Crackling help!!

[Jeffy]

there are 3 inch to 3.5 inch midranges. Not like you need to fit a 4 incher in there. Never even said anything about cutting. A ppi 88r dsp or soundstream harmony runs you 200 dollars and you get 8 channels of clean output, 31 bands of Eq, 32 bit processor, bandpass crossovers with adjustable slopes and time alignment.

I've always been under the impression that for a midrange to sound best, it should be at least 4", I guess I'm wrong here. But like I said, I'd be very happy to get my JL 3.5" speakers sounding good in there again, I really like how everything sounded when that was working properly. I appreciate your suggestion though, if you can recommend a good 3.5" mid I'd like to at least look into it.

I'm looking at the Pioneer AVH-4100NEX, that seems like it should do the trick. Any reason not to get it? Yes it's a little over budget, but I'd like to just buy it and never have to worry about the head unit again, I've spent too much time on the **** stereo and I need to move on to other projects.

 

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

lol people got 10" mids.....just ask @Massive spl But he is running 18's.

 

[Jeffy]

[quote name='Boomin_tahoe']lol people got 10" mids.....just ask @Massive spl But he is running 18's.[/QUOTE]

Haha yea that's a different story. I get plenty of mids with four 6.75" speakers, two 6x9s, and my JL 12W6 helps even out the mid-bass and lows. I think it was very nicely balanced until everything got weird

 

[the727kid 10+ year member]

This thread is so far gone but whatever here is my .02 cents. I don't think you can automatically assume the head unit caused the issues. Just because it's a knock-off brand doesn't mean its pure trash. First, clipping directly leads to speaker destruction. I am willing to bet you couldn't even hear your dash speakers clipping because they were ran off the HU and you had 3 other sets of speakers amplified. Secondly for the tweeters, did you install the crossover properly on them? From what your describing, it sounds like there is no crossover installed inline with these tweeters. This is exactly why the issue would repeat its self off of the head unit or the amplifier.

To who ever suggested going full active and 3 way and time alignment and 31 band EQS... really? Did you really suggest that as a serious option? No offense to the OP but he is light years away from going the route, let alone doing it properly. You don't learn to drive in a Ferrari, you start out in your moms Civic. The basics need to applied before going into an advanced set up like that... which even I bet 80% of the people on this forum couldn't set up properly.

Pretty much all aftermarket head units put out roughly 20watts per channel these days not 10. 10 is more in line of a factory system. They even make some that put out 50x4RMS. I've installed several and sound wonderful for an entry level set up.

I think there are several issues that need to be addressed with the install. One of which is that the OP is running 4 sets of speakers in a car. Is this is direct root of the problem? No, but I think we all should be here to educate and we all should know that 4 sets of speakers in a car is a bad idea. Your W6 should not be playing any mid-bass duties. It should be cut off around 80z. I think you should take a step from this build, read quite a bit and re-evaluate how you want to do this. You can accomplish the same level of volume with only one set of speakers, improve your staging, and clarity if done correctly.

And yes, go for the 4100, excellent unit that will offers many features as you build up the rest of your system around it.

 

[Jeffy]

This thread is so far gone but whatever here is my .02 cents. I don't think you can automatically assume the head unit caused the issues. Just because it's a knock-off brand doesn't mean its pure trash. First, clipping directly leads to speaker destruction. I am willing to bet you couldn't even hear your dash speakers clipping because they were ran off the HU and you had 3 other sets of speakers amplified. Secondly for the tweeters, did you install the crossover properly on them? From what your describing, it sounds like there is no crossover installed inline with these tweeters. This is exactly why the issue would repeat its self off of the head unit or the amplifier.
To who ever suggested going full active and 3 way and time alignment and 31 band EQS... really? Did you really suggest that as a serious option? No offense to the OP but he is light years away from going the route, let alone doing it properly. You don't learn to drive in a Ferrari, you start out in your moms Civic. The basics need to applied before going into an advanced set up like that... which even I bet 80% of the people on this forum couldn't set up properly.

Pretty much all aftermarket head units put out roughly 20watts per channel these days not 10. 10 is more in line of a factory system. They even make some that put out 50x4RMS. I've installed several and sound wonderful for an entry level set up.

I think there are several issues that need to be addressed with the install. One of which is that the OP is running 4 sets of speakers in a car. Is this is direct root of the problem? No, but I think we all should be here to educate and we all should know that 4 sets of speakers in a car is a bad idea. Your W6 should not be playing any mid-bass duties. It should be cut off around 80z. I think you should take a step from this build, read quite a bit and re-evaluate how you want to do this. You can accomplish the same level of volume with only one set of speakers, improve your staging, and clarity if done correctly.

And yes, go for the 4100, excellent unit that will offers many features as you build up the rest of your system around it.

Great insight, I appreciate your reply. The reason I have so many speakers, is because quite simply that's how many came in the car. It's an SUV (4Runner) with front door 6x9s, rear passenger 6.75's, and tailgate 6.75's, plus the little 3.5's in the dash to help bring the sound stage up. Yes, I know that's an ***load of speakers, but hey I've got holes cut already so why not fill them? I like my music loud on the freeway and all those speakers sound great. The dual PDX-V9s are more than powerful enough to handle it, and they've got great signal processing built in so I felt that was a good choice to pair it all with. You say I have too many speakers, I'm curious why you say this. If tuned properly, they should all sound great together? I'm here to learn so feel free to blast me on this.

You are correct, my 3.5's were not on a dedicated crossover. They do have a crossover built in however. Like I said, I'm no expert, but I assumed this built-in crossover would be more than capable of handling the output from my HU. Please correct me here, clearly something went wrong since they are now blown. My W6 is crossed at 200hz I believe. My mid bass and bass has always sounded great so I never messed with that much after the initial tuning.

I agree with what you've said, I'm nowhere near going as advanced as fully active with all the extra glitter that comes with it, so no offense is taken. I was happy with my system how it was. Maybe after more time I'd start looking into upgrades, but for now what I had was just fine.

And yes, I'll be checking the HU with an O-scope before I move any further with anything. Right now it seems like the most likely culprit though, as I've ruled out pretty much everything else.

 

[the727kid 10+ year member]

Could clarify please, you stated that the tweeters in the co-axials blew, but then you ordered and installed new tweeters? Did you completely replace the JL 3.5s or just add in tweeters? Even with just the 3.5s I would still cross those at around 200hz.

The PDXV9s and the Pioneer 4100 are a very strong backbone to a system. The reason people don't multiple sets of speakers in the car is because it typically destroys the sound stage. A tired but true example: When you are at a concert the band and speakers are in front of you, not behind you. All the tuning in the world couldn't help you when you have double the power going to speakers behind you. It can tame tonality and clarity but will not be able to fix staging and imaging. Rear speakers can be provide a huge advantage to create ambient noise to help the overall soundstage, however that is not an easy task to accomplish and not something I would recommend trying for a while. If you notice around here, almost everyone says go without rear speakers. You have 6x9s in the front doors, which is a huge advantage. When you are ready to upgrade you speakers, I would recommend taking a look at the Image Dynamic XS69 component set. Very loud and super strong mid-bass. Bridging these on a V9 and using the 5th channel for the W6, and running your rear speakers off the deck... I bet you would be very satisfied only using one amp. And once you get more comfortable with the system, you could re-introduce the second amp and start playing with an active set-up.

The problem with running your sub woofer so high, even if it sounds great, is that it becomes very easy to locate. You should not be able to close your eyes and be able to point to where a speaker is. In an ideal set up, sound is coming from the front of the hood, and the sound stage should sound wider than your side mirrors.

If you decide to get more serious into this, I also highly recommend fully and properly deadening the car.

 

[Jeffy]

Could clarify please, you stated that the tweeters in the co-axials blew, but then you ordered and installed new tweeters? Did you completely replace the JL 3.5s or just add in tweeters? Even with just the 3.5s I would still cross those at around 200hz.

Yes, I completely replaced them with a pair of JL C5075-CT.

The PDXV9s and the Pioneer 4100 are a very strong backbone to a system. The reason people don't multiple sets of speakers in the car is because it typically destroys the sound stage. A tired but true example: When you are at a concert the band and speakers are in front of you, not behind you. All the tuning in the world couldn't help you when you have double the power going to speakers behind you. It can tame tonality and clarity but will not be able to fix staging and imaging. Rear speakers can be provide a huge advantage to create ambient noise to help the overall soundstage, however that is not an easy task to accomplish and not something I would recommend trying for a while. If you notice around here, almost everyone says go without rear speakers. You have 6x9s in the front doors, which is a huge advantage. When you are ready to upgrade you speakers, I would recommend taking a look at the Image Dynamic XS69 component set. Very loud and super strong mid-bass. Bridging these on a V9 and using the 5th channel for the W6, and running your rear speakers off the deck... I bet you would be very satisfied only using one amp. And once you get more comfortable with the system, you could re-introduce the second amp and start playing with an active set-up.

That's an interesting approach for sure. I know that there's plenty more I could do for my system, but I'm not trying to get too in-depth with this. Later on I'm sure I'll revisit this, but for now this was supposed to be a short project. Like I said before, I would be very happy to just get everything working like it was for those few days before it blew.

The problem with running your sub woofer so high, even if it sounds great, is that it becomes very easy to locate. You should not be able to close your eyes and be able to point to where a speaker is. In an ideal set up, sound is coming from the front of the hood, and the sound stage should sound wider than your side mirrors.
If you decide to get more serious into this, I also highly recommend fully and properly deadening the car.

Correct, my sub is actually pretty difficult to locate. You can definitely tell it's in the back, but it's not overpowering or attention-grabbing, I think it fills the cabin pretty decently. A future project is to build a new box for it, and part of that will be tuning it better. So that's on the list. Sound deadening is also on the list, I had it in my old car and it made a nice difference. I'll be going that route again, just no time for it now.

Thank you for your help and it already has me thinking about what to do in the future. I think I'm looking for more of a quick and easy fix for what I've currently got though. I just have too many other projects going on and I want to move away from this one

 

[Jeffy]

Ok I finally got everything hooked up to an o-scope. The speaker outputs from the head unit were distorted like crazy so I completely removed them from the harness and threw them away. The RCA outputs were great though, they had perfect sine waves up to volume level 29 out of 30, once it hit 30 it turned into a nasty square wave. I tested with 50hz, 500hz, 5,000hz, and 20,000hz with zero distortion, so I don't think I'll need to replace the head unit?

I moved on to the amp and it had zero distortion with the same frequencies. I slowly increased the gain and no distortion whatsoever through the entire range. I tested all channels with the same result so my amps are solid....

Which means I must have blown my speakers when I ran them at full volume. Even though they were set with a multimeter, the clipping must have blew the tweeters in them. I need to find another amp to test them on but I can't think of anything else being the issue.

So what should I replace them with? I'm looking at Infinity Kappa 693.9I, is that a good option? It seems like an upgrade over the Fosgates I have in there, it definitely is a price upgrade. Thoughts on a good 6x9 that would cost about 200 bucks? (The kappas are listed for $189 on amazon)