Bigbangtheory........?

[Rashaddd 5,000+ posts]

Actually, I should further clarify: I think there are three main arguments.
1) Can it be known? It's the epistemological question, Ie.gnostic or agnostic

2) Does God exist? It's the theological question, Ie. theist or atheist

3) Is the individual religion (or the collective religions) sensible? Ie. religious or irreligious

1. It is impossible to know in certainty until there is no longer any value in believing vs knowing.

2. Explained by (1), it seems

3. Not necessarily relevant

 

[mike11202 10+ year member]

There are thousands of religions worldwide.. some believe there is one god, some believe in many gods, some believe god is a part of everything, some believe the sun is, and some don't believe god exists.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

1. It is impossible to know in certainty until there is no longer any value in believing vs knowing.
2. Explained by (1), it seems

3. Not necessarily relevant

I find much value in knowing...but again, that is based off payoff. Not my best interests.

 

[Customkilla23]

I don't know. Furthermore, if God is real, he is so great I cannot understand it even if I saw it. So, I am stuck and left with the faith that acting in my best interest is a good thing. And that God will reward me with eternal salvation based on me doing good things. I consider myself Agnostic leaning believing out of convienance.

If god is real, what would be his explanation to why he created us? It really is cheesy in a way for some reason, no matter how hard i try, i can't think of a reason we would be created. There is no point.

There are thousands of religions worldwide.. some believe there is one god, some believe in many gods, some believe god is a part of everything, some believe the sun is, and some don't believe god exists.

another reason why religion doesn't make sense. Why can't there just be one religion if the bible is supposed to be factual text?

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

If god is real, what would be his explanation to why he created us? It really is cheesy in a way for some reason, no matter how hard i try, i can't think of a reason we would be created. There is no point.

The point would be to worship him. Futurama explored this notion.

 

[Customkilla23]

The point would be to worship him. Futurama explored this notion.

that is rediculous.

 

[Rashaddd 5,000+ posts]

But nobody can prove that happened... anyone can make up a huge story and change the actual events that happened over time.
Like some of Homer's stories and traditional ones, they are created to teach lessons and peace.

I never said it was necessarily true, or it couldn't have been made up...hell, its also possible that all of these things ARE made up by man, yet at the same time for there to actually be a God.

I don't know. Furthermore, if God is real, he is so great I cannot understand it even if I saw it. So, I am stuck and left with the faith that acting in my best interest is a good thing. And that God will reward me with eternal salvation based on me doing good things. I consider myself Agnostic leaning believing out of convienance.

True, and it is good to see someone who is as aware as you are about your standpoint and the dilemma. I believe that at some point, perhaps later in life, faith will come to you.

No, then we are both conceited. I am conceited because I believe choice creates value. He is conceited because the belief system is based on choice. Without choice, neither of us have value. With choice, we both have value....perhaps a symbiotic relationship...I think we are on to something here.

Agreed. Other than the fact that assuming he exists, he has value regardless of anything we conclude, as held true by the bolded claim above.

 

[Rashaddd 5,000+ posts]

I find much value in knowing...but again, that is based off payoff. Not my best interests.

There is value in knowing (depending on your standpoint), but I was saying it is impossible to know until it no longer matters whether you know or not, because you cannot use it to your advantage when you are dead.

 

[mike11202 10+ year member]

I still believe fear has a big thing to do with this.

For example, the acient aztecs would prick there penis for sacrificial blood letting to the "Gods" in exchange for successful growing seasons and water etc.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

I never said it was necessarily true, or it couldn't have been made up...hell, its also possible that all of these things ARE made up by man, yet at the same time for there to actually be a God.

I brought this point up before in the thread. It didn't gain much traction though.

True, and it is good to see someone who is as aware as you are about your standpoint and the dilemma. I believe that at some point, perhaps later in life, faith will come to you.
Agreed. Other than the fact that assuming he exists, he has value regardless of anything we conclude, as held true by the bolded claim above.

Indeed. I think it's human nature to seek a conclusion. My argument doesn't have a conclusion...perhaps faith is what leads to a conclusion.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

There is value in knowing (depending on your standpoint), but I was saying it is impossible to know until it no longer matters whether you know or not, because you cannot use it to your advantage when you are dead.

Indeed. And therein lies my problem.

 

[Rashaddd 5,000+ posts]

If god is real, what would be his explanation to why he created us? It really is cheesy in a way for some reason, no matter how hard i try, i can't think of a reason we would be created. There is no point.

The idea is he knows better than us, and is incomprehensibly greater than us. The fact that you dont see his point is like comparing a toddler to the guy who wrote the book on quantum physics, in the understanding of that material.

 

[Customkilla23]

The idea is he knows better than us, and is incomprehensibly greater than us. The fact that you dont see his point is like comparing a toddler to the guy who wrote the book on quantum physics, in the understanding of that material.

even if it is real, it still sounds stretched. i think there is a better chance of us being created from creationism than god.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

even if it is real, it still sounds stretched. i think there is a better chance of us being created from creationism than god.

wtf?

 

[Rashaddd 5,000+ posts]

Indeed. I think it's human nature to seek a conclusion. My argument doesn't have a conclusion...perhaps faith is what leads to a conclusion.

It sounds like faith is the conclusion //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Indeed. And therein lies my problem.

Comes back to the basis of what you believe in. Selfish intention? Or the desire to do what is right? (which is a whole other equally debatable concept in itself)