2 bastards dead keep it coming BUSH!!

[awalbert88 10+ year member]

Well, we know that NK has enough fuel rods to convert to plutionium for weapons. This is known because up until March, the IAEA had secured the site where those rods were located. They were to have been used in nuclear reactors, but converting them to weapons-grade plutionium is not a difficult process at all.

China wouldn't go to war with the US because they know it would be pointless. They would destroy us in a ground war, but we would attain air supremecy within a month (takes awhile for our forces to get into place, but once they do, lookout!). And the moment we have confirmation that Chinese forces are heading to battle on the side of NK, a series of tactical nukes would be launched to destroy China's handful of nuclear sites that are known. Heck, maybe just a few hundred cruise missiles would be used, but I imagine there are war plans involving first-strike tactical nuclear weapons in that scenario.

Although you may not be worried about NK developing and selling nukes, there is enough concern on the part of the general population in the US that most people would support a pre-emptive military strike in order to prevent NK from getting them.

As for the idea of China being able to defeat the US in a war... Well... there would be no victory for anyone, but China would suffer vastly greater damage. Even if they had enough missiles (and they don't) to destroy all our major cities, they couldn't prevent our counterattack. Most of our nuclear weapons are sub-based, and we always have at least two subs patrolling with live nuclear weapons on board. Just one of those subs has enough firepower to turn China into a radioactive wasteland, and they know it. Military confrontation is out of the question for China. It's simply MAD.

 

[paikiah 5,000+ posts]

As for the idea of China being able to defeat the US in a war... Well... there would be no victory for anyone, but China would suffer vastly greater damage.

you know Albert, most of the time I agree, except for the quote above...

what can measure damage? Think about it... the center of China is a great big desert. Even if you wiped some cities, it can't possibly compare to damage in a metropolitan city of the US, in terms of economic influence and overall cost of actual damage.

Blow the center of China, what happens? Chances are, no one will hear it. Blow the center of the US, Kansas goes back to the Wizard of Oz.

I have to agree, US going to war with China would produce no good results for anyone. Should both superpowers go at it, the whole world's economy would collapse. End of the civilised world as we know it.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

there's a slight err to what you said. China's harad at work, trying to bring down capitalism, if you didn' t know. China doesn't care much about fighting anymore. They are smart, knowing money is ultimate power, and China's got land,the people as well as the resources to do this. However, they are also intelligent enough to make progress one at a time. Opening flood gates to open up to the western world has been proven (like you said, by history books) to be destructive. Don't want 1 billion over people going on a rampage.
Again, I don't believe I said impossible that the North has the weapons, simply that the chances of that happening are very very low. Even with terrorist fundings, it'll still not be enough to yield a nuclear lab large enough to complete a detonating device, much less acquire enough plutonium as it is. Of all people, China does not want the North to have more power than it already "thinks" it possess.

Judging from what you post, you get all your facts from the news. Please try to refer to information gathered by people who are somewhat closer and have more in-depth knowledge into the situation.

Hell, I dunno how the terrorists got into the planes to create the 911 tradegy, you don't know much about the situation here. I think you might believe we've got tanks that run around a war-fearing city even as we speak. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

Actually Sadams nuclear weapons facility was on its way to being useful. Terrorists do have money and are backed by some countries if you don't believe this it might be because you don't receive all the intelligence that the U.S. gathers. The leader of the nuclear development for Sadam talked about how nations like russia and France were willing to help Sadams nuclear development even though it was against UN rules. My point is where there is a will there is a way. You should realize being that you are in the military that economic power isn't everything, you must have a military to protect it. And though you may think china is being wise by increasing U.S. reliance on imported goods the U.S. is having a political effect in China. Land and companies are increasingly being sold off to the people from the government which overtime could weaken communism to the point of not existing in china. So yes both sides are playing economic games with each other but they are also developing a military. If you think being number 1 economically is all that matters to a nation I would say you are foolish, but hopefully you don't believe this. Morales and military have led to the fall of many nations. Remember though you may say I'm going by history. History is important afterall if you don't know it you can't prevent it from repeating.

Awalbert. Yes at this point you are correct but with cuts in military funding which I think clinton would have done along with getting rid of our nuclear weapons china would be able to hit our communications and the few nuclear launch facilities that were left before we would have time to react winning them the war. I'm speaking if clinton would have been in office and was able to accomplish these things in 8 years. I know some people would rather spend money on other things besides the military, and in a perfect world I would agree, but man is always greedy and for some reason people forget this.

My opinion with no. korea is that we should handle it prior to it getting out of hand and hopefully our government will know where this line is. There's a simple solution. Once we find evidence they have produced a nuclear weapon, we just bomb the plant.

 

[paikiah 5,000+ posts]

edit: triple post

 

[paikiah 5,000+ posts]

Actually Sadams nuclear weapons facility was on its way to being useful. Terrorists do have money and are backed by some countries if you don't believe this it might be because you don't receive all the intelligence that the U.S. gathers..

and you, my friend, have no idea how much it takes to produce nuclear devices. Please don't say you learnt it in school, uni, or some media quoted something. Movies don't do it justice.

Your itnelligence you gather on CNN, i watch and I laugh at it. Coverages in your part of the world, you guys cannot make up nor blow out of proportion, but towards tha Asian side, again, I still say you don't have a clue. You don't know what situation the North is in, you don't know what the defectors have as inside info, you only got your mass media to rely on. We work with the US military right here in Korea. US military presence aren't too obvious to the average person, but everyone knows it's there. Just so happens that I WOULD know more about certain things about certain situation here in Korea itself, being in the middle of it all, no?

If you think being number 1 economically is all that matters to a nation I would say you are foolish, but hopefully you don't believe this. Morales and military have led to the fall of many nations.

So if you say this, how do you explain your next line?

korea is that we should handle it prior to it getting out of hand and hopefully our government will know where this line is. There's a simple solution. Once we find evidence they have produced a nuclear weapon, we just bomb the plant.

Us decides when norht koreans die? Why? Cause the US is THE power. How? Military power? How can the military be so powerful? Ever recall something about the US spending the highest thatn any other country in the world with defence? That's money for you.

You've just contradicted yourself with previous threads, saying the US does not rule over the world. Then why in heavens would an american like you think about blowing up another country?

Where's the point of things getting out of hand? How will the US know?

If economic power is not everything, why does the former Soviet Union shiver when in the same room with Japan? Japan holds one of the largest key reserves around, money which the former USSR badly needs, but Japan constantly refuses, only viable option being to return the three islands that they allegedly took during world war 1. Does Japan have strong military presence? No, it's pathetic to sa the least. Japan is yet another country that needs the US military.

SO now you think the US military is in Korea AND in Japan..why? cause they wanna be there in case North Kroea acts up? No, Korea and Japan is one of the most strategic places on the Asian Pacific region to be. It's the warships that were stationed in Korea that went over to the gulf for the recent Afghanistan attacks.

Again, please don't try to act as if you know the region. I'll admit you know more about the US than I might, and I say you don't know jack about the real situation in this region.

Enough of this babble. I've argued with you on several occasions, and you've never admitted to the fact that you might be mistaken. Please feel free to speak out if you have reliable sources of info, and by that I do not mean the mass media. If you think they report everything that really happens, you're the foolish one. You won't be able to stomach everything that really happening here. If only you knew...

 

[paikiah 5,000+ posts]

Edit: pressed send way too many times.

 

[willll 10+ year member]

i think we should all just be prepared to die in the next 5 or so years, because it won't take much from either side to really **** things up. and those two dead guys look way different than the original pics. maybe it's just cause they're dead, or maybe it's more of that good ol' Bull Sh*t of America.

 

[er1kkull 10+ year member]

i hope some of all never have power in any governement, //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif yall talk like shooting a few nukes here and there would solve every problem in battle and war. that should be the last thing on the mind of any one in control of the military. i believe only die hard terrorist would ever think about using a nuke first.

they got beards they have shrapnel in there faces and yes giv a few hours and dead people look different at least the ones i have seen.

 

[willll 10+ year member]

yeah, i guess shrapnel will do that to ya'.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

and you, my friend, have no idea how much it takes to produce nuclear devices. Please don't say you learnt it in school, uni, or some media quoted something. Movies don't do it justice.Your itnelligence you gather on CNN, i watch and I laugh at it. Coverages in your part of the world, you guys cannot make up nor blow out of proportion, but towards tha Asian side, again, I still say you don't have a clue. You don't know what situation the North is in, you don't know what the defectors have as inside info, you only got your mass media to rely on. We work with the US military right here in Korea. US military presence aren't too obvious to the average person, but everyone knows it's there. Just so happens that I WOULD know more about certain things about certain situation here in Korea itself, being in the middle of it all, no?

So if you say this, how do you explain your next line?

Us decides when norht koreans die? Why? Cause the US is THE power. How? Military power? How can the military be so powerful? Ever recall something about the US spending the highest thatn any other country in the world with defence? That's money for you.

You've just contradicted yourself with previous threads, saying the US does not rule over the world. Then why in heavens would an american like you think about blowing up another country?

Where's the point of things getting out of hand? How will the US know?

If economic power is not everything, why does the former Soviet Union shiver when in the same room with Japan? Japan holds one of the largest key reserves around, money which the former USSR badly needs, but Japan constantly refuses, only viable option being to return the three islands that they allegedly took during world war 1. Does Japan have strong military presence? No, it's pathetic to sa the least. Japan is yet another country that needs the US military.

SO now you think the US military is in Korea AND in Japan..why? cause they wanna be there in case North Kroea acts up? No, Korea and Japan is one of the most strategic places on the Asian Pacific region to be. It's the warships that were stationed in Korea that went over to the gulf for the recent Afghanistan attacks.

Again, please don't try to act as if you know the region. I'll admit you know more about the US than I might, and I say you don't know jack about the real situation in this region.

Enough of this babble. I've argued with you on several occasions, and you've never admitted to the fact that you might be mistaken. Please feel free to speak out if you have reliable sources of info, and by that I do not mean the mass media. If you think they report everything that really happens, you're the foolish one. You won't be able to stomach everything that really happening here. If only you knew...

I don't know if you're talking about me contradicting myself because I haven't. The U.S. does spend more than any other nation on military. Military Like I said before is key. YOu can have economic power but if you don't have a military it means nothing. We were lucky Hitler didn't take over the world. He was close. Almost was capable of dropping a nuke on the U.S. Fortunately we got lucky in some war strategies. How did he do it? He stopped paying reparations and started building his military. And I don't wathc cnn. THey have a huge bias in their opinions. Like I stated before and as history has shown where there is a will there is a way. If Sadam was able to create nukes then so can No. korea. Where there is a will there is a way. September 11th. Where there is a will there is a way. THe U.S. must assume that No. Korea will create weapons if they sit on it too long it will get out of hand. What's funny is you say we blow things out of proportion when I have heard much the opposite. I have heard much of the dangers and things that happen globally don't hit U.S. news because of sensorship. But in Europe you hear all about it. AS for us being on Asia's case I feel we have every right to be. China and no. korea are clowns. You don't play around saying the U.S. better watch out because they have nuclear weapons capable of hitting major U.S. cities. And No. Korea now threatens saying that we better watch out because they have weapons. It appears they have brought this on themselves with their aggression towards the U.S. The U.S. isn't going around telling nations we are going to drop nukes on them.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

i hope some of all never have power in any governement, //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif yall talk like shooting a few nukes here and there would solve every problem in battle and war. that should be the last thing on the mind of any one in control of the military. i believe only die hard terrorist would ever think about using a nuke first. they got beards they have shrapnel in there faces and yes giv a few hours and dead people look different at least the ones i have seen.

If you're talking about me, you have misunderstood me. I never said we should use nukes. I said we should eliminate a nuclear facility if in fact it is being used to create nuclear weapons. No need to take over the country. Just bomb the facility and leave.

 

[willll 10+ year member]

just a thought, don't you need money to have an army? you can't develop nuclear weapons and feed troops and stuff without money. and i don't think hitler could have taken over the world without a pretty decent navy.

 

[paikiah 5,000+ posts]

if you think China is a clown, then you are more ignorant than thundertunes and one of your ex-VP's inability to spell potato correctly put together.

You've not been out of the country much, have you?

You don't watch the news, so it seems you stay glued to your history channel.

I rest my case, your source of info should improve before going any further with this discussion. Oh but that won't happen if you stay glued to the history channel, it's "oudated".

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

just a thought, don't you need money to have an army? you can't develop nuclear weapons and feed troops and stuff without money. and i don't think hitler could have taken over the world without a pretty decent navy.

One of the advantages to a communist nation is that the government controls what happens with the money the country has. It can create very few products for consumers to buy and use most of its money for military, it's up the the government. There are ways to make money. I never said that a military is everything. A country must be doing well economically and militarily. If you only have a strong economy then you have nothing to defend that economy. THis is my point.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

if you think China is a clown, then you are more ignorant than thundertunes and one of your ex-VP's inability to spell potato correctly put together.
You've not been out of the country much, have you?

You don't watch the news, so it seems you stay glued to your history channel.

I rest my case, your source of info should improve before going any further with this discussion. Oh but that won't happen if you stay glued to the history channel, it's "oudated".

That's an interesting philosophy. Without history you wouldn't be able to reflect on mistakes and prevent them from happening again. But you seem to feel history means nothing. All action that occurs presently and in the future will be a part of history. Without history much of what has been accomplished in the world wouldn't have been accomplished. Scientific testing is history. THey do an experiment and see the result. Then they look back at the steps and the process to try and find what caused the result. History is very powerful.