Beginner installing new sound

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

Hi guys,

Over the summer I want to install a new sound system in the Jeep. I have been looking high and low, but I cannot find any kind of beginner's guide on doing this.

I have done what research I can, but most of it's very confusing and I was hoping you could help.

I want to install 5 speakers: 2 front 4x6s, two rear, and a subwoofer. I know I am going to need an amp, which I have, as well as a head unit. Both are Kenwood. I forget the HU, but the amp is model number KAC-846. I don't know what the output power or anything is. I do know it's a 4 channel; will a subwoofer still work with this? The head unit has RCA jacks in the rear.

Where I am having most of my trouble is with what speakers are compatible with each other, the head unit, and the amo. Where do watts play into the picture? If a speaker uses, for example, 150 watts, do I need less than or equal to 150 watts of power going into the speaker?

I have to run right now. If I think of anything else I'll edit this.

Thanks for reading guys.

Click to read more...

 

[okiedokie 10+ year member]

lets start from the beginnig, what is your budget????

kenwood products are ok,

look into pioners, alpines, eclpise. for head untis.

first you need to find out what comps you want, then you can look into watts from there,

i would buy a front comps only, no rear comps, then add a sub with a sub amp.

you will need deadener as well,

 

[x1le 10+ year member]

Where I am having most of my trouble is with what speakers are compatible with each other, the head unit, and the amo. Where do watts play into the picture? If a speaker uses, for example, 150 watts, do I need less than or equal to 150 watts of power going into the speaker?

The watts rms of the head unit doesn't really affect anything since you will be running a separate amp, so forget about that. It's best to try and match up the rms of the speakers to your amp as close as possible. For example if your amp will push 40rms x 4 it's best to purchase some 40rms speakers, or close to it. Underpowering or overpowering a little won't kill you. And you will be able to run a subwoofer off of the 4channel if you bridge 2 of the channels together, however it isn't ideal.

Where in mass are you located?

 

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

lets start from the beginnig, what is your budget????kenwood products are ok,

look into pioners, alpines, eclpise. for head untis.

first you need to find out what comps you want, then you can look into watts from there,

i would buy a front comps only, no rear comps, then add a sub with a sub amp.

you will need deadener as well,

I am hoping to stay around $300. I'm not looking for the best thing money can buy but I got all of my audio components for free that I'm currently using. From looking around, $300 isn't going to get me a whole lot.

I actually have another Kenwood HU, and I think a SONY, and something like panasonic or pioneer HUs. I'm hoping I can use what I have.

Does the deadener serve any purpose besides keeping the sound inside? I'm driving a Jeep wrangler with a soft and sometimes no top.

The watts rms of the head unit doesn't really affect anything since you will be running a separate amp, so forget about that. It's best to try and match up the rms of the speakers to your amp as close as possible. For example if your amp will push 40rms x 4 it's best to purchase some 40rms speakers, or close to it. Underpowering or overpowering a little won't kill you.

Ok. My HU, stock, puts out 45Wx4. Theoretically, if I bought 4 speakers that were 40W, what would happen? What if they were like 150 watt?

RMS Watts: is that the same watts as listed in item descriptions? From reading, I believe there are two type of watts and RMS is the one that matters.

And you will be able to run a subwoofer off of the 4channel if you bridge 2 of the channels together, however it isn't ideal.

Do you mean off of the 4 channel head unit or the 4 channel amp? When you mean bridging, is that basically splicing two channels together? I'm assuming that would double the output power then? I'm not too concerned about ideal, I'm more concerned about what will work with what I have.

If bridging is using two channels to power one sub is the same thing as okie was talking about, you're suggesting I should run two "comps" and one sub?

I think the amp I have outputs 4x100W, or two at 150W. So I guess I would be getting 100W to the two front speakers and 200W to the sub, right? Will the be enough juice to get good sound? I figure it will be an improvement over 2x45.

Thanks for the replies so far guys.

Where in mass are you located?

Ipswich. It's near Gloucester.

 

[x1le 10+ year member]

Does the deadener serve any purpose besides keeping the sound inside? I'm driving a Jeep wrangler with a soft and sometimes no top.

deadener's not only help with improving sound quality, it's meant to basically eliminate all rattles where applied.

RMS Watts: is that the same watts as listed in item descriptions? From reading, I believe there are two type of watts and RMS is the one that matters.

everything you read is going to have max and rms watts. forget about max - pretend it doesn't exist. Rms is all you should care about.

Do you mean off of the 4 channel head unit or the 4 channel amp? When you mean bridging, is that basically splicing two channels together? I'm assuming that would double the output power then?

The amp. And you're right about bridging, only you don't physically splice the wires. It's just the way you wire up your output. And it will increase the power, however in most cases it won't double it.

If bridging is using two channels to power one sub is the same thing as okie was talking about, you're suggesting I should run two "comps" and one sub?

Most people on the forum will tell you to just run a quality pair of component speakers in the front, and forget the rear doors. You would be able to run the sub and components with the amp, however just don't expect heart pounding base.

I think the amp I have outputs 4x100W

amp is 50w rms x 4 @ 4ohms

Ipswich. It's near Gloucester.

About an hour and a half away from me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[SoccaCrazy24 10+ year member]

I am hoping to stay around $300. I'm not looking for the best thing money can buy but I got all of my audio components for free that I'm currently using. From looking around, $300 isn't going to get me a whole lot.
I actually have another Kenwood HU, and I think a SONY, and something like panasonic or pioneer HUs. I'm hoping I can use what I have.

I got a couple of questions for ya...

1) What type of setup are you looking for? Something with a lot of bass? Something that sounds really good just has a little added bass? or something that the quality sounds really good no matter how hard the bass is?

2) Will this be a DIY project? Are you going to be wiring this yourself? do you already have the wiring? make sure you can calculate this into cost...

Once answering these I will probably help you find some deals or whatever ya need, i'll just post some links to some speakers/subs/whatever....

 

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

The watts rms of the head unit doesn't really affect anything since you will be running a separate amp, so forget about that. It's best to try and match up the rms of the speakers to your amp as close as possible. For example if your amp will push 40rms x 4 it's best to purchase some 40rms speakers, or close to it. Underpowering or overpowering a little won't kill you. And you will be able to run a subwoofer off of the 4channel if you bridge 2 of the channels together, however it isn't ideal.
Where in mass are you located?

Ok I have new information. I finally found the owner's manual for my amp online.

So I know I should only pay attention to RMS watts, how do I know what the Watts RMS is on my amp?

http://inform3.kenwoodusa.com/manuals%5Ckac746.pdf

The technical specifications are located on the last page, which do include output Watts, but I don't know whether or not they are RMS or not. Is the rated power output the RMS?

 

[SoccaCrazy24 10+ year member]

Ok I have new information. I finally found the owner's manual for my amp online.
So I know I should only pay attention to RMS watts, how do I know what the Watts RMS is on my amp?

http://inform3.kenwoodusa.com/manuals%5Ckac746.pdf

The technical specifications are located on the last page, which do include output Watts, but I don't know whether or not they are RMS or not. Is the rated power output the RMS?

Well if I am not mistaken your RMS power output is 4 x 50W Peak at 4 ohms.

I know I may not be the best to answer this, but what you can do is run 2 decent front component speakers off of 2 channels at 50W RMS assuming speakers are 4 ohm, and allow your 2 rear component (doesn't have to be great just enough to handle good sound quality) off of your H/U (Rear connections)... then run a decent sub with 4 ohms, at a RMS peak around 150 Watts.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

A couple questions to help out, assuming you are getting a sub, you need a box... if so are you going to have a box built for free? or paying? sub and box could run you almost 300 itself sometimes... do you already have wires for your setup? another thing, you may not need rear speakers either... but will help in keeping sound quality.

oh and what jeep that way we can figure out the size speakers need... like year and model..

 

[SoccaCrazy24 10+ year member]

Did a little research for ya...

want a 10" sub here's a good one with box... http://www.crutchfield.com/p_575R1L1X10/Rockford-Fosgate-Prime-R1L-1X10.html?tp=112

wnat a 12" sub here's a good one with box... http://www.crutchfield.com/p_575R1L1X12/Rockford-Fosgate-Prime-R1L-1X12.html?tp=112

and since I don't the size for your speakers, I didnt look any up for that...

 

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

First of all, thank you for finding those subs for me. That's a really great price.

Well if I am not mistaken your RMS power output is 4 x 50W Peak at 4 ohms.
I know I may not be the best to answer this, but what you can do is run 2 decent front component speakers off of 2 channels at 50W RMS assuming speakers are 4 ohm, and allow your 2 rear component (doesn't have to be great just enough to handle good sound quality) off of your H/U (Rear connections)... then run a decent sub with 4 ohms, at a RMS peak around 150 Watts.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

A couple questions to help out, assuming you are getting a sub, you need a box... if so are you going to have a box built for free? or paying? sub and box could run you almost 300 itself sometimes... do you already have wires for your setup? another thing, you may not need rear speakers either... but will help in keeping sound quality.

oh and what jeep that way we can figure out the size speakers need... like year and model..

I actually have another thread so I forgot to mention a couple things. It's a 91 Jeep wrangler, so there isn't a lot of space.

Right now, I'm planning on using the amp I currently have and run four speakers off of it: 2 4x6 coaxials (in the dash), and two component speakers somewhere else. I may purchase an empty sound bar and put the component speakers in myself or I may make a sound bar. If I don't go the sound bar route I will make a couple small boxes that mount above the rear wheel wells.

When I have a job over the summer (just got laid off), and have more money, I will get a subwoofer and an amp for the subwoofer itself. It seems more logical than to try to exploit every available resource out of the current amp I have. When I get the subwoofer, I will make the box myself. The only "custom" boxes for my Jeep YJ cost an arm and a leg and since I'm a carpenter I'll be fine.

I was wondering about wiring. Apparently it's expensive too. I have looked at a bunch of sites and cannot find audio wiring. Looking through the Owners manual for my amp, it said something like 4-6 gauge wiring from the battery and ground. Do I need special car audio wiring, or can I go out, but the components myself and solder the connections on myself?

If I get a nice 4 speaker set up, without the sub, at 50 watts RMS, and then I put in a sub at more than 50 watts RMS, would the subwoofer overpower the rest of the audio?

And could someone recommend me quality brands? Just looking through the component speakers on one of the links from the home page (caraudio.com), there are a lot of speakers at 50 watts RMS, ranging from $40 to a couple hundred dollars. I have learned that I get what I pay for, but are some companies just raising the price because they are a bigshot company?

 

[bigbangtheory 5,000+ posts]

I would run one of your decks, most are fine for what you are trying to do to stay with in your budget.

Should be able to find a nice set of budget comps and some rear highs for under 200 smacks. Check into the Pioneer Premier 720c's. Love them and have had them in two installs now in the last year. Can be had for a little over 100 dollars. Then amp all those speakers to get the full potential out of them off the Kenwood and once you get back to working, then hit up a decent sub and enclosure. Just remember a good enclosure is just as if not more important than the sub itself.

But.....if you don't want to wait, then use 2 of your channels for the fronts, run the rears off the HU and the other channels on the sub for a little bump.

Is up to you, just trying to help.

 

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

I would run one of your decks, most are fine for what you are trying to do to stay with in your budget.
Should be able to find a nice set of budget comps and some rear highs for under 200 smacks. Check into the Pioneer Premier 720c's. Love them and have had them in two installs now in the last year. Can be had for a little over 100 dollars. Then amp all those speakers to get the full potential out of them off the Kenwood and once you get back to working, then hit up a decent sub and enclosure. Just remember a good enclosure is just as if not more important than the sub itself.

But.....if you don't want to wait, then use 2 of your channels for the fronts, run the rears off the HU and the other channels on the sub for a little bump.

Is up to you, just trying to help.

That's really great advice, thanks. Thanks for the recommendation, too. There are so many different types of speakers out there, it's hard to find a good product.

What do you mean by rear highs? I'm assuming they are smaller speakers mounted further back? Because if that's the case Jeep's got it all backasswards. The 4x6s are mounted in the dash, with no real place for any other speakers besides an after market sound bar.

Just remember a good enclosure is just as if not more important than the sub itself.

I see a lot of enclosures are being made out of MDF fiberboard. Is there any reason to use that?

 

[t1990le 10+ year member]

You can use any other type of wood, but MDF usually wields the best results.

x2 on the Box being important. Hit up one of the box builders on the forum when you get a sub and they can help you sketch a design and help you figure out how to port it into spec.

I agree with the above statements about the 4 channel going to a good pair of from 4x6s and using your HU to power some pair of comps in the back of u jeep.

And no, a 50 watt sub will not over power your 50 speakers. I have 4 6x8s in my truck running off of 40watts each and i have 2 12" subwoofers that see about 500 watt each and they match my music fairly well.

 

[SoccaCrazy24 10+ year member]

But.....if you don't want to wait, then use 2 of your channels for the fronts, run the rears off the HU and the other channels on the sub for a little bump.

Like I said Ringwood, that will probably be the best scenario for you.

Amp controls 2 solid component speakers in the front and one of those subs I recommended... and the H/U controls the rear.

Also, Wiring shouldn't be too expensive. You are welcome to get a set from Best Buy, or wherever cheapest. I think they are called guage kits.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130294646220&category=14936&_trksid=p2773.m263&_trkparms=algo%3DSIC%26its%3DI%252BC%26itu%3DUA%252BIA%252BUCI%26otn%3D39%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D54

that should be a pretty decent 4x6 pair (and yes sonix electronic is very good dealing with warranty issues/problems and it's fairly cheaper in price).

You do what you think would be necessary for your rears.

 

[Ringwood 10+ year member]

I agree with the above statements about the 4 channel going to a good pair of from 4x6s and using your HU to power some pair of comps in the back of u jeep.

Like I said Ringwood, that will probably be the best scenario for you.Amp controls 2 solid component speakers in the front and one of those subs I recommended... and the H/U controls the rear.

Ok. So the front two channels of the power amp would control the front 4x6s, and the rear two channels would be bridged for the sub? And then the head unit would power the component speakers?

I'm having trouble understand why I wouldn't want the amp to control the component speakers. Would the head unit have enough power? It's rated at 4x45W, but I've read that it would probably be like 20 watts RMS.