WHAT's The PROPER WAY TO MOUNT MATERIALS ON THE OUTER DOOR OVER METAL OR CLD

[Alrojoca 10+ year member]

I have a 1" steel bar pipe shape right behind the midbass driver, my idea is to glue some CCF pipe insulation over the painted bar, then glue CCF on the remaining CLD placed on the flat outer door metal behind the midbass driver.

1) What kind of glues? (brands and models) Will 3M automotive double sided tape and Velcro work better? ( brand and models)

2) Will 2 pieces of CCF glued together with PVC sprinkler pipe glue hold strong inside the door ( of course I need to use a different glue to bond it to the sound deadener CLD, glue that I hope someone can recommend as requested on my first question)

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[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

What are you trying to accomplish with this? The crash bar isn't going to benefit from pipe insulation, and neither are your speakers. There's one thing I have put inside my doors to improve the acoustics of the door as a speaker enclosure and that's plastic encased pink fiberglass batt insulation. The outer door skin has CLD applied to it for resonance control. CCF is best used as a gasket material, not an absorber of audible sound.

 

[Alrojoca 10+ year member]

Okay! Will I be better off just putting CLD over that steel bar?

What about if I put this On the outer door Speaker Tweaker Kit - Second Skin Audio how will I mount it? Do they come with just glue or DS tape. I just need to get an idea of what glue Velcro or mounting tape can be used over CLD on the outer door.

I know there are controversies on CCF behind the midbass drivers, I was not thinking about using 1/8" thick CCF I was planing on gluing two 1/4" pieces to make a 1/2" thick CCF, being this thick it will have more effect if any. CLD has a hard aluminum layer, my logic tells me sound will bounce off that layer just as it will bounce from the naked steel bar, I figured if I cover the bar with 1/2" pipe insulator will help to deflect the sound waves. Fiberglass will not be an option for me.

Knowing the best way to mount that with adhesive, tape or ...... Does not mean I may just try to glue CCF behind the midbass driver, I can always glue CCF on other areas even on the inner inside door, like to place a skirt over the covered holes to avoid water getting in between the inner door metal, caulk rope and sheet metal covering the hole, that eventually will result in a water leak if water sits on those pockets created when putting sheet metal over the acces holes on the inner door. I know CLD works the best to cover those pockets and keep water out. The issue is, once we put sheet metal over an opening the pocket is made, and there is no way to reach with my arm from the speaker hole with a piece of CLD feel and guess where to place the CLD to cover the pockets of the covered holes.

While with CCF I can glue it to the sheet metal to create a skirt or or Velcro it to the inner door before I screw the sheet metal over the access holes. . I'm not trying to complicate things, every car is different and I recommend a water test before removing a door panel just to see where the water goes and if any lands on those pockets, even if no leaks are detected, we don't want water to sit in those pockets in a sealed door there may not be enough air flow for the water to dry and that may cause some issues in the long term.

A loose plastic inside the hole could also be used as a moisture barrier the problem is that it needs to be pushed in and kept inside to keep the water from reaching the pocket at the bottom of the access opening.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

CLD is by far most effective on flat surfaces. A round bar has 0 need for CLD. Small strips of butyl rubber adhesive, such as the products sold in auto parts stores to seal the edges of windshields to the chassis, may be needed to prevent the door from vibrating against the steel bar. This is one of the advertised uses of the butyl rubber sold by Sound Deadener Showdown.

Aluminum foil tape will stick to CLD foil and a lot of other materials.

Your covers for access holes should be removable, if not for future sound deadening than for their intended purpose, which is to access the window mechanism. With MLV covering the holes there is less need for the covers.

If you can fit a useless Speaker Tweaker pad you can fit fiberglass insulation. @keep_hope_alive;

 

[Alrojoca 10+ year member]

My bars do not vibrate and already have some rubber from the factory , my hole's covers will be removable without tearing or destroying material to access the door components.

I appreciate your advice, CCF does not do block sound or makes it sound better and it is a gasket, it has been read and said many times, I know, but it helps in some situations where it can be placed over other materials that affect the sound in a negative way,and it blocks water also.

My case is unique since the pipe insulation has another purpose, water bounces of the steel bar and it soaks my rear speakers big time, the shield for the magnet I already placed on it, helps but does not keep the speaker from getting wet, I'm going to cut it to leave 1/16" just over the magnet and cover the freaking back of the magnet with CCF or rubberized CCF. Hertz audio has a rubber over their magnets to prevent the back wave sound, funny how some people talk about claiming the rubber is just an orange decoration and does nothing.

By placing the rubberized pipe insulation over the bar I might change the way the water splashes on my speaker. I tried a skirt made of CCF but it was short, once a I cut the plastic rain guard the CCF will block more water, I may have to go over 5" across to block more water cause it even gets on the bottom of the mdf ring, I put rope caulk and CCF weather seal between the door and the ring, but it still gets wet although no leak, therefore CCF is the only option I have to block water without affecting the sound in any way.

 

[calebkhill 10+ year member]

Use a plastic sheet hung between your driver and that steel pipe to block water.

Or, some other material that won't vibrate, but can block water from hitting your speaker.

I think your over complicating this.

Sometimes, you just gotta be crafty, figure out stuff yourself. Every car is different and needs different treatment, and when it comes to some things, imagination will help you solve your problems.

CLD your door metal. How much depends on you.

Then hang something between your speaker and the water............

Hey, you could probably take a sheet of ccf, then glue some seran wrap to the backside, then hang seran side towards water. The ccf will stop the seran wrap from vibrating if glued well, and the plastic will block water. (for glue, go to home depot, paint section, there are spray glues/adhesives for the material your working with, just read the can)

 

[Alrojoca 10+ year member]

I had CLD on the doors before the issue on the outer door and inner door on the side facing the outer door rather than the inner door facing the door card.

I also just placed a CCF skirt hanging from the top of the inside inner door that needs to be tested, I got a pair of 5" round tupperware bowls for $1.00 I can try to cut and put some CLD on them if I decide to use them. Although a set of baffles cut in half spending $14 might be a more effective option.

I like the seran idea and maybe wrap the magnets or connectors with it. I believe CCF does not absorb water or any liquid and can protect the driver properly from water if placed where it can be effective, while not blocking or affecting the sound in a bad way.

 

[calebkhill 10+ year member]

Ccf doesn't absorb, but plastic would be better to use to fight water.

 

[Alrojoca 10+ year member]

I have some closed cell foams that will block water as good as plastic, PVC yoga mats, also some camper seal foam tape that is like rubber and will seal and block water as good as plastic that will not rattle or vibrate ;-). I am leaning towards 3M automotive double sided tape to hold it or bundle or aluminum tape. So many choices it is hard to pick one just because I have not been in this situation before.

It is easy to say, put this or use this, once you have the speaker in your hand it is very hard to create something that will work because we do not know how the water will sit or go places, and some speakers like this polk, it has like a board with 2 big A--s capacitors in that area where the connectors are. I am leaning towards a loose skirt of CCF that will block water, I can use the bundling tape on the CCF to block water even more but it will make the ccf stiff and may flex around the shape. The thing is to let it drip and breath to dry up. I may post a pic if I am happy. I know I complicate things and not knowing the outcome it gives an unwanted feeling.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

yes, CCF will block water just fine.