Can someone explain the Pioneer 80prs?

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

2nd link doesn't work. Why does it always do that every time someone posts a link thru Amazon? Really annoying...

 

[My63bug]

So with the 80prs and ssa component amp. I can rin one set of tweets. And one set of mids. And if i wanted to run a second set of mids would i need a multi channel dsp? Is that the only way to run multiple sets of mids?

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

too bad most of its reviews are 2 stars and everyone on there jumping back on the pioneer train lmao.

most people are morons.. Its been over 10 years since a pioneer has impressed me..

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

amps don't have adjustable slopes. Well most don't. Some have 24 and 12.

amp crossovers are pretty horrid compared to head unit. The amount of control and results possible is extremely limited.

I hear what you're saying. But I was answering a guy who specifically said he wanted to avoid DSP. Some folks just want simplicity. Others wouldn't know what to do with the complexity of adjustable slopes, especially if they are blending mixed slopes. There's a reason the amplifier industry settled in on fixed slopes of 12 or 24 combined with adjustable frequency points; to ensure the best chance of phase alignment between drivers with minimal effort. Somewhat limiting, yes. But great for the average Joe who hasn't a clue of what is actually going on when he tweaks the pots. Anyway, 12dB is an incredibly common slope. Not sure why anyone would regard that as limiting. Especially when so many amps now have the x10 button to expand the possible bandwidth of adjustment and overlap.

Using the logic you have both presented here, I should now avoid any DSP that does not allow me to choose the filter types such Bessel, Butterworth, Chebyshev, Gaussian, Elliptical, and so on... or the ability to adjust the time delay by a millimeter. Because that is limiting me.

Believe it or not, friends; a guy can actually get pretty respectable results with a good crossover section in the amplifier and some simple adjustment of the bass and treble settings at the head unit. Anyone remember those days? Not everyone is entering the lanes looking for a trophy.

There's literally always something better out there but sometimes it's really nice to just enjoy something simple. If not just for the sake of saving you the time of performing endless amounts of tweaking in the pursuit of "perfection". For some, that time could be better spent on loved ones and such.

I mean, don't get me wrong. I'm a fucking tweaker willing to lose sleep. I'm not accepting those limitations, lol. But for some guys that is a great solution.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

I hear what you're saying. But I was answering a guy who specifically said he wanted to avoid DSP. Some folks just want simplicity. Others wouldn't know what to do with the complexity of adjustable slopes, especially if they are blending mixed slopes. There's a reason the amplifier industry settled in on fixed slopes of 12 or 24 combined with adjustable frequency points; to ensure the best chance of phase alignment between drivers with minimal effort. Somewhat limiting, yes. But great for the average Joe who hasn't a clue of what is actually going on when he tweaks the pots. Anyway, 12dB is an incredibly common slope. Not sure why anyone would regard that as limiting. Especially when so many amps now have the x10 button to expand the possible bandwidth of adjustment and overlap.
Using the logic you have both presented here, I should now avoid any DSP that does not allow me to choose the filter types such Bessel, Butterworth, Chebyshev, Gaussian, Elliptical, and so on... or the ability to adjust the time delay by a millimeter. Because that is limiting me.

Believe it or not, friends; a guy can actually get pretty respectable results with a good crossover section in the amplifier and some simple adjustment of the bass and treble settings at the head unit. Anyone remember those days? Not everyone is entering the lanes looking for a trophy.

There's literally always something better out there but sometimes it's really nice to just enjoy something simple. If not just for the sake of saving you the time of performing endless amounts of tweaking in the pursuit of "perfection". For some, that time could be better spent on loved ones and such.

I mean, don't get me wrong. I'm a fucking tweaker willing to lose sleep. I'm not accepting those limitations, lol. But for some guys that is a great solution.

nothing wrong with a good xover VIA the amp. centering hte frequency is a bit tricky but they aren't "worse" by any aspects.. you know this

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

I hear what you're saying. But I was answering a guy who specifically said he wanted to avoid DSP. Some folks just want simplicity. Others wouldn't know what to do with the complexity of adjustable slopes, especially if they are blending mixed slopes. There's a reason the amplifier industry settled in on fixed slopes of 12 or 24 combined with adjustable frequency points; to ensure the best chance of phase alignment between drivers with minimal effort. Somewhat limiting, yes. But great for the average Joe who hasn't a clue of what is actually going on when he tweaks the pots. Anyway, 12dB is an incredibly common slope. Not sure why anyone would regard that as limiting. Especially when so many amps now have the x10 button to expand the possible bandwidth of adjustment and overlap.
Using the logic you have both presented here, I should now avoid any DSP that does not allow me to choose the filter types such Bessel, Butterworth, Chebyshev, Gaussian, Elliptical, and so on... or the ability to adjust the time delay by a millimeter. Because that is limiting me.

Believe it or not, friends; a guy can actually get pretty respectable results with a good crossover section in the amplifier and some simple adjustment of the bass and treble settings at the head unit. Anyone remember those days? Not everyone is entering the lanes looking for a trophy.

There's literally always something better out there but sometimes it's really nice to just enjoy something simple. If not just for the sake of saving you the time of performing endless amounts of tweaking in the pursuit of "perfection". For some, that time could be better spent on loved ones and such.

I mean, don't get me wrong. I'm a fucking tweaker willing to lose sleep. I'm not accepting those limitations, lol. But for some guys that is a great solution.

it depends on the driver used and your vehicle reflections. Sure you can have okay results but if you use a slightly peaky driver, you'll need a pretty steep slope to properly control it. or you need a much higher point than 50-500hz with a x 10 bandpass crossover can achieve. Yes that is extremely limiting considering on a lot of setups need to go past that to sound somewhat decent to tame some harsh peaks that niether EQ, sound treatment or driver positioning can solve.

This case is even worse if people use super tweeters.... anything less than a 10khz at -18 db slope would equal bleeding eardrums. As far as i know, less than a handful of amps out there have crossovers anywhere that high.

The standard for old school is completely different from today's standards. I've seen a few old cats on the SQ lanes having much nicer old school gear with a nice eclipse h/u and some german mb quarts components with alpine F1 status tweets get beat out by a budget silver flute + vifa xt 25 combo with a mini dsp 2x4. The old school guy KNEW how to install but was severely limited by processing and took a large hit on the staging and imaging in the scoring. still, 5th place out of 12+ contestants is still not bad for an old school guy.