DEH-P6500 optimal sub settings?

[Darwin 10+ year member]

I have a new (refurbished) Pioneer DEH-P6500 (yay). It has a hell of a lot more options than my old Aiwa CDC-X217, and I'm trying to figure out the best settings to get good front/back sound from my Kappas while retaining a good thump from my JL 10s.

I will organize my thoughts into questions for convenience. ;D

1. The head unit has 3 RCA outputs, one is marked front and the other two are marked rear "subwoofer/nonfading" (whatever that means). The rear ones are on opposite sides of the back of the head unit, one of them is built in and the other is a cord leading to two RCA outs. The instructions are very dim as to what they all do, so I picked one of the rear ones and plugged my sub amp leads to them. Works fine, but I'd like some confirmation that these are in fact identical. If not, how are they different?

2. The head unit has a subwoofer output and crossover adjustment if you set the preouts to "S/W" but if you set them to "FULL" you only get a bass/treble control. My amp has a crossover of its own of course. How do I deal with this? Obviously I don't want to be sending extra frequencies to my sub amp, but the head unit only goes up to 125Hz (though you can adjust the "output power" +6/-6). In the past I have usually kept my sub amp at 160+ to retain good thump. How do I set this up?

3. The output is 2.2V. If I set my amp to that, of course the bass is pretty wimpy since rarely does a bass hit max the wave. How low can I safely go? I ask because I don't know if this head unit is generously rated or what. It's safe to say I listen to music pretty loud generally.

Thank you for reading! I'm going to search the forums for similar stuff when I get back, but I thought if anybody had this head unit or a very similar one and knew these answers right off, that would be sweet. Thanks again. =)

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[EricM 10+ year member]

The two sets of pre-outs aren't the same. The ones with the leads attached are for rear speakers, and the other ones are the sub/non-fading outs. The rear outs use the HPF, and the sub outs have the LPF, level control, and phase.

I think 125 is more than high enough for a sub, but if you want a higher cut off you'll have to set the sub out to full and turn non-fading on, and then use your amp's LPF. The filter on the deck isn't great anyway, so you'll hear stuff higher than what you set it at.

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

Thank you! You are my savior.

Three questions remain and I will be content as can be:

1. What is the difference between normal and reverse subwoofer phases?

2. What would you set my sub amp sensitivity to if it was yours? I've blown it before being stupid with the sensitivity (it was in warranty then. Now it's not), and I don't want to do it again. It's a Phoenix Gold by the way.

3. This may be stupid, but what is nonfading?

Thanks. =)

 

[EricM 10+ year member]

1. Reverse puts the sub out of phase, like if you swapped the + and - speaker leads. Try it both ways and see which one sounds better.

2. I can't tell you what to set your gains to, but if you follow the procedure in the sticky you won't blow anything up.

3. Nonfading just means you can't control the volume of the speakers running off that pre-out with your fader. It's nonfading whether you set it to sw or full.

 

[delvryboy 5,000+ posts]

if you are using the amp xovers, your best bet is to turn off the HU xovers and use the non-fade output

with the power off, press and hold either the audio or function button(i can't remember, same as clock), scroll to S.W., set to SW;EXT

make sure your rca's are connected to the sub output

with HU on, scroll to the non-fade screen(same place where SW1 and SW2 used to be)

turn non-fade on, and go to next screen

set the non-fade level to +6(this is not a boost, but will give you max voltage from the HU)

set sub amp gains, and use the non-fade level control as to attentuate

the preouts do not clip until about 59-60, however, if you are using the internal amp for your interior speakers, don't go past 51-52

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

Eric: thanks... but what sticky are you talking about? =/ I can't seem to find it.

delvry - "SW;EXT"? whats that =/ i assume you mean set both the S/W and the PREOUT to "FULL"?

what are these numbers, 59-60, 51-52? my amp sensitivity goes from 4 down to 0.2.

thanks guys =) sorry for n00b questions.

EDIT: i just did what you suggested, and i have my sub amp sens at about 2.1 or 2.0. you think thats okay for a 2.2v output HU, with the nonfad at +6?

p.s. the sound rocks so im sticking with this if you think its okay. pwnz.

p.p.s. yes the HU is driving my interior speakers... 4x6" plate components in the back and 6.5" components in the front, all infinity kappa.

 

[delvryboy 5,000+ posts]

the 51,52,59 are the volume levels where clipping starts to occur

you are right, preout = full, i was thinking of the 6400

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

oh, duh. thanks. ;D yeah i keep it between 25-45 generally... i'll use it for a while and see if i ever have any urge to go above 50. thanks for the help man.

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

Okay, I've been listening with it like this for a while and I like it, but I've got one more question. I've found that when I listen to CD and radio I generally listen between 30-40, 45 is bordering on uncomfortable, so rarely would I want to go above that. however, when I use the aux in (i have a cd-rb10 adapter that i run my ipod through) the sound is pretty weak even with the ipod at 90% or so volume. so I cranked the aux SLA to +4. is that "okay"? in other words, is this another level adjustment or is this costing me? thanks. =)

 

[slick rick 10+ year member]

im not exactly sure in scientific terms what this does but it boosts the output for that source. for the cd i keep mine at +1. but as long as it doesnt distort it should be fine.

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

All right sorry for more discussion on this dead thread. =/

I just spent a few minutes messing with it, and discovered that I can get it to sound the way I want it by using the PREOUT: S/W setting (instead of FULL), and setting it at 125Hz with a +6 (kept my amp at 160Hz to cover for what the head unit misses, like someone said). I'm ASSUMING this "+6" is the same thing as the NonFad +6, which would mean it's not going to hurt my equipment. If it's different, tell me! My EQ-EX and loudness and all that crap is off, but my custom EQ is +2 bass, +0 mid +0 high. If I want a more dramatic boom I can knock the low end to +4. Is this...bad? Am I going to blow anything? I will very rarely have the volume above 40, and probably never above 45. The amp sensitivity is around 1.9 or 2.0. It's impossible to tell where 2.2 is on the amp dial, since it doesn't have any markers besides 4.0 and 0.2. The only reason I can figure where 1.9 is is because it's right in the middle (if my math is correct).

In my experience the sensitivity knob is the single most sensitive and effective bass adjustment you can do, however, sadly it also is a way to quickly trash the amp. Someone please tell me I'm NOT going to trash my amp (again). //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Thank you. =)

Oh, also, I was messing with the Q adjustment things... I figured out that setting the low one to the highest frequency it can go makes it kick more ***, so I left it there (at 2W which I think means most gradual curve...though that setting doesn't seem to make a whole lot of difference). The high ones don't seem to make a lot of difference no matter what I set them to, but this could be because my custom EQ mid and high are not adjusted. (I'm happy with my mid and high sounds).

 

[EricM 10+ year member]

Setting the SW to +6 won't hurt your equipment unless you have the gain up so high that the amp is clipping. I think it actually works more like a -12 cut control that's labelled as -6 to +6.

Setting the gain by the visual knob position isn't a very good idea for several reasons though. First, you don't really know what the actual output is on the HU pre-outs, so you don't know what you're trying to match. Second, with no markings between the two extremes on the knob you're just guessing at the setting. Third, you're assuming that the control pot is linear when you set it half way up, and it's probably not. A lot of amps have most of their gain increase at one end or the other of the knob and not much happening for the rest of the rotation.

So instead of squinting at this dial and trying to figure out where 2.2V would be, just use your ears. If it's not distorting with the volume on 45, then it's good.

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

Okay...maybe I'm just stupid, but how do you tell if it's distorting? most speakers are easy to tell but i've never been able to tell when a sub distorts. what am i listening for?

thanks for your help! =)

 

[slick rick 10+ year member]

id stick you head next to the sub and listen. i dont recommend this but keep your volume on like 25 then turn y our gain up until you hear distortion. that way you know what it sounds like and you can listen for it when you tune it.

 

[Darwin 10+ year member]

is it a rattle or what? i tried what you suggested but all i hear when i turn the gain up is that the roof lowers, like, i get bass all the time rather than only with the bass hits. sorta ends up sounding like an irregular hum, just like constant vibration. even with the volume turned up and (carefully) tweaking the gain, i cant tell when it "distorts". i just dont know what i'm listening for =( they're in a sealed box btw, if that matters.

i really appreciate your help.

also - in your opinion, which is the lesser evil: turning the gain up so i get satisfactory booms and keeping the head unit low EQ at 0, or setting the gain conservatively and keeping the HU low at like +4?

edit: maybe i'll just get a sine wave cd thing and do it that way. would that be smart? if so, you know where i could get one? =/