Clear Crisp SPL?

[PSturmer 10+ year member]

clear and crisp do not go along with spl. i myself am a SPL person. i like the challenge of getting my car to high pressure levels. for daily driving i typically just wire my amps to a stable load and then listen to it at about 130dB. My front stages are stock.

you either design a system for daily driving or SPL, not both.

and about the meter on dash thing. the headrest does make the most sense but car to car it varies. and when i run MECA my seat is all the way forward so in reality its not that loud. the dash is something constant throughout most cars.

 

[req 5,000+ posts]

i know someone like you, JimJ, punkorama, and a few others

thanks for the shout out spl jerk! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

its not that it needs to be changed... its just that the people that want to measure from a location other than the legal position need to learn to compete in those classes //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif
its just the way it was started and thats where they chose to put the mic. there are classes that measure at the kick, some measure in the port, some measure at the head rest, but legal position is at the mic. its just the way it is //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif .

the metric system thing was just an analogy, i tried to think of another sport that has something weird that everyone questions, but i dont pay attention to sports too much and couldnt think of anything //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

I guess we just disagree about the fundamentals of the sport. SPL competition has nothing to do with music or audio anymore, although the increased popularity of bass race is a small step in the right direction, in my opinion.

 

[hoss 5,000+ posts]

what did spl ever have to do with music? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif

it sounds to me like you are confusing spl with sql

SPL has always been (at least from as far back as i have known) being the loudest at one frequency, which is not music.

again, going back to the car analogy. drag cars arent designed to make turns, and likewise SPL cars arent designed to play music. installs can be oriented to do both, or to excell in one or the other, but the nature of the beast is that you cant really do both at the same time.

stereos are a trade off, either SQ or SPL. SQ doesnt have to be loud, and SPL doesnt need to play music. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif . as for the fundamentals of the sport, its pretty simple IMO, "be loud, thats all that matters" //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

what did spl ever have to do with music? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif
it sounds to me like you are confusing spl with sql

SPL has always been (at least from as far back as i have known) being the loudest at one frequency, which is not music.

again, going back to the car analogy. drag cars arent designed to make turns, and likewise SPL cars arent designed to play music. installs can be oriented to do both, or to excell in one or the other, but the nature of the beast is that you cant really do both at the same time.

stereos are a trade off, either SQ or SPL. SQ doesnt have to be loud, and SPL doesnt need to play music. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif . as for the fundamentals of the sport, its pretty simple IMO, "be loud, thats all that matters" //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Perhaps they need to review legal equipment, then. If it's not about music and only about being loud, then there is no point in limiting competitors to specific types of transducers, amplifiers, or structural limits. And I'm not even sure that loud is the right term for it...more like "make a lot of pressure, that's all that matters" because again, the scores being registered are those at the dash where our ears aren't.

 

[denim 5,000+ posts]

Neil, there is that new Cyclone class. Never seen one or done one, but it might be more to your liking.

 

[hoss 5,000+ posts]

Perhaps they need to review legal equipment, then. If it's not about music and only about being loud, then there is no point in limiting competitors to specific types of transducers, amplifiers, or structural limits. And I'm not even sure that loud is the right term for it...more like "make a lot of pressure, that's all that matters" because again, the scores being registered are those at the dash where our ears aren't.

and in sports they should throw out all the rules too //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

im trying hard not to be a smartass about it man, but you just dont seem to understand the sport of it.

yes, without restrictions it would be easier to be louder, just like in basketball it would be easier to make baskets if you didnt have to dribble, and the hoop were lower to the ground. why do basketball players have to dribble? why do basketball hoops sit so far off the ground. its just a sport, no one said it needs to be simple, otherwise it wouldnt be as entertaining, would it? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[Beerdrnkr 5,000+ posts]

The op never really specified sq, he said loud, crisp, and clear. With SQ you need time alignment and all that good stuff but I have heard cars that are in the high 140's or low 150's that sound great but once again it's with subs that aren't necessarily built for spl purposes.

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

Rules are fine, but they don't make any sense for what the end purpose is. Using a speaker to create pressure in a vehicle is like giving someone a football to throw in the basketball net. It's not about making it easier, it's about making it more logical.

As you identified, it has nothing to do with audio or music, so why do we use a speaker (one of the least efficient transducers) to create this pressure?

edit: I don't think you're being a smartass...everyone is entitled to their own opinion and may compete as they please. I just think the methodology and premise behind SPL competitions is utterly and completely non-sensical.

 

[hoss 5,000+ posts]

because, again, if it were simpler (more efficient as you would like it to be) then it would be much easier, and it wouldnt be much of a competition, would it?

why wouldnt someone just seal a vehicle up really well, and pump air into it until it got to a high pressure?

a speakers whole purpose is to create pressure. it moves air, forms waves, the waves press against our eardrums (key word press, in order to press it infers that pressure is applied), viola we have pressure.

i dont understand how using a speaker is ilogical, and i think its a poor analogy to say that its like giving someone a football to throw in a basketball net... what do you suggest they use? a larger piston thats going to move to compress the air? isnt that just a big speaker?

and please show me where i said it had nothing to do with audio... i did say it had nothing to do with music, but music and audio are not the same thing... again, i think you are trying to lump sound in with music. music is sound, sound is not necisarily music. perhaps you could create a class called MPL //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[Beerdrnkr 5,000+ posts]

I don't think spl events would be as popular if speakers weren't involved because there's so many different brands out there that people want to be a part of for 1, secondly a lot of competitors use daily drivers and want loud music daily, 3rd there's so many different ways to get loud with different boxes, subs, electrical, and so on that it's what makes it a competition. There would probably be only a few ways to get high spl w/out speakers and then it would be the same for everyone which would no longer make it a competition.

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

thanks for the shout out spl jerk! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

lol sorry man i cant remember everyone.

ill add you right now //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

clear and crisp do not go along with spl. i myself am a SPL person. i like the challenge of getting my car to high pressure levels. for daily driving i typically just wire my amps to a stable load and then listen to it at about 130dB. My front stages are stock.
you either design a system for daily driving or SPL, not both.

and about the meter on dash thing. the headrest does make the most sense but car to car it varies. and when i run MECA my seat is all the way forward so in reality its not that loud. the dash is something constant throughout most cars.

and whats wrong with a loud daily driver

 

[donpisto 5,000+ posts]

The mass of people attending car audio competitions are those who have a system, whether it is decent or pretty loud. There is a small percentage of people who actually compete to the point where they have strictly spl subs and spend hundreds upon hundreds of hours finding out exactly what the best drivers are, what the best enclosures, etc to use for their vehicle. That doesn't mean that the majority of people don't spend the time to figure out whats good for their car, but usually people go with what they think or hear are good amps, subs, etc, have a nice box, and do some EQ-ing and whatnot and it is intended for daily driving.

The OP did not mention anything about sq, but mention crisp and clean sound, which strictly spl subs do not offer. Loud is also a relative term, I have people telling me my system is the loudest and best they have heard when I know it's nothing near the best. It sounds good, gets fairly loud, especially at lower frequencies, and at times i find myself wanted it to be a bit louder. As mentioned before, with dB Drag, it's more about what's loudest on the mic, not to the ear. What may sound loud to the ear may not be equivalent to what is loud on the mic.

All this bickering back and forth is pointless, some people fail to see that you don't have to be loud to be happy. If person A like stupid loud systems, and person B likes extreme SQ with a defined frontstage, whats wrong with that? Who's right here? Who's wrong? NOBODY! People are taking car audio in different ways, the definition of car audio isn't loud, isn't sound quality, it's what you want it to be, what your preference is. Just because you don't agree with someone else's preference doesn't mean its wrong and the opposite is true as well, your preference isn't the best. Car audio has many variations, just leave it that way.

But plain and simple as someone else had mentioned, you either have sq or spl, but you dont have to have an all out spl or sq system, you can have a bit of both, but at the same time you will sacrifice the other.

 

[donpisto 5,000+ posts]

and whats wrong with a loud daily driver

I think his point is, how often are you going to listen to music at 140+ dB, it is unreasonable for several factors and i will assume these two factors: its a disturbance to those around you and it can damage your hearing. IMHO, there is nothing wrong with having a loud daily driver, but there is no need to blast it loud all the time.