To any who claim that fatmat doesnt stick...

[andrew2944r 10+ year member]

And how it was applied...

About 98 - 100 degrees outside and 60%+ humidity, extremely sticky under those conditions.

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

After its on it sticks too much imo, almost impossible to remove sometimes. Its the initial hold that it sometimes has problems with. It will stay on for a short amount of time and start sagging and peeling off.

If you clean the surface well and use some spray adhesive it works fine. Either way its cheap deadener and doesnt work as well as its competitors. Plus its smelly.

 

[Jeepjones85 10+ year member]

I use fat mat, It worked good to me and stuck really well... I kinda messed up on one sheat

so I tried to peal it back off to reposition it...and let me tell you that wasn't happening lol

It is a great product for the money... Got mine from ebay for cheap

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

I have some in my car. I mean it works.........but you get what you pay for.

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

If you clean the surface well and use some spray adhesive it works fine. Either way its cheap deadener and doesnt work as well as its competitors. Plus its smelly.

No better way to completely negate a coupler than to put a decoupler in the way.

There's a direct relationship between effective damping and the semi-permanent bond (liquid-like state) of the damper to the vibrating object. The more vibration that's converted to heat, the better the damper.

Knowing this, on should easily pass the following pop quiz (yea, it's open book):

Can FatMat be an effective damper with the addition of spray glue?

Bonus question:

To what degree can any asphalt-based mat product be considered an effective damper? In other words, what is the dependent physical property inherent in the product that would allow it to be considered an effective damper and how much of it needs to be present?

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

No better way to completely negate a coupler than to put a decoupler in the way.

Ok.....

But does it not help to keep it on when it fails to stick?

I never had a problem with Raamat before. Took the extra precaution of cleaning all the surfaces I put the Fatmat on and at first it stuck fine. The only spot it came off was on the trunk lid. So.....I peeled some of it back and sprayed some spray adhesive in there, slapped it back and it hasnt fallen off again. Im not complaining. Better than removing it all together.

Next time Ill stick with SecondSkin or Raamat again.

KThx //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eek.gif.771b7a90cf45cabdc554ff1121c21c4a.gif

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

There's a direct relationship between effective damping and the semi-permanent bond (liquid-like state) of the damper to the vibrating object. The more vibration that's converted to heat, the better the damper.
Knowing this, on should easily pass the following pop quiz (yea, it's open book):

Can FatMat be an effective damper with the addition of spray glue?

Bonus question:

To what degree can any asphalt-based mat product be considered an effective damper? In other words, what is the dependent physical property inherent in the product that would allow it to be considered an effective damper and how much of it needs to be present?

I would argue that it would be more effective than nothing at all....though it would not be as effective compared to a good application out of the package.

The physical property I would think of would be mass......

edit- or temperature or viscoelasticity(sp?)

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

After its on it sticks too much imo, almost impossible to remove sometimes. Its the initial hold that it sometimes has problems with. It will stay on for a short amount of time and start sagging and peeling off.
If you clean the surface well and use some spray adhesive it works fine. Either way its cheap deadener and doesnt work as well as its competitors. Plus its smelly.

OooOops.....typo, I didnt mean to say initial hold, its the period after the initial hold it has problems with.

Stays on initially with a strong bond and after a while can fall off.

edit-FoxPro dont think Im trying to argue against your knowledge....we both know your more educated than me lol. But yes, I agree that spray adhesive should not be directly applied since it will hurt the ability for the product to 'dampen' but I dont see a problem with it if it falls off. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

But does it not help to keep it on when it fails to stick?

Of course it does.

With a constrained layer damper (like these class of structural damping products), you're sandwiching an adhesive which must maintain a semi-permanent VE bond over the life of the product. If that doesn't happen....due to failure.....and you spray glue it back, you DID NOT re-create an effective damper. What you did was glue something to a surface.

If effective structural damping really worked this way (gluing stuff to other stuff) then you could glue a number of products that exhibit some sort of elasticity to the surface. Not saying you cannot try and get away with it, only that you're trying to take a short cut.

Do you really think that if a whole batch of Damplifier Pro, for example, failed to adhere properly, that it would be ok if Ant sent out some cans of spray glue to fix the problem? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[Anthony Collova 10+ year member]

I laugh at you... Today i got the great fortune to replace my shattered window in my jeep. I had three layers of fatmat on it from two years ago. I applied the fatmat without any heat in about high 30's to low 40's temps... Two layers went onto my doors and they were sealed great!! well today i had to replace one that some crooks decided to smash... I am happy to report yet again. The fatmat had no issues at all with wanting to come free. In fact i fought with it for about 2 hours just to access the areas i needed. My hands are sore now and feel like i have been masterbaiting for 3 months straight. I will continue to use my ghetto deadener that has such a bad wrap but does such a good job...
enjoy your boner over priced deadener!!!

Sounds like you are a very angry person..

Here is the deal.

No one on this forum claims that fatmat fails 100% of the time.

I think you have mis judged the intention of those helpful individuals that try to educate less informed forum members.

The problems with fatmat are as follows:

1. It fails, some of the time.

This means you got lucky. Some people do, some don't. Your thread is overly confident about the product, but really, the confidence should be directed at your luck of the draw, not the quality of the product.

Just becuase you did not get cancer after 20 years of smoking does not give you the right to bash all the people that did.

2. Fatmat requires multiple layers to compare (decently) to any real constraint layer damper. Even if you do 3 layers of it, you still have a produc that is not elastomeric, has dimples and creases in the foil and is toxic.

3. By the time you take a chance at installing 3 layers of a foul smelling, toxic, non elastomeric roofing mat in your car, you spend just as much as if you bought one layer of a real vibration mat.

Time = money and you just lost out.

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

Of course it does.
With a constrained layer damper (like these class of structural damping products), you're sandwiching an adhesive which must maintain a semi-permanent VE bond over the life of the product. If that doesn't happen....due to failure.....and you spray glue it back, you DID NOT re-create an effective damper. What you did was glue something to a surface.

If effective structural damping really worked this way (gluing stuff to other stuff) then you could glue a number of products that exhibit some sort of elasticity to the surface. Not saying you cannot try and get away with it, only that you're trying to take a short cut.

Do you really think that if a whole batch of Damplifier Pro, for example, failed to adhere properly, that it would be ok if Ant sent out some cans of spray glue to fix the problem? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Lol I know, I understand what your saying //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

I would argue that it would be more effective than nothing at all....

Then why pay for it in the first place? Makes no logical sense. By your rationale, something > nothing. Ok, well then look around your garage or your house for anything sort of mailable and "rubbery" and glue it down.

though it would not be as effective compared to a good application out of the package.

But would it still be considered an effective damper?

The physical property I would think of would be mass......

No, that's actually an independent variable. More mass doesn't guarantee more damping. Good guess, though. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

edit- or temperature or viscoelasticity

Yessir. Temperature is a dependent variable in effective damping. A change in temperature elicits a change in damping performance with CLD products. The effect isn't linear, though if you graph it out.
Viscoelasticty is a dependent variable. A perfect damper offers a damping loss factor of 1. How effective it is depends on the degree to which the material converts vibration to heat.

Next question: is asphalt viscoelastic?

Why do I keep putting effective in italics?

 

[Ali1 10+ year member]

I laugh at you... Today i got the great fortune to replace my shattered window in my jeep. I had three layers of fatmat on it from two years ago. I applied the fatmat without any heat in about high 30's to low 40's temps... Two layers went onto my doors and they were sealed great!! well today i had to replace one that some crooks decided to smash... I am happy to report yet again. The fatmat had no issues at all with wanting to come free. In fact i fought with it for about 2 hours just to access the areas i needed. My hands are sore now and feel like i have been masterbaiting for 3 months straight. I will continue to use my ghetto deadener that has such a bad wrap but does such a good job...
enjoy your boner over priced deadener!!!

this worries me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif

 

[HypnoticCure 10+ year member]

Sounds like you are a very angry person..
Here is the deal.

No one on this forum claims that fatmat fails 100% of the time.

I think you have mis judged the intention of those helpful individuals that try to educate less informed forum members.

The problems with fatmat are as follows:

1. It fails, some of the time.

This means you got lucky. Some people do, some don't. Your thread is overly confident about the product, but really, the confidence should be directed at your luck of the draw, not the quality of the product.

Just becuase you did not get cancer after 20 years of smoking does not give you the right to bash all the people that did.

2. Fatmat requires multiple layers to compare (decently) to any real constraint layer damper. Even if you do 3 layers of it, you still have a produc that is not elastomeric, has dimples and creases in the foil and is toxic.

3. By the time you take a chance at installing 3 layers of a foul smelling, toxic, non elastomeric roofing mat in your car, you spend just as much as if you bought one layer of a real vibration mat.

Time = money and you just lost out.

Not angry at all, I find it funny that your prices are so out of line though and no one needs 3 layers to compete with your one layer. Go away sales person!!!!!! Shoo!!!

Also guess what!!! come out with a thinner product at a reasonable price and maybe more people will buy yours so that you dont have to come into random threads and try to trash companies that are just better priced then yours is.

I will admit i did enjoy the whole "use fatmat get cancer" type approach that you used!!

pst... im happy with my cheap fatmat that doesnt work but seems to do wonders for so many people.

 

[MikeyB 5,000+ posts]

Then why pay for it in the first place? Makes no logical sense. By your rationale, something > nothing. Ok, well then look around your garage or your house for anything sort of mailable and "rubbery" and glue it down.
But would it still be considered an effective damper?

Next question: is asphalt viscoelastic?

Why do I keep putting effective in italics?

You know what I mean //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

No it would not be effective

Yes it is, but it sucks.