What A Surprise!

If you want a flatter responce...sure. But in every genre from Rap to Jazz to Rock to Reggae you want a bass/midbass heavy system. It just sounds better to the ears. You want the kick drum pumping in your chest and you want to experence the lowest notes on the bass guitar, not just hear them. Most people will find that their ears do not enjoy the sound of a perfectly flat responce. Most will want a low end heavy system with a dip just above most volcals and then a peak right near the tippy top. This is what sounds most realistic to most. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif
If you have a perfectly flat responce, by the time you are feeling the drums and experenceing the bass guitar your ears are bleeding from the shrill vocals and high notes. Our ears are far more sensetive to the vocal bandwith than to the bass and midbass frequincies hence the greater output desire to have a "balenced" system. When you go to a concert they have a few lead amplifiers and a few 100Hz + PA speakers to set the sound stage....then they have 4, 5, 8 5'x5' PA subwoofers. They spent a lot more money on the subwoofers than they did on the 100Hz+ and they are looking for shear quality over a wide area. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

IMO a the cheapest subwoofer you would want, even for a pure SQ system, when talking high end install would be something like a 12" high end woofer like an IDmax with a healthy 1000w in a low tuned ported enclosure.

My Mag 15" sealed with 1000w was GREAT for rock, reggae, Jazz, and even when I wanted to do some moderate ground pounding.
Hmm, I liked my brahma 10 in a sealed enclosure in a trunk well enough. Wasn't amazing for rap, but it was enough to get a visceral bass feeling out of most music. As far as ears bleeding from loud music, I think that's the $200 components. I personally, more than once, have listening to high end HT setups WAYYY to loud, not realizing it, just becuase it still wasnt' really hurting my ears too much, it didnt' sound that much louder than some cars I had been in, it just sounded nicer with a lot more "full" sound to it. Without distortion, things dont tend to hurt as much apparently. Drums beating me in my chest, trumpets sounding totally lifelike, suddenly the come into the demo room and tell me that's at least 120db full range, and I should probably turn it down now.

I agree, a perfectly flat responce rarely sounds natural, especially in a car. I do disagree however, that it takes a 12 inch sub with over 20mm of excursion in a PORTED enclosure no less to have a decent amount of bass, let alone enough to keep up with 6.5 inch speakers running IB and a 1"tweet.

 
People who spend $500-$2000 + on a substage but $100 on a front stage get zero respect form me, as they don't know WTF sound quality is, or what music should sound like.Attention wh0res //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif If anyone wants to know what a system should sound like, go to a live concert.

thats true, i know alot of people where i live. Who get 2 18inch subs + crapy amps and stock front and rear speakers and all you hear is crappy bass

 
I almost dont even want to respond...
I'm 110% sure he excludes SPL competitors from his remark and that its only aimed at r-tards on the street with stock speakers and $2k substages...your inclusion of SPL competitors into his remark was just dumb and ignorant...
X2 he did excludes SPL competitors.

 
Hmm, I liked my brahma 10 in a sealed enclosure in a trunk well enough. Wasn't amazing for rap, but it was enough to get a visceral bass feeling out of most music. As far as ears bleeding from loud music, I think that's the $200 components. I personally, more than once, have listening to high end HT setups WAYYY to loud, not realizing it, just becuase it still wasnt' really hurting my ears too much, it didnt' sound that much louder than some cars I had been in, it just sounded nicer with a lot more "full" sound to it. Without distortion, things dont tend to hurt as much apparently. Drums beating me in my chest, trumpets sounding totally lifelike, suddenly the come into the demo room and tell me that's at least 120db full range, and I should probably turn it down now.
I agree, a perfectly flat responce rarely sounds natural, especially in a car. I do disagree however, that it takes a 12 inch sub with over 20mm of excursion in a PORTED enclosure no less to have a decent amount of bass, let alone enough to keep up with 6.5 inch speakers running IB and a 1"tweet.
Agian the difference between hearing it and experencing it. I've yet to hear a single 10" set up that could actually 'knock' me in the chest that wasnt tuned too high for my likings...and deffanitely no single 10" sealed. My GF's car is about perfect as well. Two Assasin 10's in a Wicked One with 400w.

The 12" in the ported enclosure tuned low was to compensate for the lost low end, not to gain output. There are reggae songs I listen to that dip into the 20's. A 10" or even most 12"s sealed just arent going to have the output that low for me to actually experence the rumble of the music.

And I'm sorry but once vocals, no matter how low the distortion is, get into the 130dB + range your ears are going to hurt. Bass on the other hand doesnt cause discomfert untill the 140dB + range and doesnt actually cause pain untill 150dB+. 110dB Vocals are pretty **** loud. Go back in that demo room and cut the subwoofer and only listen to the vocal range at the same level you where listening to before. Pull out the handy meter and register what the VOCALS where playing at. I have a feeling you would be surprised.

Going along with the distortion thing...unless you are listening to an orchestra there will be distortion in the music 9 times out of 10. Musictians LOVE to add distortions to their music. Even or Odd order a guitar with a wahwah pedal and an amp pushed into clipping is going to being to physically hurt at 120-130dB if not lower. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 
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