To the libs who believe obama's policies work

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

As for the 2000 Florida election thing, it showed a real character flaw in Al Gore. He only decided the electoral college was an unfair entity after it worked against him. If the roles had been reversed, you think he would have still demanded one recount after another, in strategic counties? Due to gerrymandering, I do not put much faith in the electoral college. But to only complain about it once it works against you is intellectual dishonesty.

 

[ahole-ic]

While I think you are both intelligent individuals, I think you've both been duped by our political machine. Polarizing the population allows our politicians, on both sides, to get away with far more radicalism than would otherwise be tolerated. The democratic machine convinces its base that republicans only care about raping the middle class to feed the upper class, while the republican machine convinces its base that democrats just want to give free hand-outs to everyone except the top 1%. The truth is both sides have bad apples, and both sides have good ones. The truth is both sides want to improve society, albeit from an opposite direction.
You are falling right into the game DC wants, everyone to hate everyone else who disagrees with them politically. With that hate comes fear. With the fear comes a solidifying effect of the political base, even as their own side makes poor and/or selfish choices.

It is your right to believe what you believe. There is a huge difference between hating people for believing a certain thing, and hating the philosophy they subscribe to. Everyone has a different level of interest and education on a subject. Because of that, they will arrive at different conclusions. There is no reason to hate them for that. That is why I have been much less insulting than I previously have been in this thread and the last. I KNOW I will not convince the lefties, but when they simply cannot support what they believe enough times, they will question what they believe. You and several others dislike the parties and the establishment.... but you do nothing to change it. Your message whether you mean it to be or not is "we are powerless, so you're wasting your time by fighting for what you believe in". My message is, yes the 2 party system is imperfect, but you can't facilitate change if you have no power to do so. So a 3rd party can't win, and we don't have the ability to get rid of the party system. So, since those are not options, a party with the closest core beliefs of your own must be selected and you must begin fighting to make that party as close to what you think it should be as possible.

 

[ahole-ic]

that's clearly a racist statement since more white people are on welfare then black, but I bet fox news doesn't tell u that

Tell me what in my statement wasn't factual and post proof of it. Show me what was racist. Again, you prove that you simply don't know what you're talking about.

 

[globalminds_ent 10+ year member]

Tell me what in my statement wasn't factual and post proof of it. Show me what was racist. Again, you prove that you simply don't know what you're talking about.

dude if u READ what I just wrote

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

It is your right to believe what you believe. There is a huge difference between hating people for believing a certain thing, and hating the philosophy they subscribe to. Everyone has a different level of interest and education on a subject. Because of that, they will arrive at different conclusions. There is no reason to hate them for that. That is why I have been much less insulting than I previously have been in this thread and the last. I KNOW I will not convince the lefties, but when they simply cannot support what they believe enough times, they will question what they believe. You and several others dislike the parties and the establishment.... but you do nothing to change it. Your message whether you mean it to be or not is "we are powerless, so you're wasting your time by fighting for what you believe in". My message is, yes the 2 party system is imperfect, but you can't facilitate change if you have no power to do so. So a 3rd party can't win, and we don't have the ability to get rid of the party system. So, since those are not options, a party with the closest core beliefs of your own must be selected and you must begin fighting to make that party as close to what you think it should be as possible.

I dont think I ever said "we are powerless, so you're wasting your time by fighting for what you believe in" or anything even close. Nor did I mention what I do, or do not do, to change the system. Those two ideas are merely you projecting what you want me to be thinking. Its okay, that's pretty common.

Now, as for what I DID say, I said that demonizing the other side only serves to allow both political sides to get away with far worse things than would otherwise be possible if the population wasn't so convinced the 'other side' would do even worse things. When Joe Sixpack says he thinks republicans are heartless elitists, or democrats are unfair socialists, that is one thing. But when our professional politicians, whom are educated and presumably intelligent people, say that sort of propaganda, in my eyes it is socially irresponsible, and completely inexcusable.

 

[ahole-ic]

dude if u READ what I just wrote

What you wrote didn't apply to what I said, AND I can prove wrong what you just said with statistics... so if you READ what I just said......

 

[ahole-ic]

I dont think I ever said "we are powerless, so you're wasting your time by fighting for what you believe in" or anything even close. Nor did I mention what I do, or do not do, to change the system. Those two ideas are merely you projecting what you want me to be thinking. Its okay, that's pretty common.
Now, as for what I DID say, I said that demonizing the other side only serves to allow both political sides to get away with far worse things than would otherwise be possible if the population wasn't so convinced the 'other side' would do even worse things. When Joe Sixpack says he thinks republicans are heartless elitists, or democrats are unfair socialists, that is one thing. But when our professional politicians, whom are educated and presumably intelligent people, say that sort of propaganda, in my eyes it is socially irresponsible, and completely inexcusable.

I'm basing it not only off of what you said but what you've said in the past. You always sort of look down your nose at people who choose a side and stick to it as though it is somehow intellectually inferior. That is ok, it's your choice to do so. I was just explaining why I disagree. I would agree though, that it is wrong for people in a position of authority and/or "higher learning" to give biased representation of facts.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

I'm basing it not only off of what you said but what you've said in the past. You always sort of look down your nose at people who choose a side and stick to it as though it is somehow intellectually inferior. That is ok, it's your choice to do so. I was just explaining why I disagree. I would agree though, that it is wrong for people in a position of authority and/or "higher learning" to give biased representation of facts.

Its almost as if you haven't read anything I wrote here, merely saw my name and started replying to whatever you thought I was going to say. I have never said 'dont bother'. What I have always said, in fact, is to bother. And I do not look down my nose at people chose a side and stick to it. Did I say you have been duped for choosing a side and sticking to it? No, I said you are being duped by believing the political propaganda that the 'other side' is so radical as to lack the morality to be reasonable. The notion that the other side "doesn't care about anyone".

 

[bubbagumper6 5,000+ posts]

Bro, you could have been on your plan until you were 25 all along. He extended it two years longer. And I'm stoked you like it. Because the rest of us got a rate incrase that actually pays for your ass. Socialism at it's finest. Get a job bro.

No, the way I understand it previous to that bill you had to be a full time student in order to stay on your parents plan, which I have been since I graduated high school, I was just concerned because my last semester (the current one) I only need 7 credit hours so I'm not considered a full time student. So before the law, I would not be able to still be on their insurance, but now I can. I don't really give a flying fuck if you had to pay more though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[ahole-ic]

Its almost as if you haven't read anything I wrote here, merely saw my name and started replying to whatever you thought I was going to say. I have never said 'dont bother'. What I have always said, in fact, is to bother. And I do not look down my nose at people chose a side and stick to it. Did I say you have been duped for choosing a side and sticking to it? No, I said you are being duped by believing the political propaganda that the 'other side' is so radical as to lack the morality to be reasonable. The notion that the other side "doesn't care about anyone".

Since my reply wasn't in the frame you wanted it to be, I must not have read. LOL. Look to me it's obvious. The democrats have had the war on poverty and the "great society" for DECADES and it has clearly made things worse. Any statistics relevant to the topic will show that, yet they want to double down. A logical, enlightened person as yourself has to ask himself... why? Another statistic that is difficult to ignore is the percentage of people receiving some form of welfare who also are registered democrats. That percentage is staggering. So, with democrats we see the more and more people on welfare because of their policies and more democrat voters. That doesn't seem like a very compassionate group of people there.

The only nuance I can think of to justify your comments is when you are confusing democrat voters with the democrat establishment. Clearly they have their constituency fooled into believing they are more caring and compassionate. So my comments are not regarding the voters. My comments are for the establishment. That may explain the disconnect and confusion.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Since my reply wasn't in the frame you wanted it to be, I must not have read. LOL. Look to me it's obvious. The democrats have had the war on poverty and the "great society" for DECADES and it has clearly made things worse. Any statistics relevant to the topic will show that, yet they want to double down. A logical, enlightened person as yourself has to ask himself... why? Another statistic that is difficult to ignore is the percentage of people receiving some form of welfare who also are registered democrats. That percentage is staggering. So, with democrats we see the more and more people on welfare because of their policies and more democrat voters. That doesn't seem like a very compassionate group of people there. The only nuance I can think of to justify your comments is when you are confusing democrat voters with the democrat establishment. Clearly they have their constituency fooled into believing they are more caring and compassionate. So my comments are not regarding the voters. My comments are for the establishment. That may explain the disconnect and confusion.

Yes, and its even more appalling when Democrats send buses to the projects on voting day, under the guise of just wanting to help the poor to get to the voting booth. Is that better or worse than republicans suggesting that once that democrat gets into power, he is going to reach into your pocketbook and steal your money to give to illegal immigrants? I dont know, that's an objective discussion I want no part of.

But again, when each side has decided the other side is satan's right-hand man, nothing good will come of it. Even when you address my point with an example, it implies only the democrats do it, which is obviously false. You seem so hell bent on proving democrats wrong, that you turn a blind eye to where republicans might be wrong as well.

Neither side is wholly wrong or right. In my opinion, the best solution is compromise. Its what gets us social programs that when looked at in a vacuum may appear to be socialism, but when looked at in context is something far short of pure socialism. Compromise is also the mechanism that gives us leniency in our society, and economic system, that allows the free-market force to propel itself. Its a lack of compromise that gets us arguing over every single piece of legislation ad nauseam, until the actual legislation produced is so watered down or dumbed down so as to render it virtually useless. Sound familiar?

 

[ahole-ic]

Yes, and its even more appalling when Democrats send buses to the projects on voting day, under the guise of just wanting to help the poor to get to the voting booth. Is that better or worse than republicans suggesting that once that democrat gets into power, he is going to reach into your pocketbook and steal your money to give to illegal immigrants? I dont know, that's an objective discussion I want no part of.
But again, when each side has decided the other side is satan's right-hand man, nothing good will come of it. Even when you address my point with an example, it implies only the democrats do it, which is obviously false. You seem so hell bent on proving democrats wrong, that you turn a blind eye to where republicans might be wrong as well.

Neither side is wholly wrong or right. In my opinion, the best solution is compromise. Its what gets us social programs that when looked at in a vacuum may appear to be socialism, but when looked at in context is something far short of pure socialism. Compromise is also the mechanism that gives us leniency in our society, and economic system, that allows the free-market force to propel itself. Its a lack of compromise that gets us arguing over every single piece of legislation ad nauseam, until the actual legislation produced is so watered down or dumbed down so as to render it virtually useless. Sound familiar?

I suppose that is where we disagree. I don't turn a blind eye to the Republicans. They are the lesser or two evils. I didn't want to insult your intelligence but I will do some more explaining since my last explanation obviously wasn't up to snuff. The parties are vehicles. Think of them as public vehicles. They are merely money funnels. You can't win a national election without being involved with one or the other. Each party has it's base. The Republicans happen to have Conservatives. Conservative is an ideology. It is a core set of beliefs that cannot be swayed or adjusted in any fashion. I am a Conservative. What I believe is that this is the best nation ever in existence on the earth. I believe our 2 founding documents are responsible for our quick and great success. In one of them, the Declaration of Indepedence, it states that each citizen of the land it is proclaiming as soverign has certain inalienable rights endowed by it's creator. Among those rights are LIFE, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. My core beliefs tell me that all people want to succeed and they will if given the opportunity. That opportunity is the government getting out of their way by seizing less taxes, by reducing restrictions, and by not oppressing them. It is my core belief that everything the democrats stand for is in opposition to these things (factually it is. Only an attorney "interpreting" language can spin it any other way.)

How can I compromise my core beliefs in the name of compromise for things like abortion? How can I compromise my core beliefs to allow higher taxes that oppress individuals restricting their ability to pursue happiness? How can I compromise my core beliefs to allow a welfare state that oppresses people by keeping them dependent on government rather than using their own skill and industry to thrive?

I believe we live in the land of opportunity and that if anyone wants it badly enough, and works hard enough success will be theirs. There is no room for compromise.

 

[Scratchy 10+ year member]

I believe our 2 founding documents are responsible for our quick and great success. In one of them, the Declaration of Indepedence, it states that each citizen of the land it is proclaiming as soverign has certain inalienable rights endowed by it's creator. Among those rights are LIFE, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. My core beliefs tell me that all people want to succeed and they will if given the opportunity..

I totally agree!

We are ALL created equal....and then Shyte upon from there!

If it weren't for all of the native Americans that we stole from, *****, and killed, Jeses could have had his own ranch, too!

Oh, and those pesky women, blacks, and landless serfs that didn't have the right to vote, if they weren't so uppity, this place would be a heaven on earth!

Hey, remember the last time there was a great depression?

It was because the gubment got in the way of the annoited robber barons, and let them FAIL!

Amen,brother!

 

[ahole-ic]

I totally agree!We are ALL created equal....and then Shyte upon from there!

If it weren't for all of the native Americans that we stole from, *****, and killed, Jeses could have had his own ranch, too!

This is a good example of how liberals are "blame America first" wackos. Forget the fact that we created the greatest and most successful country ever. Forget our humanitarian efforts throughout the world. Forget all of the technological, and health contributions etc that this country has come up with and bettered the world with. Forget all of that, and focus on a few people doing a few horrible things. THAT is what liberals do.

Oh, and those pesky women, blacks, and landless serfs that didn't have the right to vote, if they weren't so uppity, this place would be a heaven on earth!

Show me where in the founding documents it oppresses any of these groups.

Hey, remember the

At time there was a great depression?

It was because the gubment got in the way of the annotated robber barons, and let them FAIL!

Amen,brother!

You need to brush up on your history.... you think you know a lot, but every time you talk you prove that you don't have a clue. What caused the great depression? The Real Story

 

[Scratchy 10+ year member]

Wow, you are even tone deaf to sarcasm.

AND us history.

Must be the subwoofers.

Edit: a revisionist history site with Forex banner ads?

Really?

You are a funny little pigeon.