good 4" mids?

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

Just an FYI: chances are good you'll need to lowpass them higher than 1khz. Not many tweeters can handle such a low xover point.....1500hz is pretty "rare" for a tweeter. Most (not all, but most) will like 2khz or higher at the lowest. Some may not even like 2500hz as an xover point.......just depend on the tweeter. But I seriously doubt you'd find a tweeter that would really enjoy or work well with a 1khz highpass; or atleast you wouldn't be able to crank it with that low of an xover point without major distortion/damage. A "general" rule of thumb for tweeter highpass frequency is atleast twice it's Fs. Mind you, this is dependent upon slope, etc.....but it's a good starting point and should give you a reference of generally what a good xover point for the tweet would be.

IMHO I'd start out trying the 4's @ ~300hz highpass with the slope as steep as possible, and gradually drop the xover point (with the volume at your loudest typical listening level) till you hear the 4" start to stress. Then whatever suits your needs for the lowpass...probably in the 2-2.5khz region.

I skimmed most of the thread....but did I read you have no real plans for a midbass? Yeah.....after re-reading; you definitely would not be wasting your time with a midbass even though you listen to rap. Hell; with rap the majority of the "bass" is actually in the midbass region //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif I remember that popular song by Drama about 5 years back (can't think of the name).....that song had tons of midbass content.

that's basically what i was asking was where to start to crossover the tweeter because i had no clue. i'll listen to the 4's and tweets and see if i need some midbass or not. would it sound bad if i put some 6.5 dedicated mids in the rear deck?

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

would it sound bad if i put some 6.5 dedicated mids in the rear deck?

Yes //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

You do not want your "main" midbass drivers behind you.

Drop some 6.5" midbass in your doors, and put the 4's and tweets in kicks //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

Yes //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif
You do not want your "main" midbass drivers behind you.

Drop some 6.5" midbass in your doors, and put the 4's and tweets in kicks //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

the moding i would have to do to drop 6.5's in my doors wouldn't be worth it. plus my fiberglass skills aren't that great and my kicks will ****.

 

[OlogyAudio 10+ year member]

Just an FYI: chances are good you'll need to lowpass them higher than 1khz. Not many tweeters can handle such a low xover point.....1500hz is pretty "rare" for a tweeter. Most (not all, but most) will like 2khz or higher at the lowest. Some may not even like 2500hz as an xover point.......just depend on the tweeter. But I seriously doubt you'd find a tweeter that would really enjoy or work well with a 1khz highpass; or atleast you wouldn't be able to crank it with that low of an xover point without major distortion/damage. A "general" rule of thumb for tweeter highpass frequency is atleast twice it's Fs. Mind you, this is dependent upon slope, etc.....but it's a good starting point and should give you a reference of generally what a good xover point for the tweet would be.

IMHO I'd start out trying the 4's @ ~300hz highpass with the slope as steep as possible, and gradually drop the xover point (with the volume at your loudest typical listening level) till you hear the 4" start to stress. Then whatever suits your needs for the lowpass...probably in the 2-2.5khz region.

I skimmed most of the thread....but did I read you have no real plans for a midbass? Yeah.....after re-reading; you definitely would not be wasting your time with a midbass even though you listen to rap. Hell; with rap the majority of the "bass" is actually in the midbass region //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif I remember that popular song by Drama about 5 years back (can't think of the name).....that thing had tons of midbass output.

Squeak knows what he is talking about //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif -- There are just a handful of tweeters that are very comfortable crossing under 2khz... and VERY few that can under 1.5khz... Dayton RS, seas millennium are the 2 that come to mind first... The lowest I would DARE to cross ethr of those would be 1.2khz and with that low of a xover point don't expect that much clean volume... It is worth it to have a nice 8" 2way monitor though... Seas L series 8" with a dayton RS or the $160 T25CF-002 (E011) Millennium... and with all honesty the millennium is hard to use under 1.5khz due to a drooping sensitivity... the dayton RS is flat to 1khz... but even it with nearly 3mm of excursion is starting to suffer from THD... There are some ribbons that will xover fine at 1khz but... they aren't exactly suited for the car... not to mention they will break the bank...

If you can use a midbass and can use a 4.5” I say get the excel driver... If you can use a 4.5”er and can't use a midbass I would suggest checking out http://www.creativesound.ca/ -- the extended range has reasonable response down to 80hz... I still wouldn't personally use it under 120hz though... If you have to use a 4” I don't know what to tell you... Morel? A lot of these drivers are 8 ohms btw... so you will need a robust amp to use them to their full potential...

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

Squeak knows what he is talking about //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif -- There are just a handful of tweeters that are very comfortable crossing under 2khz... and VERY few that can under 1.5khz... Dayton RS, seas millennium are the 2 that come to mind first... The lowest I would DARE to cross ethr of those would be 1.2khz and with that low of a xover point don't expect that much clean volume... It is worth it to have a nice 8" 2way monitor though... Seas L series 8" with a dayton RS or the $160 T25CF-002 (E011) Millennium... and with all honesty the millennium is hard to use under 1.5khz due to a drooping sensitivity... the dayton RS is flat to 1khz... but even it with nearly 3mm of excursion is starting to suffer from THD... There are some ribbons that will xover fine at 1khz but... they aren't exactly suited for the car... not to mention they will break the bank...
If you can use a midbass and can use a 4.5” I say get the excel driver... If you can use a 4.5”er and can't use a midbass I would suggest checking out http://www.creativesound.ca/ -- the extended range has reasonable response down to 80hz... I still wouldn't personally use it under 120hz though... If you have to use a 4” I don't know what to tell you... Morel? A lot of these drivers are 8 ohms btw... so you will need a robust amp to use them to their full potential...

i won't cross the tweeters over at 1khz. that's what i was trying to ask, and i threw those numbers out there because i didn't know. i already got the kickers. for $30 it's worth giving them a try.

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

also is it possible to run 2 tweeters, 2 midranges, and 2 midbass off a 4-channel amp?

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

also is it possible to run 2 tweeters, 2 midranges, and 2 midbass off a 4-channel amp?

Passive; yes. Active; nope. For an active setup, you need one channel per speaker. You could build your own passive network (even if it's only for the midrange/tweeter crossover; then you could run the tweeter/mid on the same channels and actively highpass the midrange only [tweet would by highpassed via the passive, and the midrange would be lowpassed via the passive], then use the other two channels to actively bandpass the midbass)

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

Passive; yes. Active; nope. For an active setup, you need one channel per speaker. You could build your own passive network (even if it's only for the midrange/tweeter crossover; then you could run the tweeter/mid on the same channels and actively highpass the midrange only [tweet would by highpassed via the passive, and the midrange would be lowpassed via the passive], then use the other two channels to actively bandpass the midbass)

so i would pretty much run the 4" and tweets like a set of components and bandpass the mids? also would building an enclosure to house 2 8" midbass in the center console area, up under the bash be a bad idea? the doors are out of the question for the mids, just the 4's. also should i then mount the tweeters in the door or in the a-pillar?

 

[OlogyAudio 10+ year member]

Passive; yes. Active; nope. For an active setup, you need one channel per speaker. You could build your own passive network (even if it's only for the midrange/tweeter crossover; then you could run the tweeter/mid on the same channels and actively highpass the midrange only [tweet would by highpassed via the passive, and the midrange would be lowpassed via the passive], then use the other two channels to actively bandpass the midbass)

x2

Again what model Peerless drivers are these? want to point me to a link and I can give you some advice?