Fahrenheit 9/11

[PV Audio 5,000+ posts]

i wanna see it.

 

[EarDrummin. 10+ year member]

Brainwashing: Inducing a person to modify his or her beliefs, attitudes, or behavior by conditioning through various forms of pressure or torture; 2. The application of a concentrated means of persuasion, such as an advertising campaign or repeated suggestion, in order to develop a specific belief or motivation.
One correlation that must be made is: college is a high pressure environment that deprives it's students of sleep and introduces them into a world of drugs and alcohol. Meanwhile, they are going to classes and being taught a 'liberal' education forcing to have to side with whatever the professors' beliefs happen to be in order to pass their classes. Now I am a firm believer in college education, but you must take everything you learn with a grain of salt. The environment of a college education is strikingly similiar to that of a chinese concentration camp where they brainwash their inmates through similiar means of sleep deprivation, drugs, and repetition repetition reptition of their propaganda.

I had a Republican philosophy professor, a Democratic Psych professor, and a Republican Political Science professor. They have opinions, yes. They don't sit there and try to sway anyone in either direction. They teach objectively, because their jobs depend on it. I read the text, we go over it the next day in class. I've been to three different colleges, they all work this same way. If you're still saying I'm brainwashed, maybe you could also look up "askew" in the dictionary as well.

 

[DaBaller504 10+ year member]

I have nothing against college education. I am currently enrolled into a business school. The problem I do have with the education system is that the majority of almost all schools, highschools and some of the colleges I checked out do not teach the values and morals I was raised with. The majority of a lot of college educated people in my area are screwing it up. They are putting in all these laws and oridinances in that are restricting us from living. In schools you are learning how life is in the bigger cities and how it is you have to live in it. What about the contry people who work 50 some hours a week doing physical labor. Ones that work a few jobs and don't complain about it. YOu never see anypeople from my area in a picket line. The values of people in my area are unbelievable. We never have these people getting killed for no reason what so ever, even though we the majority of people carry guns. The whole point of my reply Ear Drummin was how you assume that all hicks are morons.

 

[SirClay 10+ year member]

And you have proof that Iraq was involved with 9/11 ? I'd like to see it because, to this point, I haven't seen any hard evidence, just soft circumstantial evidence and unproven theories.
Just because 9/11 happened, it doesn't give the US gov't the excuse to do whatever the **** it wants to do.

Do you remember what Bush said after 9/11 that we will take out any terrorist nation or "Terrorist HARBORING Nation?" Do you want Iraq's terrorist groups to keep growing until they are able to attack us on our own soil before we do something about it? They are already blowing themselves up with bombs they make in their country. How long till they figure out how to get bombs to the US? But if you think we should just play defense and sit and wait to see who attacks us next and let whoever take thousands of innocent American lives. THEN we should attack the people who attack us, I say...Good Plan.

And the point of giving the US excuse to do what ever it wants to do...I am pretty sure we had a great excuse for attacking Iraq. Even if we find that there wasn't any link between them and Al Queda, we took out an EVIL dictator. He killed THOUSANDS of his own civilians. He abused his people. And if you even dare try to defend or say that he was innocent or that we had reason to take him out of power, then why is he on trail from his own people? I support us going into Iraq 100%

 

[wags 10+ year member]

They teach objectively, because their jobs depend on it.

Well, I'm glad you are receiving a 'fair and balanced' education. I believe it's only necessary to be nonpartial to any particular side if you were a high school teacher. Professors have much more headroom when it comes to teaching from their own perspectives and beliefs. I mean, for example, we had this one English professor that was some extreme pothead that had too much tenure for the university to fire. I heard he would give anyone an A on a speech/paper if it was pro-marijuana (for effort). Anything pro-weed would get an A in that class - this is at a state university.
Besides that, there would be absolutely no way for me to make it through some of my classes alive had I not just sucked it up and went along with the extreme liberal point of view that many of these classrooms/profs had. Now I'm not saying I didn't get anything out of it (thinking from a different perspective and all that), but a lot of these entry-freshman level classes where I go are geared towards making the students liberals (Thank God I'm a sr).

I'm not saying you are brainwashed, I'm just telling you the college environment is perfect for such attempts - you just have to pay closer attention to pick up on it , and even if it doesnt exist where you are, it does elsewhere.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

Who would have thought....ya know you're right, some people cap on the rap artists for being stupid but holy $hit they're really quite intelligent and are against mindless killing.
This is one of the most ignorant comments I've heard, and obviously by a hick who knows nothing more than revenge, nothing of "talking it out," or "thinking it through." Bush, plain and simple went to war with a country that has never once threatened us because of an attack by an extremist group on america who tries to police the world. Those rappers actually knew what was going on, war without reason - based on scare tactics - is just Fu*king wrong, sorry.

Actually I'm not a hick. And how is fighting terrorists mindless killing? 9/11 wasn't reason enough to finally hunt down terrorists. Maybe we should wait until they have nuclear equipment to plant in the US. As I said there are some say that there is proof that Saddam helped terrorist groups. Then there are others that say otherwise. Either way as I said earlier Iraq was a win win situation. Saddam has murdered 500k according to estimates So by taking him out along with his regime we have a chance to save lives. Rap artists are against mindless killing, interesting. There are plenty of songs talking about shootouts. But the rap artists are talking about killing the evils of america or those that are a danger to america right. I don't believe I've ever heard of a rap artist that went after someone that murdered 500k people have you? Now some will say it appears our intelligence isn't as accurate as we thought (WOMD's) and I'll agree. But I don't feel blame should be put on Bush for using intelligence information. I think we should learn from it and improve intelligence.

Now people say Iraq was a failure. It seems we are getting attacked by terrorists that have now moved into Iraq. Maybe the terrorists fear that the new goverment will give the people freedom and maybe they are fighting because they were receiving indirect funding from Saddam.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

1) 2) Pretty much every so-called legitimate reason for invading Iraq originally given by the Bush administration was proven to be false.

3) Evil dictators ? There's obviously no dictators in the world worse than Saddam ... I mean China and North Korea aren't threats at all, what with their REAL weapons of mass destruction and REAL armies controlled by EVIL dictators. So when is the US going to save the Chinese and Koreans ?

.

Bush didn't make the intelligence up he simply used the intelligence the US had, that appears may have been inaccurate.

Saddam has used chemicals weapons in the past. Saddam murdered many. Saddam built a nuclear weapons plant that was taken out by Israel. Saddam attempted to build another plant according to a former regime member that was the head of their weapons development program. On record we know saddam had a particular amount of weapons and he claims he destroyed them but didn't do it in front of the UN so there is no proof of that. When weapons inspectors would go in he wouldn't let them into certain areas. Now I'm not sure what other intelligence we had but it seemed to convince Bush along with Congress that Iraq was a danger.

China is slowly changing on its own as the government is becoming more and more relaxed with trade. I agree with you in some ways on no. korea and china. I haven't heard anymore threats from No. korea so I'm not sure what is going with that. I believe if we do plan on striking No. korea we will wait until the nuclear plant is fully capable and is producing nuclear weapons and then we'll take it out with a missile. The second option is we use China to influence no. korea. China afterall is a friend in trade. Now in my opinion china is a super power. If we tried to use force with china the fear is they'd send a nuclear weapon to the US. Now I will admit I know very little about what goes on in china and if anyone could give me a link that would be great. At this point the best way to help china is through the influence of trade. I do believe down the road china will have a chance to take over the world but that will occur once I'm dead and gone. I won't get into this because most will think my thoughts are too extreme on the issue.

 

[joshpoints 10+ year member]

Well, I'm glad you are receiving a 'fair and balanced' education. I believe it's only necessary to be nonpartial to any particular side if you were a high school teacher. Professors have much more headroom when it comes to teaching from their own perspectives and beliefs. I mean, for example, we had this one English professor that was some extreme pothead that had too much tenure for the university to fire. I heard he would give anyone an A on a speech/paper if it was pro-marijuana (for effort). Anything pro-weed would get an A in that class - this is at a state university.
Besides that, there would be absolutely no way for me to make it through some of my classes alive had I not just sucked it up and went along with the extreme liberal point of view that many of these classrooms/profs had. Now I'm not saying I didn't get anything out of it (thinking from a different perspective and all that), but a lot of these entry-freshman level classes where I go are geared towards making the students liberals (Thank God I'm a sr).

I'm not saying you are brainwashed, I'm just telling you the college environment is perfect for such attempts - you just have to pay closer attention to pick up on it , and even if it doesnt exist where you are, it does elsewhere.

Totally agree. In fact statistics on this are quite interesting. The study -- which found that Penn's faculty members are overwhelmingly Democratic by a ratio of 12 to 1 -- surveyed the faculty and administration of 32 colleges and universities around the country. It included all of the Ivy League schools, in addition to other prominent research institutions like Stanford University and smaller colleges such as Amherst and Pomona. Now I believe when it comes to america the overall it is something like split. Yet when students graduate from college the number of liberals is close to matching percentages for liberal professors.

Now the opposing side says that a person's mind can not be altered since they have spent years with their parents. My though is this. In middle school through high school most kids rebell against parents along with the fact some parents don't even want to get into it because they have no time and feel their all crooks. In high school the liberal biased became very noticeable, but back in elementary and middle school I can't even remember what the teachers said. So you're hearing a political stance from someone besides your parents in high school so you see what they have to say, maybe you throw it off. But the teachers keep pushing. Then you get to college and are away from your parents and you see your parents much less. Teachers continue to tell one sided stories all the students agree and cheer for the professor. You argue them and it gets you know where as you just piss off the other students and fear that your grade will become a subjective matter, so you just back off.

I remember seeing this in high school. Constant Bush bashing so we had to vote after all this bashing. Well only one student voted other than Gore. Guess who that guy was. It was me. I almost voted third party american independent just to really piss them off. But I voted Bush and they were pissed. 1 student out of the class.

Now I have no problem giving the liberal side story. But to leave out the other sides story just isn't right.

 

[SirClay 10+ year member]

1) Iraq's "terrorists" didn't start blowing shit up until the US invaded Iraq.2) Pretty much every so-called legitimate reason for invading Iraq originally given by the Bush administration was proven to be false.

3) Evil dictators ? There's obviously no dictators in the world worse than Saddam ... I mean China and North Korea aren't threats at all, what with their REAL weapons of mass destruction and REAL armies controlled by EVIL dictators. So when is the US going to save the Chinese and Koreans ?

4) Nobody started talking about how Saddam was an evil dictator until after they didn't find any WODs. It's funny how that turned into the real reason why Iraq was invaded, not the non-existant WODs or the non-existant Al Qaeda connection.

1) I got nothing. Except the fact that you say "terrorists." They are terrorists. What else would you call them? They go around blowing themselves up. Today one killed 6 people in Iraq. But I guess you can't call him a terrorist. You can just call those people "Angered Soccer Moms."

2) We haven't found any major WOD yet. But we don't really know for sure that it is. A country is a LARGE place to look for weapons. And we know he has used chemical weapons before. I personally think there are weapons buried out there. They have already found a plane buried in the sand. A missile is a small object and easy to bury. And you act like the "Bush administration" made up the WOD. They can't make information like that. People all of over the government would be screaming if they did. They were given that information from intelligence. That is ridiculous that people have accused Bush for that mistake. Bush not only believed there was WOD, Congress believed that also. Why isn't everyone questioning congress now though? Because it is a lot easier to single out 1 person and try to destroy him than try to accuse a whole group.

3) How many innocent civilians have the Chinese or Korean dictators killed? I haven't heard of any? How many has Saddam killed...500,000. A half of a million people! Think of every single person you know personally. Then multiple that by 250,000. That’s how people he has killed! Not one sole you know alive.

4) People were talking about what an evil dictator Saddam was before Sept 11th even. It was known he was using chemical weapons on his own civilians.

This discussion is nothing personal, its nothing but a political debate //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[SirClay 10+ year member]

Now I have no problem giving the liberal side story. But to leave out the other sides story just isn't right.

*Cough*Michael Moore*Cough*

 

[SirClay 10+ year member]

lol, wow. Obviously I didn't pay enough attention in calculus to realize 2,000 X 250,000 is not 500,000 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif How about..."Think of every single person you know personally. Then multiple that by 250." That sounds a little bit better.

Brain fart! Don't I feel stupid.

 

[sumone 10+ year member]

I haven't read the whole thread, but I just watched the dvd of it...not really into documentaries but wow this movie really makes you think (especially for a person like me).

I'm one of those people who doesn't vote, could care less about politics, and such...this documentary makes me wanna start voting - all jokes aside.

Lotta interesting facts & figures and even if some parts were left out, I still think it has a lot of truth backing it. What was phenomenal was lila lispcomb or something, how she started out just really admiring the military and blah blah blah, and then her son ends up dieing and she had a change of mind...

I had watched that columbine one...eh...didn't really care for that one