Speakers w/o subwoofer?

[caustik_bt]

ive done an install on a 95 Saturn SL and if the speaker mounting is the same for 96.. get ready for a fun time.

Fortunately I belive they are not the same, as the models changed from 95 to 96, my car is the first year of the 'new' model.

Ok, so what I'm thinking of doing is... getting 4 of those Phoenix Gold RSd 6.5 Coax's (cuz I found out the rsd comps are $130), and getting baffles for them. But that leaves me with mounting. The factory speakers are 6 3/4", and from what reviews on crutchfield say, the adapter "designed" for my car kinda sucks donkey ****. What is the best way to adapt the 6 1/2"s to the 6 3/4"s? I'm not afraid to go to home depot and fabricate my own adapters, but I'd rather spare the work.

 

[DaveDSMer 10+ year member]

like i said make some 1/4" masonite rings. make a cardboard cutout of what you need then cut the masonite with a jigsaw to match it. I like to either use a layer of deadener or some non hardening modeling clay to go between the ring and the door. Secure it all on there and you got yourself a nice mounting location.

 

[Hintzyboy 5,000+ posts]

Care to prove that?
//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

And there are people out there that are perfectly happy with stock systems...doesn't make striving for more any less worthy of a goal //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

On the first remark, I know most good comonent sets can play bass to a certain extent, but for really good performance in the lower ranges (sub-100Hz) a subwoofer is pretty much necessary IMO. For a lot of people, the subwoofer is the first upgrade over the stock system. If a company assumes that people who puy their component speakers have already bought subwoofers, why would they spend extra time making the comps capable of playing very far into the subbass range? Hell even most of the higher-end comps I've looked at only play down to around 50 Hz according to the spec sheet. I can't prove what's on the mind of the people who run the audio companies. Just an observation I've made based on what I've seen and what I've read in a few audio mags.

On the second part, I never said that it would be a bad idea or waste of time to amp and deaden the REVs. ///M5 replied to my suggestion of the REVs in a way that I though implied that it was a bad idea to run the REVs on HU power (another suggestion he made in the post he responded to). I would never discourage someone from amping or deadening speakers. But the OP doesn't appear to want to buy an amp, and looks to be a beginner. So I simply suggested a solution that would fit his budget and that I believed would require minimal installation hassle for him based on the many reviews and suggestions I've seen for the REVs.

 

[///M5 10+ year member]

Honestly dude, do you search out my responses and try to refute them? I personally have not run the REVs, but there are several reviews on them and members much more knowledgeable than I have suggested them for just this situation. From the looks of the Original Post, the kid does not want to get an amp. There are several people on here who run REVs off of HU power with minimal deadening that are perfectly happy.
It sure would be nice if you would suggest something instead of saying or implying that everyone else is wrong, I honestly don't think I've seen you post anything but negative comments toward other people's responses. I'm not trying to be a prick or anything, just pointing out what I see.

Actually I don't search you out at all, but you post out your *** all of the time. There is nothing that drives me nuts more than people giving out wrong information or E-gurgitating. I do offer a lot of help regularly, but in particular this site has to many jackalopes that offer advice that don't know what they are talking about. Just because you have read something doesn't mean that you should reiterate it. Currently I don't believe that you can tell the difference between bad and good advice and keep posting. Your posts piss me off therefore I call you out. Stop being an E-boner and I will leave you alone. IMO you have no right recommending something you haven't tried or have no personal experience with. On top of that in a hobby where install is everything, comparing things on a sound board or in a bad installation isn't a valid comparison so don't use that either.

To the OP, sorry to diverge but it was a necessary response as I don't want you to be misled. What you should do is take a little bit of advice from this thread and go listen to the different speakers installed in vehicles at stores that sell what is recommended here. Then pick the ones you like best.

 

[///M5 10+ year member]

On the first remark, I know most good comonent sets can play bass to a certain extent, but for really good performance in the lower ranges (sub-100Hz) a subwoofer is pretty much necessary IMO. For a lot of people, the subwoofer is the first upgrade over the stock system. If a company assumes that people who puy their component speakers have already bought subwoofers, why would they spend extra time making the comps capable of playing very far into the subbass range? Hell even most of the higher-end comps I've looked at only play down to around 50 Hz according to the spec sheet. I can't prove what's on the mind of the people who run the audio companies. Just an observation I've made based on what I've seen and what I've read in a few audio mags.
On the second part, I never said that it would be a bad idea or waste of time to amp and deaden the REVs. ///M5 replied to my suggestion of the REVs in a way that I though implied that it was a bad idea to run the REVs on HU power (another suggestion he made in the post he responded to). I would never discourage someone from amping or deadening speakers. But the OP doesn't appear to want to buy an amp, and looks to be a beginner. So I simply suggested a solution that would fit his budget and that I believed would require minimal installation hassle for him based on the many reviews and suggestions I've seen for the REVs.

I am sorry that your installs are so poor that your mids can't play below 100hz. I would puke if I had to run my sub that high. The whole thing you are missing out on is that mid-bass >>> sub-bass.

 

[DaveDSMer 10+ year member]

caustik another idea would be to just get 6.75" speakers.. if you didnt want to deal with a bracket and all that.

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/cat_i35_6-3-4--speakers.html

 

[DejaWiz 5,000+ posts]

Anyway, I've got a '96 Saturn SL2 which has the most panzycrap OEM speakers I've ever heard.

You should've heard my MKIV GTI Monsoon system. Cruddy muddy midbass and the highs were just so-so. Imaging sucked somethin' fierce. They had no right to call that a "premium" sound system and charge what they did for it.

Anyway, I can infer that you might benefit from a setup something like the following:

4 Channel Amp

Front Comps run off CH 1+2 of amp

Sub run off CH 3+4 bridged of amp.

If you were thinking you might like to take this route, what would your top budget be for everything? I'm confident the members here can recommend you some very decent equipment no matter what the budget is. Keep in mind things like wiring, sub box, etc.

 

[Hintzyboy 5,000+ posts]

Actually I don't search you out at all, but you post out your *** all of the time. There is nothing that drives me nuts more than people giving out wrong information or E-gurgitating. I do offer a lot of help regularly, but in particular this site has to many jackalopes that offer advice that don't know what they are talking about. Just because you have read something doesn't mean that you should reiterate it. Currently I don't believe that you can tell the difference between bad and good advice and keep posting. Your posts piss me off therefore I call you out. Stop being an E-boner and I will leave you alone. IMO you have no right recommending something you haven't tried or have no personal experience with. On top of that in a hobby where install is everything, comparing things on a sound board or in a bad installation isn't a valid comparison so don't use that either.
To the OP, sorry to diverge but it was a necessary response as I don't want you to be misled. What you should do is take a little bit of advice from this thread and go listen to the different speakers installed in vehicles at stores that sell what is recommended here. Then pick the ones you like best.

First off, seeing as I am a college student and have to pay my own way, I have neither the time nor the money to try out every speaker out there in multiple installs. As a result, I rely on the information of those who are more knowledgeable than myself, and those who have had hands-on experience with different products. I don't understand why I shouldn't spread the information obtained by others. I am not posting out of my ***, simply passing on information. If you don't like that, I couldn't care less. I will not refrain from passing on good information just because I didn't obtain it myself. This is a forum, sharing info is what it was created for.

Second, I really don't see how you have "offer a lot of help regularly" when you have only posted ~300 times in the whole time you've been a member. That is a post every ~2 days, and I find it hard to believe that every post you've made contained invaluable advice.

Third, your suggestion of going to different shops and listening to installs of the stuff you're interested doesn't necessarily work. For a lot of people, there aren't many shops near by. The shops that are available are small shops that don't have much for demo cars. Plus, a lot of the products that are talked about down here aren't readily available in shops. Hell some of them are only available directly from the manufacturer. Sometimes we are forced to rely on information rather than hands-on experience.(By the way, this info HAS come from personal experience.)

Just jump off your high horse for a while and realize that you are not the only person in the world who knows anything.

 

[Hintzyboy 5,000+ posts]

I am sorry that your installs are so poor that your mids can't play below 100hz. I would puke if I had to run my sub that high. The whole thing you are missing out on is that mid-bass >>> sub-bass.

I am not saying that mids can't play that low. But they have a harder time playing those signals than those in the middle of the midrange. I doubt you'll find many speakers out there that can reproduce all audible frequencies accurately(hence the creation of subs, midbass woofers, midranges, and tweets). Like I said, even most high-end components are only spec'd to play to around 50 Hz or so. Common sense should tell you that the speakers will have a harder time reproducing frequencies that approach its limits.

 

[DejaWiz 5,000+ posts]

I have neither the time nor the money to try out every speaker out there in multiple installs. As a result, I rely on the information of those who are more knowledgeable than myself, and those who have had hands-on experience with different products. I don't understand why I shouldn't spread the information obtained by others. I am not posting out of my ***, simply passing on information. If you don't like that, I couldn't care less. I will not refrain from passing on good information just because I didn't obtain it myself. This is a forum, sharing info is what it was created for.

I'm going to have to agree with you on this one, Hintzy. Especially those that do possess the direct experience but choose to slander an opening post simply by replying with the words "just do a search". That really torques my hide. How about those that are guilty of that take 30 seconds out of your busy holier-than-thou lives and give the person some real help already. We are all noobs at one point in life and have to ask in order to learn. Don't ever forget that.

forum

noun

1. a public meeting or assembly for open discussion

 

[Hintzyboy 5,000+ posts]

I'm going to have to agree with you on this one, Hintzy. Especially those that do possess the direct experience but choose to slander an opening post simply by replying with the words "just do a search". That really torques my hide. Take 30 seconds out of your busy holier-than-thou life and give the person some real help already.

Thanks Deja.

 

[DejaWiz 5,000+ posts]

Where might I find said setup? Crutchfield is offering $300 for the amp and $130 for the sub alone, not to mention I would need cables and a box.
Or am I correct in getting the impression that Crutchfield is only where the n00bs shop? (Which of course what I am as far as car audio goes)

SonicElectronix is a decent place to buy from. I've never had a problem and their Tech Support is pretty decent for the most part. Check sounddomain.com as well. Hint - Both SE and SD will price match competitors (shipping fees factored).

Sub - $90

AMP -

Any decent amp that will make 500-700W RMS at 2 Ohms.

Xenon X600.1 or Kicker KX600.1 Amp would be my choice picks- est about $200-250...search the FS Subforum or eBay

Sub Box - est $20-50, depending on vendor.

Buy a sheet of 3/4" MDF from a lumber yard/home improvement store and make one yourself (if you have the means and the tools to do so).

-Sealed - You'll only need about 0.5-0.75cf volume.

-Ported - You'll need 1.0-2.0cf volume (plus the port volume).

Wiring -

Check out www.knukonceptz.com figure about $75-100 max.

I'd really recommend getting some comps up front and running a 2CH amp as well.

 

[Hintzyboy 5,000+ posts]

SonicElectronix is a decent place to buy from. I've never had a problem and their Tech Support is pretty decent for the most part. Check sounddomain.com as well. Hint - Both SE and SD will price match competitors (shipping fees factored).
Sub - $90

AMP -

Any decent amp that will make 500-700W RMS at 2 Ohms.

Xenon X600.1 or Kicker KX600.1 Amp would be my choice picks- est about $200-250...search the FS Subforum or eBay

Sub Box - est $20-50, depending on vendor.

Buy a sheet of 3/4" MDF from a lumber yard/home improvement store and make one yourself (if you have the means and the tools to do so).

-Sealed - You'll only need about 0.5-0.75cf volume.

-Ported - You'll need 1.0-2.0cf volume (plus the port volume).

Wiring -

Check out www.knukonceptz.com figure about $75-100 max.

I'd really recommend getting some comps up front and running a 2CH amp as well.

This setup would work very nicely for you. FYI, check HERE for a bunch of plans for ported boxes.

And if you do decied to get some comps, I can hook you up with a nice used amp at a good price if you're interested.

 

[///M5 10+ year member]

First off, seeing as I am a college student and have to pay my own way, I have neither the time nor the money to try out every speaker out there in multiple installs. As a result, I rely on the information of those who are more knowledgeable than myself, and those who have had hands-on experience with different products. I don't understand why I shouldn't spread the information obtained by others. I am not posting out of my ***, simply passing on information. If you don't like that, I couldn't care less. I will not refrain from passing on good information just because I didn't obtain it myself. This is a forum, sharing info is what it was created for.
Second, I really don't see how you have "offer a lot of help regularly" when you have only posted ~300 times in the whole time you've been a member. That is a post every ~2 days, and I find it hard to believe that every post you've made contained invaluable advice.

Third, your suggestion of going to different shops and listening to installs of the stuff you're interested doesn't necessarily work. For a lot of people, there aren't many shops near by. The shops that are available are small shops that don't have much for demo cars. Plus, a lot of the products that are talked about down here aren't readily available in shops. Hell some of them are only available directly from the manufacturer. Sometimes we are forced to rely on information rather than hands-on experience.(By the way, this info HAS come from personal experience.)

Just jump off your high horse for a while and realize that you are not the only person in the world who knows anything.

You are a tool, stop repeating stuff from people you only think you know. If you want to ask around about my post count being low it is for a different reason, not that I don't help people. I definitely wouldn't call e-gurgitation helping people. You offer advice on something you have no clue about and expect that it is okay because someone you think you know that knows more than you said it, but you don't really know that they know more than you. I would say BS you don't know chit about what you are repeating. People like you are the reason boners on chit that sucks happen. You aren't being helpful, but are the reason that more audio educated people avoid this board and spend time on others. Considering the traffic here I think that sucks.

 

[///M5 10+ year member]

I am not saying that mids can't play that low. But they have a harder time playing those signals than those in the middle of the midrange. I doubt you'll find many speakers out there that can reproduce all audible frequencies accurately(hence the creation of subs, midbass woofers, midranges, and tweets). Like I said, even most high-end components are only spec'd to play to around 50 Hz or so. Common sense should tell you that the speakers will have a harder time reproducing frequencies that approach its limits.

Huge difference between 50 & 100hz, but either way you are just reinforcing my opinion of you.