just ordered 4 12"l7s(ported/sealed?

[Goldtaz1 10+ year member]

the largest i think i can make each port is prolly 4.5x11.5 unless i made one huge @$$ box an braaced it really good which i dont want to do because it would be a pain to install an all.

If you want HIGH numbers then you certainly can't be lazy!!! Do it right and the rewards will be evident.

 

[Polecat 5,000+ posts]

My opinions of Kicker's square shape is based on physics, not ignorance. Sorry.

and you and I know that 'history' proves the square can get really great SQ. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

http://www.prestigecustomsautosound.com/RatTruckPg_08_2003.htm

http://www.dynamat.com/gallery/GaryBiggs/

Mark Eldridge history

BIO/Results:

1996 CMAA Finals - Pro 1001+ National Champion

1997 MES Invitational - Invitational Round of 25 Champion

1997 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ SQ World Champion

1997 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ SQ+ World Champion

2000 USAC World Finals - Expert Best of Show

2000 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ World Champion

2000 USAC World Finals - Expert 601+ World Champion

2001 SISC (Perry, GA) - Invitational Round of 25 Champion

be sure to click on the bottom "Oh the help of others' //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

http://www.carsound.com/features/eldridge_evolution.html

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

and you and I know that 'history' proves the square can get really great SQ. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif
http://www.prestigecustomsautosound.com/RatTruckPg_08_2003.htm

http://www.dynamat.com/gallery/GaryBiggs/

Mark Eldridge history

BIO/Results:

1996 CMAA Finals - Pro 1001+ National Champion

1997 MES Invitational - Invitational Round of 25 Champion

1997 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ SQ World Champion

1997 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ SQ+ World Champion

2000 USAC World Finals - Expert Best of Show

2000 IASCA World Finals - Expert 601+ World Champion

2000 USAC World Finals - Expert 601+ World Champion

2001 SISC (Perry, GA) - Invitational Round of 25 Champion

be sure to click on the bottom "Oh the help of others' //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

http://www.carsound.com/features/eldridge_evolution.html

Oh come on, we've been down that road before Polecat. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif SQ comps test at very (relatively) low volume levels, where the issues with the square shape are minimal. Also, Ive never said the squares couldn't be placed in an install that makes them sound good, Ive simply said the square shape lends itself to added output at the expense of SQ (which is true... trophies or not). You know how I feel about this topic already. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

i bet those kicker vehicles he mentioned would get louder than you and still sound better

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

i bet those kicker vehicles he mentioned would get louder than you and still sound better

Probably. I cant yell worth a ****. Dont see your point though.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Oh and the day you learn what I even have for a system is the day I consider taking your opinions/comparisons of it seriously.

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

you made the comparisions and talk about comp systems like they arent that good. those very systems are without a doubt the best in the world. i have listened to many of those cars and many more street cars. i have heard alot of nice street cars but they still wouldnt hold a candle to the champion sq cars (i competed as well even at the big shows only one i didnt trophy at was finals due to technical difficulties. i had beaten 3 out of the top 5 that did trophy earlier that season). i have owned many "top of the line hard to get ahold of" amps speakers and mods. so i'm no newb either. my firebird would do a 149.9 in max spl (audio control) but to keep the same rta curve it would only do a 142 and stay linear..after that horns and subs would start drowning out my mid basses. not too bad for a 100 watt car huh?

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

you made the comparisions and talk about comp systems like they arent that good. those very systems are without a doubt the best in the world. i have listened to many of those cars and many more street cars. i have heard alot of nice street cars but they still wouldnt hold a candle to the champion sq cars (i competed as well even at the big shows only one i didnt trophy at was finals due to technical difficulties. i had beaten 3 out of the top 5 that did trophy earlier that season). i have owned many "top of the line hard to get ahold of" amps speakers and mods. so i'm no newb either. my firebird would do a 149.9 in max spl (audio control) but to keep the same rta curve it would only do a 142 and stay linear..after that horns and subs would start drowning out my mid basses. not too bad for a 100 watt car huh?

Not bad at all. You have a right to be proud. But not sure what that has to do with my opinion of the square subs.

Look Ive made my stance clear, square cones are meant for added output at the expense of SQ qualities. That issue has been done to death here, you're welcome to search for our old debates on it if you want. But Im not dissing any particular person's setup, nor am I 'flaming' the kicker subs, simply pointing out what I consider to be a fact (squares are less than ideal). I have no intentions of arguing with you or anyone else here about it. Certainly wont be dragged into some comparison of my system (which isnt even installed yet) and some world class SQ guy (lol) just because I said squares dont lend themselves to SQ.

 

[Polecat 5,000+ posts]

A woofer can 'tend' be be SQ, but if installed incorreclty, also can hamper output. If we really are speaking of SQ then, by all means, low volume it is...they still have proven then, as proven above. If true SQ is the goal in which you speak, then there you have it...proof done. Physics can say whatever, but if not installed properly, they sound like poop.

A sub is made to reproduce low frequencies.

I would always tend to look more at power, placement, and components used for 80% of the judging, well over subs anyday. As thye are what reproduces the vocals, midbass, etc.

But it really is mis-leading to say they are not 'meant' for SQ, or cannot have SQ, as others can do it with great success. It's all false accusations...any sub can sound bad...if done incorrectly...no matter what physics says.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

A woofer can 'tend' be be SQ, but if installed incorreclty, also can hamper output. If we really are speaking of SQ then, by all means, low volume it is...they still have proven then, as proven above. If true SQ is the goal in which you speak, then there you have it...proof done. Physics can say whatever, but if not installed properly, they sound like poop.A sub is made to reproduce low frequencies.

I would always tend to look more at power, placement, and components used for 80% of the judging, well over subs anyday. As thye are what reproduces the vocals, midbass, etc.

But it really is mis-leading to say they are not 'meant' for SQ, or cannot have SQ, as others can do it with great success. It's all false accusations...any sub can sound bad...if done incorrectly...no matter what physics says.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

First off, no offense taken (as usual...we've been here before //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif).

Second, I never said they could not have good SQ, I said their design lends itself towards added output, at the expense of SQ qualities. A cone whose shape dictates added weight in the form of stiffen ribs (for one example) is not the recipe for building a good 'SQ sub'. That's not to knock the L series, they have their niche, its just not the output monster AND SQ dream some peope want it to be. *shrug*

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Oh and the day you learn what I even have for a system is the day I consider taking your opinions/comparisons of it seriously.

Image Dynamic horns, RE XXX mids (though you also have IDQ8's and were going to run them 3-way with Audax PR170M0 midranges), and 2 15" RE XXX subs.

Close??

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Image Dynamic horns, RE XXX mids (though you also have IDQ8's and were going to run them 3-way with Audax PR170M0 midranges), and 2 15" RE XXX subs.
Close??

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

Are you stalking me? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Ive decided to do a wall btw. I dunno why, just because. I wont be the loudest guy around, but Im betting I'll beat alot of those "SQ" setups. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

yuh i know nothing about any of this stuff especially horns. still alot lot more to it than equiment and even more to it than install. alot more to get on that level the kicker pack rat won grand master at usac 2004 world finals that only has 6 15's and iirc the usac rules dont have a wall to stop spl at 135 at least at a big sping show in 2004 my old car finished 3rd doing 159 or a 161 in spl naturally gaining 20 points on everyone. but even then the "spl" portion has ziltch to do with sq as in most cases now all they do is hit a button and achieve a new setting (something my old set up didnt have the luxury of having). in sq those cars (especially at that level) all have little tricks done here and there that is VERY doubtful any would share. things i had done to my amps, x over, deck, noisegate and a few other odds and ends . thats the parts of the systems you wont dont see and never get talked about.

 

[Polecat 5,000+ posts]

First off, no offense taken (as usual...we've been here before //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif).Second, I never said they could not have good SQ, I said their design lends itself towards added output, at the expense of SQ qualities. A cone whose shape dictates added weight in the form of stiffen ribs (for one example) is not the recipe for building a good 'SQ sub'. That's not to knock the L series, they have their niche, its just not the output monster AND SQ dream some peope want it to be. *shrug*

may not be the 'recipe, but they work in both aspects...and in street applications SPL lane wise, it is one of the most used driver....so proven can have great output, without the Xmax being as high as others.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

may not be the 'recipe, but they work in both aspects...and in street applications SPL lane wise, it is one of the most used driver....so proven can have great output, without the Xmax being as high as others.

I have never commented on the L series output capabilities, Ive only been referring to the SQ qualities. Yes they have been in award winning setups. But a pro can make just about anything sound very good. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif My point all along has not been that L series subs dont have good output or cannot possibly sound good, nor has my point had anything to do with audiolife's knowledge of horns ( //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eyebrow.gif.fe2c18d8720fe8c7eaed347b21ea05a5.gif ). My point has been that the design lends itself to one aspect of speaker performance, at the expense of another (haven't I said this already? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif). So far as Im concerned those guys who build award winning SQ systems using kicker squares had their work cut out for them. My hats off to them. lol

yuh i know nothing about any of this stuff especially horns.

Did I ever make any comments about your knowledge of horns? WTF does that have to do with this thread? lol //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif Im not flaming you in this thread audiolife, slow your roll man.