Speakers Clipping

[Squilly3]

I have a pretty high end car audio system I got installed by Geek Squad a few months ago (my first mistake) but it's been having an issue ever since I got it all installed. First, my equipment:

Pioneer AVIC-8000NEX

JL Audio 10w3v3-2 subwoofer

Front: Infinity Kappa Perfect 6.1 component speakers

Rear: Infinity Kappa 693.11i coaxials

4 gauge amp kit for the speakers, 8 gauge for the sub, both made by Stinger

Amps: 500w Alpine MRX-M55 (for sub)

550w Alpine PDR-F50 (for speakers)

So both have more than enough power.

Now for the issue: in the rear, there's a 'pop' then a "click" immediately after that. It typically happens when I'm driving, not while stopped (rarely it does occur while stopped). Other times, the speakers completely cut out, subwoofer still plays but all four speakers stop for a couple seconds then turn back on. Has happened many times, but amp has only gone into protect mode once. Leads me to believe the head unit preouts are bad. Did troubleshooting, got an auxiliary to RCA cable yesterday, took out the current RCA cables that connect directly to the head unit and played directly through my phone. I got the "pop" and "click" when NOTHING was playing through my phone or on the radio which is very strange. So is it an amplifier issue? So many issues I'm facing and I don't know where it's coming from. Thanks in advance guys.

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[Jepalan]

My gut tells me it is a shorted speaker wire on one of the amp outputs. Or a cable somewhere is being pinched and shorting out on occasion - especially when vibrating under motion.

Trace everything out carefully and look for a short. If you paid good money for the Geek install, why not challenge them to find the short and fix it?

 

[Squilly3]

They say it's definitely not a wiring problem. It's also not like this is my first time going there, it's my 10th (no exaggeration). Paid about $700 in labor alone, it's quite sad. I've been tempted to take it somewhere else and get Best Buy to fork the cost.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

you've already proven the source is not an issue.

all it takes is for a single wire strand anywhere downstream from the amplifier to cause a slight short and thus send the amp into protect. the amp will turn off then turn back on and the system checks for an internal short then playback resumes. the short can be so slight that at low volumes (thus low output voltages) the amp plays fine for hours.

the most common source for a wiring problem is in the doors at the woofers. the speaker wires at the door woofer are always subject to both moisture and movement. the recommended steps for figuring out which speaker wire (if any) is the culprit is to disconnect them one at a time (meaning the corresponding speaker won't play). once you think you have the speaker singled out, remove it and redo the wiring with more zip ties than before to ensure it doesn't move again. the second most common source for a wiring problem is in the dash at connections made by the installer. some installers think crimp caps are safe but they are not. the only reliable connection is solder that is protected by heat shrink then protected again by wire loom. all wiring should be protected by loom for the entire routing - the wire insulation alone is not sufficient. wiring in the dash is usually compromised when the head unit is pushed back in - causing strain on the wiring connections and exposing some bare strands (that may not have made it into the connector).

BB won't pay someone else to fix an issue regardless of what another installer will find.

for them to say the wiring isn't a concern is proof they aren't competent. if they haven't replaced/loomed the wiring and soldered and loomed all connections then they cannot make the statement that the wiring isn't suspect. all wiring is susceptible to damage. if they challenge my statement, you can have them call me personally and i am happy to educate them on the topic. i've had plenty of experiences in the past 20 years fixing other installers work - and usually not the result of malicious intent but sloppy methods.

it certainly can be the amplifier. Alpine amps aren't that reliable anymore and i've had numerous problems with several models. but your issue is most commonly due to a very slight short (from either compromised wiring insulation or poor termination methods).

 

[Squilly3]

you've already proven the source is not an issue.
all it takes is for a single wire strand anywhere downstream from the amplifier to cause a slight short and thus send the amp into protect. the amp will turn off then turn back on and the system checks for an internal short then playback resumes. the short can be so slight that at low volumes (thus low output voltages) the amp plays fine for hours.

the most common source for a wiring problem is in the doors at the woofers. the speaker wires at the door woofer are always subject to both moisture and movement. the recommended steps for figuring out which speaker wire (if any) is the culprit is to disconnect them one at a time (meaning the corresponding speaker won't play). once you think you have the speaker singled out, remove it and redo the wiring with more zip ties than before to ensure it doesn't move again. the second most common source for a wiring problem is in the dash at connections made by the installer. some installers think crimp caps are safe but they are not. the only reliable connection is solder that is protected by heat shrink then protected again by wire loom. all wiring should be protected by loom for the entire routing - the wire insulation alone is not sufficient. wiring in the dash is usually compromised when the head unit is pushed back in - causing strain on the wiring connections and exposing some bare strands (that may not have made it into the connector).

BB won't pay someone else to fix an issue regardless of what another installer will find.

for them to say the wiring isn't a concern is proof they aren't competent. if they haven't replaced/loomed the wiring and soldered and loomed all connections then they cannot make the statement that the wiring isn't suspect. all wiring is susceptible to damage. if they challenge my statement, you can have them call me personally and i am happy to educate them on the topic. i've had plenty of experiences in the past 20 years fixing other installers work - and usually not the result of malicious intent but sloppy methods.

it certainly can be the amplifier. Alpine amps aren't that reliable anymore and i've had numerous problems with several models. but your issue is most commonly due to a very slight short (from either compromised wiring insulation or poor termination methods).

Thanks for the insight. BB continues to say that it has to be a hardware problem. Why wouldn't they cover it if I took it elsewhere to fix their mistake? I'm trying to prevent sending anything in for repair yet they can't find the problem. Most recently, they said they soldered all the connections in the back since before "ir was a mess". I haven't looked myself but it only seems that it got worse after they did that (happens more frequently). I'll reconnect the head unit today and disconnect individual speakers to see what happens. Three months ago, when I first took it to BB to get all my equipment installed, my car wouldn't start. Had to get towed to the nearest Nissan dealer and BB forked the cost. They said there were two inches of wire missing somewhere that prevented it from starting. I don't see why they wouldn't fork the cost of something that's been going on for many visits. Been more than tempted to contact the store manager.

Also, regarding the woofers: do you mean the terminals at the woofer box? They came loose once which I fixed, but I did mention that to BB. It's unrelated since it connects to a completely different amplifier that doesn't touch the speakers. So that seems fine (to me, obviously you know more than I do).

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

Once someone else tampers with a shop's installation you no longer have a leg to stand on to claim that it was the original installation that resulted in this faulty behavior. Do speak with the store manager. I'm surprised after 10 visits you haven't done so already. It can't hurt at this point.

 

[Jepalan]

In my car audio experience I've had three situations just like yours:

---

First one was caused by a stray strand of wire shorting the speaker output terminals on the amplifier.

Second one was caused by the push-on terminal on one of the door speakers lightly shorting against a piece of metal (due to a rough modification on my part when removing some sheet metal to make room for the aftermarket speakers).

Third one was caused by a speaker wire getting pinched in the rear seat folding mechanism and exposing the wire such that it would intermittently bump against metal and ground out.

---

If you want to fix this you are going to have to get your hands dirty and carefully examine the amplifier terminals, the speaker terminals (yes you will have to pull door panels and speakers out) and every inch of wire.

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

The only way you can unscrew yourself is to try and get a refund. Buy all the stuff online and do it yourself to be honest. Cannot trust these best buy quacks.

 

[Squilly3]

In my car audio experience I've had three situations just like yours:---

First one was caused by a stray strand of wire shorting the speaker output terminals on the amplifier.

Second one was caused by the push-on terminal on one of the door speakers lightly shorting against a piece of metal (due to a rough modification on my part when removing some sheet metal to make room for the aftermarket speakers).

Third one was caused by a speaker wire getting pinched in the rear seat folding mechanism and exposing the wire such that it would intermittently bump against metal and ground out.

---

If you want to fix this you are going to have to get your hands dirty and carefully examine the amplifier terminals, the speaker terminals (yes you will have to pull door panels and speakers out) and every inch of wire.

So there's absolutely no way the amplifier itself is faulty?

 

---------- Post added at 02:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:25 PM ----------

 

The only way you can unscrew yourself is to try and get a refund. Buy all the stuff online and do it yourself to be honest. Cannot trust these best buy quacks.

I would if I knew anything about installations, but I don't. Plus I like lifetime warranties.

 

[Squilly3]

I called Alpine, they're telling me it's definitely an amplifier issue (funny, before they told me it's definitely not an amplifier related issue). But now you guys are saying it's most likely a wiring issue :/

 

[Jepalan]

So there's absolutely no way the amplifier itself is faulty?

No. I didn't say that at all. I gave you three scenarios from my personal experience. Of course the amp could be bad, but if you aren't going to put in some work to isolate the problem yourself you are never going to know - and continued discussion is moot.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

Swap the amp and see what happens.

 

[Squilly3]

Swap the amp and see what happens.

That's the plan. New amp will be installed Friday.

 

[Squilly3]

Swapped the amp. Everything seems to be working fine now.