ok. i have 2 12" alumq (smooth aluminum cone ,no flames //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif ) which was supposed to be thier old sq oriented sub. and its far from that haha. they do get loud for the money you could have something better.. ive had these on ~250wrms a piece when theyre rated for 1000RMS and they move alot but i could easily make the bottom out //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eyebrow.gif.fe2c18d8720fe8c7eaed347b21ea05a5.gif