TC Sounds TC9 vs TC3HP

[Lightninghoof 10+ year member]

I'm in the market for a new subwoofer. I've reviewed several options and pretty much narrowed it down to these two drivers. Specifically, the TC-2000 and TC-3000 models.

I have decided on a single sealed 15" driver for SQ and maximum low bass extension. I have up to 4.5CF net to work with, and an amplifier that is capable of around 1500 watts RMS @ 1-ohm.

I am torn between these two subwoofers and the features that they offer. I was trying to research what the actual real world differences would be and which would better suit my application, but I'm still not sure which I should go with.

15" TC-2000 DVC (Dual 3-ohm)

Qts 0.371

Qes 0.397

Qms 5.731

Fs 20hz

Res 6.06Ω

Ls 4.52mH

Lp 8.32mH

Rp 7.33Ω

Dia 330mm

Vas 231l

mms 277g

cms 225um/N

bl 23T*m

Spl 88.6dB

Xmax 28mm

Pe 700RMS

15" TC-3000 QVC (Quad 1-ohm)

Qts 0.260

Qes 0.275

Qms 4.950

Fs 19hz

Res 5.6Ω

Ls 9.2 mH

Lp 20.2mH

Rp 27.66Ω

Dia 325mm

Vas 205.1l

mms 329.5g

cms 212.2mm/N

bl 29T*m

Spl 89dB

Xmax 34mm

Pe 1000 RMS

Here are some of the issues that I've run into...

When I model the two drivers in WinISD Pro, it clearly shows that the TC-3000 (3HP) is a small box design. Only requires 1.15CF for a .707 Qtc, vs 3.2CF for the TC-2000. I noticed the TC-3000 is also rather efficient at 89dB SPL. Hoffman's Iron Law dictates that if a driver is efficient and requires a small box size, then low-frequency capability will suffer as a result. I was thinking that since the TC-2000 (TC9) has about the same efficiency SPL rating as the TC-3000, but requires a much larger enclosure, then low-frequency capability will be better.

I was also worried that the TC-2000 wouldn't be able to handle the power from my amplifier but TC Sounds assured me that it could handle 1000+ watts as long as everything was set up properly.

I emailed TC about this issue and to see what they recommend. They said that the TC-3000 would be a few dB louder than the TC-2000 and also have better low-frequency extension. The only downside to the TC-3000 being that it will have a slightly less linear BL curve, and that the TC-2000 will be cleaner sounding.

I understand what TC is saying but this confuses me a little bit. Hoffman's Iron Law seems to show that the TC-3000 sacrifices extension for efficiency and box size in its design, while the TC-2000 sacrifices box size for extension and efficiency in its design.

Also, I read a forum post (I believe by a TC engineer) that stated low-frequency extension is heavily dependent on Qts and Mms. (the higher the better. He stated Fs doesn't have much to do with it). The TC-2000 has a higher Qts and a higher Mms than the TC-3000.

I would like to get some feedback on this matter, and perhaps hear from people who have auditioned the TC-2000 and TC-2000, or a similar design using the TC9 and TC3HP motors.

Thanks.

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[JimJ 5,000+ posts]

Be careful about playing the specs game, these drivers don't generally model up very well.

Considering the amp you have, I'd probably go with the '3000.

 

[Lightninghoof 10+ year member]

Honestly the graphs were about exactly what I was expecting. The TC-2000 models very nicely in a medium to large sealed enclosure. The TC-3000 models like a driver that might be better suited for a vented box, but could go either way.

I forgot to mention in my initial post that the TC-2000 is DVC 3-ohm coils (1.5-ohm in parallel), so maybe 1000 ~ 1200 watts RMS from the amplifier.

 

[dalucifer 10+ year member]

I agree with Jimj...With that kind of power i would go with the 3hp..It can def. handle more, but with 1000 rms it will sound pretty good..Another thing you have to take into consideration is that its a quad 1 ohm coil...

 

[fived 10+ year member]

I have a TC9... only its custom. Im running it at about 600 watts for break in, and it is heart pounding loud. Can't wait to put it up to 1200 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[dalucifer 10+ year member]

I have a TC9... only its custom. Im running it at about 600 watts for break in, and it is heart pounding loud. Can't wait to put it up to 1200 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

TC9's dont need that much power, but they sure can handle it...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[CBFryman2 5,000+ posts]

Sealed alignment, low end extension is 100% dependant on linear displacement barring you have the power to reach it.

Keep that in mind. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[bigbassman Premium Member]

you have the power to reach it.

there's something that gets passed over alot //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Loyd L.

 

[skadude016 5,000+ posts]

TC9's dont need that much power, but they sure can handle it...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

x2. I had mine on 1400 watts for about 3 months and loved it! Then I wanted to try it out on a profile CA600. 400-450 watts, and I was amazed. I mean I could tell the 1400 was louder but the profile could still make it pound. great woofers

 

[blackonblacksls 10+ year member]

well i have put in a 15 inch tc 3hp. on a ia 20.1 at 1ohm. and it took it just fine seemed like it could take a bit more even. we even had it on 4ohms on the same amp. and off about 300 watts at 4 ohms. at the lower watts it really seemed to need more. so with about a 1500 watts amp i say it just wouldnt do these subs justice.

 

[blackonblacksls 10+ year member]

and it seemds to get plenty low. but it is in a big low tuned box. so that might have something to do with it.

 

[CBFryman2 5,000+ posts]

Comparing mehcanical power handling ported to sealed is a BIG nono.

 

[Lightninghoof 10+ year member]

I'm leaning toward the TC-2000 but I'm still collecting opinions and data.

 

[BigProof 10+ year member]

Comparing mehcanical power handling ported to sealed is a BIG nono.

hows come?

 

[Lil Poot 5,000+ posts]

hell i ran my 2 rl-p's with my crossfire vr602 at 4 ohms for a few months while waiting on my 2000d to get repaired, and people thought i was bangin hard. jaws were dropping when i got the vr2000d back //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif