hoss
5,000+ posts
imma genius. so **** it!
definitly gotta suggest a better battery, a second battery if you still need more. but before you go to a second battery try upgrading the big 3 wires under your hood, and/or getting bigger power wire. this should help.
if you want the best solution, look into a higher output alt.
stay away from caps, they are no good.
if you want the best solution, look into a higher output alt.
stay away from caps, they are no good.
80_Cutlass_mn
10+ year member
What needs to be here?
Your best solution is to get a bigger alternator for your car. Got to autozone, advance auto parts, anywhere like that and ask what the highest output alternator for your car is and what the stock output is. If the higher output alternator for your car is only a few amps higher like in my case, I can go from 100 to 105 from a place like advance or autozone, then its not gonna be worth it. You will more than likely have to find some sort of alternator shop around where you live and ask them if they can rewind it to a higher output. Or ask if they sell any higher output alts for your vehicle.
this was posted by geolemon on CAT
There are too many EXPENSIVE misconceptions about caps, IMO...
Or I should say "wiring needs"
Think of it this way...
An alternator can supply higher current levels when the car is running, but provides nothing when the car is off.
In addition, it puts a higher drag on your engine, which reduces your horsepower at the wheels and accelleration, it is expensive, and it might not even be avaliable for your car, depending on what car you have obviously. They are also tricky to shop for, because you don't want to end up with a "200 amp" alternator that in reality produces the same or lower output current at idle.
But obviously, the benefits are that a good one can produce more current any time the car is running, if you do fall into the category who needs this.
Realistically though, that's not the majority- there are a whole number of interesting factors to consider though, including not just the wattage of your amps, but your listening habits, the "duty cycle" of the bass that you are playing, recording levels, volume levels, and your batteries recharge/discharge rates and the "duty cycle" there, also...
A Battery is always connected, but not always used. When the car is off, obviously it is. Most of the time, the alternator can supply enough current at it's 14.4v level that everything gets it's juice from the alternator.
When more current is demanded though, for that instant, the extra current is drawn from the battery... when that happens, your electrical system temporarily drops to the 12v level of the battery... and since lights aren't as bright at 12v, you see them dim. This isn't a symptom of a problem, the electrical system is doing what it's supposed to. As long as the battery has enough time to recharge in between (it only needs to recharge the small amount of current that was drawn) - as long as the battery voltage is able to rise back to 12v each time, it's OK.
Adding a second battery, close coupled to the amp, will help things in several ways... the most important being that your main power wire is resistive, and the second battery will essentially eliminate that, speeding the response of the battery to current demands from the amp.
A capacitor is added because batteries are slow to give up charge, relatively speaking, and are slow to recharge, where capacitors are nearly instantanious.
Think of it like eliminating a speed bump in the road.
Your amp demands current, to really slam a huge instantanious explosion or bass drum... in that instant, it exceeds the current capability of your alternator, so it must draw the extra current from the battery... the battery is like Droopy Dog.. it's saying "Ooooohhh... kaaaayyyy... heeeeeerrreeeesss yooouuurrr currreeeennnntttt", and finally the amp gets the current. But there is a rise time involved. Granted it is tiny, but here's where the lightning fast capacitor can help out. It gets rid of that speed bump. While waiting for Droopy Dog, your capacitor discharged for the amp.
Capacitors are also good, in scenarios where you have fast kick-drum type bass. They dont' help much at all on those long drone-tone extended bass tones like bass CD's, like sine waves, but that's fine... they don't hurt performance in those scenarios, either.
BTW... If you've ever seen Richard Clark's "proofs" for his argument that capacitors don't work, his plots involve an absolutely ridiculously long time scale on the X-axis... the plot's minimum resolution is something around 1 second for any given dot on the plot...
What I want to see is an ultra-fast plot, that's capable of capturing instantanious bursts at a resolution of at least microseconds.
And those "proofs" (I hate to call them that) are LARGELY the reason why you hear so much "caps don't work!" crying across forums...
There are too many EXPENSIVE misconceptions about caps, IMO...
Or I should say "wiring needs"
Think of it this way...
An alternator can supply higher current levels when the car is running, but provides nothing when the car is off.
In addition, it puts a higher drag on your engine, which reduces your horsepower at the wheels and accelleration, it is expensive, and it might not even be avaliable for your car, depending on what car you have obviously. They are also tricky to shop for, because you don't want to end up with a "200 amp" alternator that in reality produces the same or lower output current at idle.
But obviously, the benefits are that a good one can produce more current any time the car is running, if you do fall into the category who needs this.
Realistically though, that's not the majority- there are a whole number of interesting factors to consider though, including not just the wattage of your amps, but your listening habits, the "duty cycle" of the bass that you are playing, recording levels, volume levels, and your batteries recharge/discharge rates and the "duty cycle" there, also...
A Battery is always connected, but not always used. When the car is off, obviously it is. Most of the time, the alternator can supply enough current at it's 14.4v level that everything gets it's juice from the alternator.
When more current is demanded though, for that instant, the extra current is drawn from the battery... when that happens, your electrical system temporarily drops to the 12v level of the battery... and since lights aren't as bright at 12v, you see them dim. This isn't a symptom of a problem, the electrical system is doing what it's supposed to. As long as the battery has enough time to recharge in between (it only needs to recharge the small amount of current that was drawn) - as long as the battery voltage is able to rise back to 12v each time, it's OK.
Adding a second battery, close coupled to the amp, will help things in several ways... the most important being that your main power wire is resistive, and the second battery will essentially eliminate that, speeding the response of the battery to current demands from the amp.
A capacitor is added because batteries are slow to give up charge, relatively speaking, and are slow to recharge, where capacitors are nearly instantanious.
Think of it like eliminating a speed bump in the road.
Your amp demands current, to really slam a huge instantanious explosion or bass drum... in that instant, it exceeds the current capability of your alternator, so it must draw the extra current from the battery... the battery is like Droopy Dog.. it's saying "Ooooohhh... kaaaayyyy... heeeeeerrreeeesss yooouuurrr currreeeennnntttt", and finally the amp gets the current. But there is a rise time involved. Granted it is tiny, but here's where the lightning fast capacitor can help out. It gets rid of that speed bump. While waiting for Droopy Dog, your capacitor discharged for the amp.
Capacitors are also good, in scenarios where you have fast kick-drum type bass. They dont' help much at all on those long drone-tone extended bass tones like bass CD's, like sine waves, but that's fine... they don't hurt performance in those scenarios, either.
BTW... If you've ever seen Richard Clark's "proofs" for his argument that capacitors don't work, his plots involve an absolutely ridiculously long time scale on the X-axis... the plot's minimum resolution is something around 1 second for any given dot on the plot...
What I want to see is an ultra-fast plot, that's capable of capturing instantanious bursts at a resolution of at least microseconds.
And those "proofs" (I hate to call them that) are LARGELY the reason why you hear so much "caps don't work!" crying across forums...
tommyk90
5,000+ posts
THE WHOLE THING!!!
I don't know what to believe anymore. I'm just getting a new battery, upgrade the big 3, and go for a 180 amp alt. I want to avoid a cap because of all the things i hear about them and i don't have any room for one!
hoss
5,000+ posts
imma genius. so **** it!
//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/chicken.gif.218ea7401db50d5e31a7e0b37e05e21e.gif
phyphoestilic
5,000+ posts
Liquid Fire...
I will eat u!//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/yumyum.gif.0556df42231b304b9c995aefd13928a8.gif
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