quick question on clipping

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

ok here is the question.

i set my cd player to volume 30/35 and set my gains using a -3db test tone to my speakers to supposedly have 0 clipping at -3db

ok now my cd player clips at volume 27...

CAN this blow out a speaker? or would i have to have the amplifier clipping inorder to do that?

reason i ask is cause after some more testing, i set my gain to give out 300 watts to my pro60's. i set it using 30/35 for volume but i heard jmac say once that alpines shouldnt be used above 26/35 (im guessing cause they clip) after about 30 seconds of playin at my max set volume (30) i started to smell burning coil which from my best guess would be caused by clipping cause...from every experience i have read, the speakers take 300 watts easily. could this cause my cd player is clipping? or is it just my amplifer thats clipping?

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[Worlddre 5,000+ posts]

why not use a 0db test tone?

 

[GrnEydDvl 10+ year member]

If your head unit is indeed clipping it would be a bad thing, especiallly if you are sending those speakers 300 watts and a clipped signal from your head unit.

26/35 is 75% of full volume. Many people use 75% as a good place to aim for.

If you want a test to see if your head unit does start clipping there: turn off your sub amp, turn the gain on your mids/highs amp all the way down, and play a test tone at 1kHz. Then step up the volume on the head unit. You wil hear the tone shift when the head unit starts to clip. You will hear it; instead of just getting louder the sound will change.

I imagine it starts to clip at 26/35. Since you have such high power, relative to your components needs, I would set it so everything starts to clip at that point. Reset your gains at 26/35. Then give it a whirl and see how you like it.

You are fine with a -3dB tone. Music rarely gets to that level and very very rarely beyond it. Just dont play test ones above -3dB at full blast once you have set gains at -3dB.

ok here is the question.
i set my cd player to volume 30/35 and set my gains using a -3db test tone to my speakers to supposedly have 0 clipping at -3db

ok now my cd player clips at volume 27...

CAN this blow out a speaker? or would i have to have the amplifier clipping inorder to do that?

reason i ask is cause after some more testing, i set my gain to give out 300 watts to my pro60's. i set it using 30/35 for volume but i heard jmac say once that alpines shouldnt be used above 26/35 (im guessing cause they clip) after about 30 seconds of playin at my max set volume (30) i started to smell burning coil which from my best guess would be caused by clipping cause...from every experience i have read, the speakers take 300 watts easily. could this cause my cd player is clipping? or is it just my amplifer thats clipping?

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

why not use a 0db test tone?

cause im not using test tones as music. music isnt a straight sine wave, it has peaks and valleys or different levels. -3db is basically considered a good tone to use cause its between the "performance limiting" 0db and the more "risky' -6db tone

 

[DBfan187 5,000+ posts]

-10dB tones, 3:1 gain overlap kicks ass!

 

[GrnEydDvl 10+ year member]

-10dB tones, 3:1 gain overlap kicks ass!

Yes, it does. If David Navone recommends it, it is probably a good idea. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

If you use them just be careful when cranking it and pay attention for signs of stress.

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

-10dB tones, 3:1 gain overlap kicks ass!

hey dbfan, wanted to talk to you. but how can i use -10db tones if i cant even get away with using -3db tones? either im clipping them or overpowering them, and i doubt im overpowering them cause they arent getting that full 300watts all at the same time...how do you make this work DB!!!?

 

[DBfan187 5,000+ posts]

you need an oscope to see where your deck clips. you should also look into the Autosound 2000 disk, CD#104

also sounds like your amp is broken. Did you try to set the gains with all processing off? (everything set to 0, xovers turned off)

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

you need an oscope to see where your deck clips. you should also look into the Autosound 2000 disk, CD#104
also sounds like your amp is broken. Did you try to set the gains with all processing off? (everything set to 0, xovers turned off)

ahh, no i did it with my xovers set to where i wanted them. but, thats weird, the amp is brand new and it has those little clip indicators like i tlked about in the last thread. but you think its also possible that the HU could be clipping?

 

[DBfan187 5,000+ posts]

you should try it with all processing off prior to setting.

 

[Rattlebrain 10+ year member]

I asked this question over in the Gain setting thread but no one would answer so I thought I would do a little thread jacking and ask it here. Its related to the topic being discussed.

OK this may sound like a Noob question but....Is it the HU or the amp that initiates clipping?

What I mean is, my HU volume goes up to 35. It starts to distort around 28.(currently nothing is amped and no sub) If I set the gains with the HU at that volume, wouldn't you be able to turn the gains to 100%?

I am have a hard time here trying to figure out how to ask this question.

I guess what I'm asking is does the amp send the clipped signal to the speakers or is it the HU or is it both?

So if you were to never turn the HU above 28, couldn't you run the amp at 100% gain?

Sorry for the possibly stupid question but it is something I've wondered about and am a bit confused about.

 

[thch 10+ year member]

either one. but ideally only the HU.

any signal processor has limits.

for instance, turing the bass boost and such up on the HU and cranking the volume will result is some type of clipped signal.

same goes for the amp.

if the hu is sufficiently low, you can turn the gain up all the way. but if you run speakers from the HU, you will end up with little sound from the speakers because the HU is turned down.

this is very common on the streets "this amp is awesome, just listen to how loud it gets at only 10 of 30 on my HU!" of course increaseing the volume to 15/30 results in unbearable distortion...

 

[GrnEydDvl 10+ year member]

I asked this question over in the Gain setting thread but no one would answer so I thought I would do a little thread jacking and ask it here. Its related to the topic being discussed.

As stated in the other reply, either a HU or an Amp can clip. Where you seem to be confused is matching the gain input on the amp to the output on your deck. Perhaps an example will help.

If your deck starts to clip at say 30 out of 35 on your volume on the deck and puts out 4 volts at that point with a 0 dB tone, you will want to set the gain on your amp to clip near 4 volts of input. This will most likely not be near max gain on the amp. Max gain is often closer to 200 mV.

For example my JL amps have an input range of 200mV - 8V. 8V's being all the way counterclockwise in High Input mode. 200mV being the knob turned all the way clockwise in Low Input mode. Remember, turning the gain down makes the amp less sensitive and makes it need a higher input voltage.

This example will get you no gain overlap that was mentioned earlier in this thread. To achieve gain overlap you can use -3dB, -6dB, or -10dB tones.

I recommend having some gain overlap to get the most out of your system.

You can find step by step instructions on setting your gains in a sticky in the Amplifier forum on this site.