Totally Perplexed: Harsh Sounding Tweeter

[CTGT2005 10+ year member]

I cant for the life of me figure out whats contributing to the harshness of my install. I've taken measurements using a calibrated microphone and have set the tweeter level slightly below the average. Regardless of attenuation the speakers still sound way too edgy. After about 5 minutes I want to gouge my ears with a rusty railroad spike, even with the tweeter at -6. The speakers are Alpine Type R SPR-17s

I listened to the speakers on a sound board and they were excellent, they even measured close to what I'm seeing in car. I just dont get it, the speakers measure flat enough that I wouldnt expect to hear any harshness, but thats not the case. It is +/-4db but its a car afterall and the harshness I'm hearing is somewhere in the 3-5K range and I cant seem to EQ it out using the limited adjustments on the headunit.

The harshness is mose prevalent in complex musical passages, female vocals, or distortion in the recording. Also, at low volumes, all that I can hear is the tweeter, its like the woofer doesnt begin to output at an even level to the tweeter until the music is blasting.

My thoughts feel free to touch on any of them. Any suggestions would be immensly helpful.

1. High order harmonic distortion from speakers causing the upper midrange glare

2. Distortion caused by the amplifier: Soundstream Stealth STL4.500

3. Headunit Alpine 9883 low quality output signal

4. Phase related issue with the tweeter

View attachment 26531125

Click to read more...

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

Where are the tweets installed

 

---------- Post added at 11:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:07 PM ----------

 

And what speakers

 

[CTGT2005 10+ year member]

Where are the tweets installed 

---------- Post added at 11:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:07 PM ----------

 

And what speakers

Sorry, The speakers are Alpine Type R SPR-17S. Tweeters are mounted in the factory location behind the doorpanel.

 

[perfecxionX 10+ year member]

did you actually use test tones to determine its "in the 3 to 5k range" or are you just guessing?

i assume your using a passive crossover?

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

Sorry, The speakers are Alpine Type R SPR-17S. Tweeters are mounted in the factory location behind the doorpanel.

Diffraction. Those tweeters being behind that door panel isn't good. Could also be some phase interference, have u tried flipping phases?

 

[CTGT2005 10+ year member]

did you actually use test tones to determine its "in the 3 to 5k range" or are you just guessing?
i assume your using a passive crossover?

I was just taking a wild *** guess to be honest. Its possible what I am hearing is that 1.5khz hump shown in the attached graph in the first post, or a higher order distortion by-product. No amount of tweeter adjustment makes the shouty sound of the tweeters go away, but covering the tweeters completely does. The head unit has eq adjustments for treble only at 10k, 12.5k, 15k and 17.5k so its pretty limited. I've tried attenuating specific frequencies using the built in EQ, which makes the music seem flat and lifeless, but cant kill the growl.

 

[RAM_Designs 5,000+ posts]

Use test tones so you can pinpoint the frequency that's causing the issues.

 

[fish1234 10+ year member]

Try putting them Diamonds in there and see what you think?

 

[CTGT2005 10+ year member]

Try putting them Diamonds in there and see what you think?

The Diamonds were so incredibly bright on the sound board, even when attenuated. I had to add an additional 5.6ohm series resistor to the tweeter just to smooth it out. The Diamonds sounded clearer and more detailed than the Alpines, which by comparison sounded rather muddy and muffled. Ultimately the greater flexibility of tweeter adjustment lead me to pick the Alpines over the Diamonds. Perhaps I am regetting my decision now.

Part of me wants to blame something else in the signal path, other than the speakers, like a crappy DAC on the headunit, or something audible from the amplifier, but that shouldnt be the case.

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

Diffraction. Those tweeters being behind that door panel isn't good. Could also be some phase interference, have u tried flipping phases?

This! Not exactly sure why u ignored it....

 

[fish1234 10+ year member]

I think getting the tweeter out on top of the door panel will make a hugh difference and you can swivel them for your liking as well. You should be able to cut a hole in the factory grill and flush mount your tweeter in the same place.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

Location location location.

 

[CrossFired 10+ year member]

You can't cover the tweets, they will make all sorts of ugly sound. I had issues with a friends set of prs520 tweets, and I had to change out pioneers choice of resistors on the xo, as to lower those glass cutters.

 

[nismos14 5,000+ posts]

What amp? Give reversing the phase on both tweets a shot. How are they mounted? On/off axis?

 

[bhsdriller 10+ year member]

you guys are saying reverse the phase on the tweeters?...what exactly does that do(I know it reverses the phase obviously) but how does it help