ok, a mechanics perspective on the BIG3

I 100% disagree with the keep the wire as short as possible. A proper ground is one that is as low a resistance on the return as possible. With todays unibody vehicles constructed of glued together sheet metal (with many impurities) and crappy spot welds, a proper ground is one that is as low as possible and verified with a meter. Electricity is an algebra equation, what you do to one side you must do to the other. Make the currect transfer as effecient as possible.

A good ground is not about the amount or size of metal used in the return, but the resistance through it from point a to point b. If you cannot get a good ground of low resistance, it is off to the battery you go. If the ground is low, then certainly a good short ground wire is more than adequate.

If your amp is struggling to get power, it is going to manifest itself in many different forms, a bad ground of high resistance manifests itself with many a blown power supply in the amp.

Most people look at the big 3 as a power wire upgrade, think of the reverse side to it based on the algebra equation and you will see how important the ground wire really is.

 
Ok i told my dad, next week we are going to install the new amp (orion 1200) and measure voltage while running everything including the sub amp. then upgrade the big 3 and measure voltage and see what it says. Hopefully it will change his mind about it then. thank you for all your help and the informative posts(most of you) and to help me better understand this stuff. I'll post a thread next week with pictures about it, maybe it will help other people understand also.
Cool, I'm interested in this venture myself. Post lots of pics,results and stuff.

I personally think that the "big 3" is worth the effort even though I have not done it myself yet. But I plan on it. Have not seen the results of one verses the other. No one around here knows/cares about car audio but me.

 
ok sorry you win, he is the greatest. Didnt know i was "trashing him" though.

show me where I 'edited' my post to say that. kthx

back to the big3

EDIT:

I dont know if this was mentioned or not, but, for how much the big3 kits out there cost, its worth a shot. Couldnt you measure the amperage off the alternator with a DMM?

 
You want to do some real good reading up on the big 3...do a search on CarSound.com forums...in the Richard Clark section...they've gotten into some good discussions on the subject...

 
its not to hard to understand what can move more water? a big pipe or a small pipe? anyway you cut it at least you have upgraded for the future. (not picking on your dad) but you should see what they use in db drags....they use solid bars of very heavy copper and a few of the extrem cars can have over 10,000 amps of draw...i know it seems illogical to use that as an example but these amps of today arent like the old stuff of even 8 years ago and we did the big 3 back then too

 
i dont understand the debate to thi. its a cheap upgrade that takes under 30 min that can get good results especially if you are over 1000 watts rms
Sometimes it takes quite a while longer than 30 minutes...Have you seen where the alternator is on a 2002-2005 Civic SI???!!! It was a pain in the ass man, and I work on them for a living!

 
i dont understand the debate to thi. its a cheap upgrade that takes under 30 min that can get good results especially if you are over 1000 watts rms

theres no debate on this. his father and him both agree it works, but the question at hand is HOW does it work.

more or less u have more passages for current to flow. u cant shove a basketball in a gardeb hose. but a golf ball down PVC is more freely. it works the same, fastest route to a given path is always the best.

 
why would they use solid bars? stranded wire can transfer more electricity... electrons only move on the surface of the wire. stranded wire = more surface area = more electrons
http://www.kinetikaudio.com/gallery/DB%20Drag%20Finals%202005/003.jpg

and only reason why they strand wire is so u can bend it. in a monster amp they use bars and very solid traces to carry the current. it would be much cheaper to do the wire jumpers but they dont.

 
alright mike, heres your awnser.

basically, the car from the factory is gruonded to support what the manufacturers PUT IN the car. say the alternator *CAN CREATE* 105 amps, that hardly means that it will ever need to. your car might take 60 amps at night with all the lights on, and short spikes of 90~100 amps when you crank, but adding another 30 amps (read: musical) draw to make it 90 amps constant is not what that electrical system was created to do, nor intended to do.

what you need to realize, is manufacturers dont like to spend money.

if you further dont believe us, install your stereo normally (do not run your ground back to the battery, please dont - its a huge waste of wire and time) and then play music\tones and turn all the lights on and the car, and note the voltage at the battery, AND at the amplifiers.

next, add a 0~4 guage ground at the battery to the chassis, and note the voltage again, i GUARANTEE you jump quite a bit when you add that new ground.

in fact, i DARE you to do that expierement.

 
heck on my pos i had a 6-8 ga wire from the alt to the battery lmao (was a factory jank coated wire) as soon as i replaced that all dimming stopped. voltage went up a few .10's redid the ground and got the full effect.

 
Also the Big three has a limited effect. It is a good thing to do, but when you are adding 1500+ watts in a honda with a stock 70 amp alt, adding the big three would be like trying to drain the pacific ocean with a drinking straw and bucket. Sometimes you just have to **** it up and get an HO alt.

 
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