Sundown SAX100.4 vs Alpine PDX150.4

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

about the pdxs if read and heard they tend to run hot and they lack dynamic headroom.
There is no need for rear fill at all if your going for sq only if your all about spl

whats your goals? Sq-imaging soundstage reproducing the real thing

or how loud it gets.

Id say save for the a 2way set up you really want and have researched alot about get the amp to match the power. your better off doing it right the first time youll end up spending more if you dont.

some comps to look at hybrid audio legatia ,seas lotus dyn esotar numeous raw drivers if going active

Well I already said I probably won't be going active with this car and ive already said im focusing more on the install then the components themselves as my last systems have lacked soley because of the install.

I strive for a balance between SQ and SPL as I realize that going for perfect stereo imaging and ulimate SQ does not really belong in the car. I am waiting till I have a house to do that... also no point in a high SQ setup if I can't turn it up... it is in a car afterall.

Also I don't have anywhere near the money to built my perfect system right away but I can not stay with what I have while I wait for the money so I am doing it in stages. First and for most the install which I am dropping good money into this time around so that whatever I do in the future I have the electrical and insulation to go with it. Thus whatever I get for an amp must be flexible enough to grow with me and my system.

I am starting off with the Memphis coax's cause I have them already because I got them cheap (and I like memphis) and those on deck power are a huge improvement over stock. But I have no low end extension with deck power so I need an amp and I dont see the point on wasting money on a lower power amp when I plan to upgrade to some HSK's hopefully this year. I have heard the HSK's at a local dealer and I liked them. I also listened to the MLK's and they sounded like crap but I assume thats because they werent amped properly. So this will go in stages. I will never know the perfect speaker until I try them in MY car with proper power. No amount of research is going to tell me what speaker will appease my tastes in MY car.

And I have done a lot of research already. And I read the opposite of what you read about the PDX's... that they have good dynamic range but lack in low end control due to the lower damping factor. But I am still reading around however am leaning towards the PDX due to power and size.

Anyone know of any reviews for the 2008 model? Know what's changed?

 

[rc10mike 10+ year member]

Well I already said I porbably won't be going active with this car nad ive already said im focusing more on the install then the components themselves as my last systems have lacked soley because of the install.
I strive for a balance between SQ and SPL as I realize that going for perfect stereo imaging and ulimate SQ does not really belong in the car. I am waiting till I have a house to do that... also no point in a high SQ setup if I can't turn it up... it is in a car afterall.

Also I don't have anywhere near the money to built my perfect system right away but I can not stay with what I have while I wait for the money so I am doing it in stages. First and for most the install which I am dropping good money into this time around so that whatever I do in the future I have the electrical and insulation to go with it. Thus whatever I get for an amp must be flexible enough to grow with me and my system.

I am starting off with the Memphis coax's cause I have them already because I got them cheap (and I like memphis) and those on deck power are a huge improvement over stock. But I have no low end extension with deck power so I need an amp and I dont see the point on wasting money on a lower power amp when I plan to upgrade to some HSK's hopefully this year. I have heard the HSK's at a local dealer and I liked them. I also listened to the MLK's and they sounded like crap but I assume thats because they werent amped properly. So this will go in stages. I will never know the perfect speaker until I try them in MY car with proper power. No amount of research is going to tell me what speaker will appease my tastes in MY car.

And I have done a lot of research already. You notice I am asking about two fairly high end amps? And I read the opposite of what you read about teh PDX's... that they have good dynamic range but lack in low end control due to the lower damping factor. But I am still reading around however am leaning towards the PDX due to power and size.

Anyone know of any reviews for the 2008 model? Know what's changed?

If you're doing it in stages you might as well skip a step and go right for the 4.150. One thing I learned is that once I get what I thought I wanted, I always want more. So you would save $ in the long rung. Im in the same boat right now, I have the JL 300/4 but now I wish I would've got the 4.150 or HD600/4 first.

As for the 08 model? Im guessing nothing changed.

 

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

If you're doing it in stages you might as well skip a step and go right for the 4.150. One thing I learned is that once I get what I thought I wanted, I always want more. So you would save $ in the long rung. Im in the same boat right now, I have the JL 300/4 but now I wish I would've got the 4.150 or HD600/4 first.
As for the 08 model? Im guessing nothing changed.

exactly you do all that research and save up and... its not quite you wanted. I have that happen to me all the time. Doing it in stages lets you see just what does what where and you get to learn more about the hobby and learn what your tastes are.

Just the more I read I find people saying the PDX4.150 lacks in midbass.

 

[Pl8er 5,000+ posts]

Well I already said I probably won't be going active with this car and ive already said im focusing more on the install then the components themselves as my last systems have lacked soley because of the install.
I strive for a balance between SQ and SPL as I realize that going for perfect stereo imaging and ulimate SQ does not really belong in the car. I am waiting till I have a house to do that... also no point in a high SQ setup if I can't turn it up... it is in a car afterall.

Also I don't have anywhere near the money to built my perfect system right away but I can not stay with what I have while I wait for the money so I am doing it in stages. First and for most the install which I am dropping good money into this time around so that whatever I do in the future I have the electrical and insulation to go with it. Thus whatever I get for an amp must be flexible enough to grow with me and my system.

I am starting off with the Memphis coax's cause I have them already because I got them cheap (and I like memphis) and those on deck power are a huge improvement over stock. But I have no low end extension with deck power so I need an amp and I dont see the point on wasting money on a lower power amp when I plan to upgrade to some HSK's hopefully this year. I have heard the HSK's at a local dealer and I liked them. I also listened to the MLK's and they sounded like crap but I assume thats because they werent amped properly. So this will go in stages. I will never know the perfect speaker until I try them in MY car with proper power. No amount of research is going to tell me what speaker will appease my tastes in MY car.

And I have done a lot of research already. You notice I am asking about two fairly high end amps? And I read the opposite of what you read about teh PDX's... that they have good dynamic range but lack in low end control due to the lower damping factor. But I am still reading around however am leaning towards the PDX due to power and size.

Anyone know of any reviews for the 2008 model? Know what's changed?

Just my opinion here, but I don't think you can go wrong with either. It will be hard to find someone who has a Sundown to demo but personally if you could demo them that is your best option. I know that everyone says that power is power, blah blah blah...but trying out amps side by side is the best way to go. You can hear what amp you prefer.

I really like the look of the PDX, and you will get some extra power out of it. Although I've heard from many a sources that the Sundown is underrated. You will most likely get around 125. The looks are a bit more rough around the edges (more of a standard look...for me it doesn't matter, but to some showing them off that matters) I've heard that the sundown sound really good.

Always going to be pro's and cons man but your going to get a quality amp, as you said you already did your homework. Make sure you do a clean install (by this I mean proper installation, deaden everything, and your HU is great, i don't think your amp is going to be too much of a factor.

WOW...ok, so I don't feel like I helped much. PDX is the way to go if your getting more than one (stacking and all that) or if you really care about looks.

Screw it, go with a Brax

 

[rc10mike 10+ year member]

What I noticed about the reviews of the PDX series was that average Joe to the experienced say that its an awesome amp all around, it only seems to be the guys running in SQ comps and such that say it lacks in the low end. The funny thing thing about this, is that theres people that say amps play no role in SQ, all they do is amplify and nothing else..........weird!

 

[Pl8er 5,000+ posts]

What I noticed about the reviews of the PDX series was that average Joe to the experienced say that its an awesome amp all around, it only seems to be the guys running in SQ comps and such that say it lacks in the low end. The funny thing thing about this, is that theres people that say amps play no role in SQ, all they do is amplify and nothing else..........weird!

A GREAT amp should play no role in the sound. In a perfect world an amp just amplifies the signal. The problem is that we can't afford that equipment and we end up getting things added to the signal as it is being increased.

I'm telling you if you want to hear an amp that adds nothing but boosts ALL the sound...check out a Halcro amp (home audio and really high end) I would say the best amp I have ever heard in my entire life! Was running on some smaller Focal Be's

 

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

Just my opinion here, but I don't think you can go wrong with either. It will be hard to find someone who has a Sundown to demo but personally if you could demo them that is your best option. I know that everyone says that power is power, blah blah blah...but trying out amps side by side is the best way to go. You can hear what amp you prefer.
I really like the look of the PDX, and you will get some extra power out of it. Although I've heard from many a sources that the Sundown is underrated. You will most likely get around 125. The looks are a bit more rough around the edges (more of a standard look...for me it doesn't matter, but to some showing them off that matters) I've heard that the sundown sound really good.

Always going to be pro's and cons man but your going to get a quality amp, as you said you already did your homework. Make sure you do a clean install (by this I mean proper installation, deaden everything, and your HU is great, i don't think your amp is going to be too much of a factor.

WOW...ok, so I don't feel like I helped much. PDX is the way to go if your getting more than one (stacking and all that) or if you really care about looks.

Screw it, go with a Brax

Brax?

And yeah basically what you said... I am focusing on the install. Making sure I get everything done well this time. Esspeically the doors.

And physically the only thing that pushes me away from the sundown vs the PDX is size.

Unfortuneatly I have no where to test either amp as my local alpine delear doesnt have any hooked up. though I could probably get them to hook one up for me it still wouldn't be ideal. I wish they could hook it up to the HSK's they ahve then I would really have a good test to go by... sucks living in basically the boonies.

What I noticed about the reviews of the PDX series was that average Joe to the experienced say that its an awesome amp all around, it only seems to be the guys running in SQ comps and such that say it lacks in the low end. The funny thing thing about this, is that theres people that say amps play no role in SQ, all they do is amplify and nothing else..........weird!

Well I found this review

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-5209.html

I read a review of his before this one and he said he didnt like the bottom end but then I found this review and he speaks highly of it (and is comparing it to an audison VRX...) so after reading that I am really thinking of going with the PDX.

Basically from what I am reading the PDX only falls behind in the really lows and in strict SQ comparisons. However I will be putting in my 4 10" PR's at first on my 1000D and upgrading to a couple of 12" DD 2500's later (theres actually a DD dealer here!)

AND he also said the PDX was better then the audison in a few aspects (form factor and power consumption aside). Said the amp does a very good job and keeping busy songs clean and not muddied up. By his description the PDX is exactly what I wan't. Though the audison's warmer sound would appeal to me aswell...

EDIT:

he also said that the poor midbass performance seemed to be install dependent somewhat as he didn't notice it at all in one setup.

Hmm also as an idea... where could I find an Audison VRX 2.250?

 

[gsr22 10+ year member]

Well I already said I probably won't be going active with this car and ive already said im focusing more on the install then the components themselves as my last systems have lacked soley because of the install.
I strive for a balance between SQ and SPL as I realize that going for perfect stereo imaging and ulimate SQ does not really belong in the car. I am waiting till I have a house to do that... also no point in a high SQ setup if I can't turn it up... it is in a car afterall.

Also I don't have anywhere near the money to built my perfect system right away but I can not stay with what I have while I wait for the money so I am doing it in stages. First and for most the install which I am dropping good money into this time around so that whatever I do in the future I have the electrical and insulation to go with it. Thus whatever I get for an amp must be flexible enough to grow with me and my system.

I am starting off with the Memphis coax's cause I have them already because I got them cheap (and I like memphis) and those on deck power are a huge improvement over stock. But I have no low end extension with deck power so I need an amp and I dont see the point on wasting money on a lower power amp when I plan to upgrade to some HSK's hopefully this year. I have heard the HSK's at a local dealer and I liked them. I also listened to the MLK's and they sounded like crap but I assume thats because they werent amped properly. So this will go in stages. I will never know the perfect speaker until I try them in MY car with proper power. No amount of research is going to tell me what speaker will appease my tastes in MY car.

And I have done a lot of research already. And I read the opposite of what you read about the PDX's... that they have good dynamic range but lack in low end control due to the lower damping factor. But I am still reading around however am leaning towards the PDX due to power and size.

Anyone know of any reviews for the 2008 model? Know what's changed?

Do the install yourself

 

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

Do the install yourself

How did you get out of that that I wasn't doing the install myself?

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

CA&E tested the frequency response to be flat from 5hz to 32khz.....so where exactly is this low frequency response disappearing to?

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

CA&E tested the frequency response to be flat from 5hz to 32khz.....so where exactly is this low frequency response disappearing to?

the install? eq? xover? are those not the usual suspects?

 

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

CA&E tested the frequency response to be flat from 5hz to 32khz.....so where exactly is this low frequency response disappearing to?

The response is there its the control. The low damping factor is said to cause less control off the woofer in the lower frequencies.

However I have read quite a few reviews now and chatted with quite a few owners of PDX and other amps and with the same install and speakers and everything some say they heard a difference in the lower end favoring other amps but the mid-highs were amazing. However a few who have played with it a lot found that on some installs they noticed no difference in the low end... no one really knows why. Could just be settings or something I dunno.

But if your running subs more then likely you definitly wouldn't notice any difference at all. As the one guy said that the frequencies affected were around 50hz and below.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

The low damping factor is said to cause less control off the woofer in the lower frequencies.

Nonsense. The PDX amplifiers have a high enough damping factor as to not audibly affect the output.

 

[TurdFergueson2 5,000+ posts]

Bun Bun, what did you end up getting? I picked up a 4.150 today. Was trying to get your opinion if you went with it.

 

[Bun-Bun 10+ year member]

Bun Bun, what did you end up getting? I picked up a 4.150 today. Was trying to get your opinion if you went with it.

Hey sorry I forgot about this thread.

I got a 4.150 from a forum member and thus far I love it! I have only had it in the car for a few days but I had it set up in my computer room before that.

I can not beleive how freaking small this amp is. It is incredible. And it sounds amazing. I now share the feelings with the other people who have reviewed this amp... it is amazing how much sound they got out of this tiny package. The life it brings to my Memphis PR's and M-Class speakers is insane... I can't wait to get some good speakers on this thing!

The biggest thing I have noticed is its control over the speakers. I can take any song that on previous installs would have muddied up my speakers and lost clarity where now I can hear everything crystal clear even cranked all the way up.

I love it and it was a great first purchase on the forums =D