Arcam CD73 & MISC......

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

You have to listen to the good stuff..... Or you might as well not even buy good stuff.... LOL...

 

[thylantyr 10+ year member]

1. There are many genres of music that is good even metal music.

2. Recording plays a role. Not all albums are produced well.

I can play any metal music on any sound system and determine if the

sound system is good because that genre expliots speakers and amplifiers better than mellow

music. That's why when you go audition systems in the stores, they like

to play the music with the lowest duty cycle because it's less strain on the

system - hence it has the potential to sound better.

In other words, if you played some Slayer and it didn't sound good from

a production point of view {not musical}, then either the music is not produced

well or the system system is weak. If you take a known well produced Slayer album,

then you eliminated that variable. Your job is to determine if the speakers and/or

amp is struggling when you audition.

This is how I judge home audio systems. I take some metal music and have

the sale folks crank it. It will exploit struggling speakers and amps.

The prerequisite for this methodolgy is; you must be familar with metal music

and listen to it alot to know how to interpret the sounds you hear. Someone

unskilled will interpet the music as noise and falsely acuse the music as being the culprit.

 

[JimJ 5,000+ posts]

I'm agreeing completely with Thy...

Horrors!

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Highly dynamic music always has a place...that's why I like "Reflections of Earth" and Dream Theater's "Stream of Consciousness" so much for testing //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

That being said, I think it's critical you need to like what you listen to. Otherwise, why are you bothering in the first place? I've never understood people that play the same dozen records or so and always change equipment.

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

I was have always been around mixing and recording, and when I buy an album I listen to a lot to how it's balanced. I would say 90% of Metal, or similar music, is mixed so poorly it makes me sick. I listen for depth, precision, clarity, coloration, and imaging. How can you have any of those when the entire mix is based around someone screaming and distortion? I don't know about you but distortion has a time and a place, and it's not to be the core of the sound. It’s the same reason most of us don’t listen to pop music, it has that “sound” to it. Don’t get me wrong I enjoy my fair share of hard music, (Monster Magnet, NIN, Gary Hoey, some Porcupine Tree songs) but it has to be done correctly for me to like it. I do agree on the power issues that some system can have, that’s why you get good cables and good power supplies //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif But, I would put a full symphony a peg or two higher than death metal, simply on the face that it uses full range powerfully with clarity and precision.

 

[thylantyr 10+ year member]

I would say 90% of Metal, or similar music, is mixed so poorly it makes me sick.

I've been listening to this genre for about 25 years. I can agree that each

alumn is different in production. Not all Iron Maiden is produced well, not

all Metalica, not all Slayer, but there are albums that are good references

and you have to choose those for critical loudspeaker/amp audition.

On the other hand, sometimes the raw nature of the bad recording is what

gives that album it's edge. ie, Slayer Hell Awaits is a worse production

than their previous work "Show no mercy", but that raw sound on Hell Awaits

gives it that sound you like. Iron Maiden 'number of the best' and earlier is

very raw, but very good music if you pay attention to the musicians not recording.

Later works are refined in the studio and sound 'pretty'.

What I'm really fond of lately is these older bands playing in the modern era

playing old music live. This is very sweet as I've been finding out. The production

is good, the musicians are refined in skilled and the old music sound great

and modern recordings of concerts is much better than 20 years ago {live recordings}. In spite of the compression on DVD, the music can be sweet.

A modern example; I have two new Behemoth albums on DVD that have

very high SQ, but the music is noise, noise because people don't understand

the music so to them it's like listening to someone speaking in Japanese.

These metal recordings usually don't have audible distortion, I can only

think of one band that generates high distortion due to studio production.

Ronnie Dio in his earlier work would tend to overload the microphones and

preamp stages in studio gear - because he has a strong and loud voice,

these transients are recorded as clipping and are heard on the final CD,

I can hear it all the time on specific albums.

Opeth Lamentations DVD is amazingly great for SQ audition, mellow and hardcore sets on the same DVD.

But, I also have some Jazz reference CD's to bring order to the chaos. Even

though I'm familiar with the sound of Metal, I like to verify using other

sources.

Flim & The BB's - new pants {the best BB's album}

This is sweet for SQ auditions.

Diana Krall DVD - This is comedy, everyone said it was a high SQ recording,

so I snagged it. Boy, this DVD is the worse thing I've heard of from a production.

There is some hiss that was mixed as if someone enabled an instrument

that added all this hiss into the mix. I verified this on headphones and it

happens in the same locations on the songs, bad production.

There is nothing funner to ask a saleman to audition a speaker system

when you pull out the Slayer CD, the look on their face and reaction is priceless.

Plus, it keeps them out of the room so you can check stuff out without them

looking over your shoulder.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/veryhappy.gif.fec4fed33b4a1279cf10bdd45a039dae.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/cool.gif.3bcaf8f141236c00f8044d07150e34f7.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

 

[Beat_Dominator 5,000+ posts]

Smashing Pumpkins Melancholy is recorder terribly //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif so sad, wish they could do a remaster..... unless the master's sound bad //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

Smashing Pumpkins Melancholy is recorder terribly //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif so sad, wish they could do a remaster..... unless the master's sound bad //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

The master is what sounds bad... LOL....

Thy, i'm not going to argue with you in anyway, because we just hear different things. You enjoy your world of music and audio and I enjoy mine. If you ever want to put those Line Arrays up against something non DIY, you are welcome to come to ohio and listen to my shop system.

Tascam CD/Tape Player

2 (Per Side) Meyer Sound UPA-1P

2 (Per Side) Meyer Sound PSW-4

1 Yamaha DM1000 Digital Console

Everything is ran ballanced XLR and the RCA outputs from the CD/Tape Deck are ran through two (one for left and one for right) DI boxes that take the unballanced signal to XLR... It might be more of what you like...

(Sorry for spelling errors, I've been drinking tonight...)

 

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

Balls.

nG

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

Balls.
nG

You ever going to come up here?

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

SO, the CD Player sounds magnificent. I was totally blown away by it. The depth and precision is immense.

So it plays CDs better than your Elite combo player??

No more like Don Fagen, or Tom Petty, or some Jazz, or violins.... You know, something that sounds good....

I would have to agree with your choices of music. Fagen and older Steely Dan is just phenominal in both the music and the recording quality.

Ronnie Dio in his earlier work would tend to overload the microphones andpreamp stages in studio gear - because he has a strong and loud voice,

these transients are recorded as clipping and are heard on the final CD,

I can hear it all the time on specific albums.

Which albums are you talking about? I ask because I've always been a RJD fan. Now you have me wanting to get out my Dio collection and listen for that.

 

[Beat_Dominator 5,000+ posts]

So it plays CDs better than your Elite combo player??

It should, the Arcam unit would have much better D/A conversion.

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

It should, the Arcam unit would have much better D/A conversion.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a "total" noob but it just doesn't seem like much of a value to me. Not saying the Arcam doesn't sound good because I'm sure it does. I'm just cuious to HOW MUCH BETTER it sounds than his combo player.

 

[Beat_Dominator 5,000+ posts]

Only one way to find out..... road trip to B&W_EE's!!! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/woot.gif.aaa6090e619a97b6090d16dd863c5a69.gif

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Only one way to find out..... road trip to B&W_EE's!!! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/woot.gif.aaa6090e619a97b6090d16dd863c5a69.gif

I'm only about 4 or 5 hours away. So I'll stop and pick up the beer.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[2kchevy06civic 5,000+ posts]

I want to hear B&W stuff so bad. The cloest store to hear them is an hour and a half away //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif. I want to try out rotel stuff as well. I'm such a n00b at home audio stuff but I've been trying to read stuff on forums hardcore lately b/c I want to have a nice home audio setup.

I'd love to take a roadtrip to B&W_EE's though ;P