for my setup, otherwise, going with the aftermarket route and using the H701 will cost me about 1,500 (that's using the w200).

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

Not only does helotaxi like ram his unit into his old lady's thigh, but also likes to ignore my questions.!! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Seriously though, a lot of guys (including moi) hack the bejusus out of the sides of their car just to try and get equal path lengths and get the drivers as far away from their ears as possible. Competitors extend the rails on their seats to increase them even further. If you own a McLaren F1, you're golden but if you are always sitting front row to the left of the band (right in front of the lead guitar) you're trying to create a phantom image that is only as good as placement and aiming.

I can only imagine the "best" way to get the center of the stage to be in front of you (and mid-way between the outer boundaries) is either to add significant T/A to the entire right side of the car.....or.......move the right side speakers closer. If you did this, you'd have to make a box for your midrange and put it where passenger's feet would be and move your A pillar or sail panel-mounted tweeter over 3' and duct tape it to the top of the dash. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif

Different vectors for different folks, I guess.......