4 10's Or 1 15

[negativezeroz 5,000+ posts]

No, Thats a common misconseption. It's been discussed to death. The thing that will determine "playing low/high" will be the box.
Speaker size will not effect the low lows. You should hear how low my 8's go

what 8's do you have? Jw..cuz I want to get two 8's this summer...RL-I8's, RE8's or GTO804's..dont know yet..

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

what 8's do you have? Jw..cuz I want to get two 8's this summer...RL-I8's, RE8's or GTO804's..dont know yet..

I've had Xsite, Hx2, RE8 and now a buddy has 2 RL-I8's But I'm running them in my car for now.

These RL-I8's are freakin insane!

 

[req 5,000+ posts]

a tweeter can play as low as a parthenon.

the question is, can you HEAR it - the SPL is so low, that it will barely output any sound.

the reason why the misconception exists, is because people compare ONE 15 to ONE 10, when in all actuality, a PAIR of 10's will equal the cone area of the 15 (roughly - more like a 13~14 lol)... the whole idea is, the response is THERE - you just dont move enough air to hear it.

all the speaker has to do is move 10 times (in-out) per second to play a 10hz tone.

i feel comfertable saying, all speakers can do this. but not a the SPL (PRESSURE LEVEL) of a 15, or 18.

on the flip side, the 18 CAN play a 1000hz tone, but it wont be as loud, because the cone does not move far enough to push enough air because its struggling to push the cone. it CAN play those tones - just not enough SPL to hear //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

to proove this point with a woofer, set all EQ to 0 and all filters to flat\off. play a high note, and lightly touch the cone. does it move? WOAH! its playing that note!!

im sure it would work with a tweet the same way.

 

[NJack2AF 10+ year member]

a tweeter can play as low as a parthenon.
the question is, can you HEAR it - the SPL is so low, that it will barely output any sound.

the reason why the misconception exists, is because people compare ONE 15 to ONE 10, when in all actuality, a PAIR of 10's will equal the cone area of the 15 (roughly - more like a 13~14 lol)... the whole idea is, the response is THERE - you just dont move enough air to hear it.

all the speaker has to do is move 10 times (in-out) per second to play a 10hz tone.

i feel comfertable saying, all speakers can do this. but not a the SPL (PRESSURE LEVEL) of a 15, or 18.

on the flip side, the 18 CAN play a 1000hz tone, but it wont be as loud, because the cone does not move far enough to push enough air because its struggling to push the cone. it CAN play those tones - just not enough SPL to hear //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

to proove this point with a woofer, set all EQ to 0 and all filters to flat\off. play a high note, and lightly touch the cone. does it move? WOAH! its playing that note!!

im sure it would work with a tweet the same way.

That hits what I was thinking on the head... I just wasn't thinking about the collective area of 4 10's compared to 1 15"... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif So I was kinda right!

Well... not really //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/mad.gif.c18f003ab0ef8a0d9c27ca78d77a6392.gif

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

But we were not talking about output. Just the shear fact of a larger sub going lower.
I could have a 10 play lower than a 18 but of course it will not be as loud. It's a smaller sub.

I know you wanted to chime in with your wisdom but it was kind of OT.

Wow another thread you are trying to flame me in... you're like some little fly buzzing around my ears. I just wanted to chime in with my wisdom eh? *sigh* Guess I have to spell it out for you...

I bet the 15 would get lower tho, and the 10's would probably be a lil louder...

To which you replied:

Getting lower will be box dependent...

Which is true, to an extent. But if you want to discuss what's off topic, box dependancy is. We aren't comparing boxes, he wants to compare raw drivers and their capabilities. If you want to discuss which will probably get lower in terms of cone area (as was suggested a 15 would get lower due to cone area), in fact the four 10's will have MORE CONE AREA and thus in those terms will likely play lower. Even Jack's response to you implied this confuses him:

Yeah but wont bigger drivers get lower still than smaller ones? And smaller ones will get higher? Since the bigger one is more difficult to move as fast and the smaller one is more difficult to move as slow? I remember reading something like that somewhere... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

And yet now you are trying to imply Im just being a blowhard know it all by explaining that you actually would add the cone area's together in an array of smaller speakers when comparing to one larger one? Jack even said later that this is the exact point he was confused on:

I just wasn't thinking about the collective area of 4 10's compared to 1 15"...

So... if you dont get the correlation between your conversation with Jack, and my comments, its not because there wasn't one, its because you simply could not see it. Or, maybe you just wanted to take a cheap and unjustifiable shot at me. *shrug*

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

Dude what are you on. It still remains that a 15 will not play a lower note than a 10. That is box dependant. WOW.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Dude what are you on. It still remains that a 15 will not play a lower note than a 10. That is box dependant. WOW.

Hmmm... a 15 will not play a lower note than a 10. I dont even know what that means.

And contrary to popular belief, low end extension is displacement dependant, not enclosure dependant. The size of the speaker cone,its excursion AND the enclosure size/type all factor into a speaker's low end output. You really should do a little reading on the subject man.

edit: oh and I notice you are now ignoring the point I made about adding cone areas together. First you say Im OT and just acting smart, but when I spell out how my comments fit the conversation to a T, you try to move on to some other point. Clearly you are most interested in trying to find a flame that will stick, not actually make any valid point.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Hmmm... a 15 will not play a lower note than a 10. I dont even know what that means.
And contrary to popular belief, low end extension is displacement dependant, not enclosure dependant. The size of the speaker cone,its excursion AND the enclosure size/type all factor into a speaker's low end output. You really should do a little reading on the subject man.

Low frequency extension is not displacement dependent, it is box dependent. Low frequency OUTPUT, however, is displacement dependent. Will a 10" play just as low as a 15" (all things equal)? Absolutely. Will the 10" have as much output as a 15" at 15hz (all things equal)? No.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Low frequency extension is not displacement dependent, it is box dependent. Low frequency OUTPUT, however, is displacement dependent. Will a 10" play just as low as a 15" (all things equal)? Absolutely. Will the 10" have as much output as a 15" at 15hz (all things equal)? No.

Hmm then what do you mean by low frequency extension? Just how low a sub will go in a vented system with no SSF?

Let me explain myself, I realize even a tweeter will play 20hz. But when I say low end extension, Im speaking in terms of output at the lowest octaves. Sorry, I thought that was obvious. My bad.

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

Audioholic.

Maybe you just don't understand what I am trying to explain.

A 15" speaker will not play any lower than a 10" speaker.

I never said anything about output. Or cone area. Plain and simple a 15 will not play any lower than a 10. Thats it. Nothing else was being discussed tell you chimed in...

 

[NJack2AF 10+ year member]

Heh... thanks audioholic... My questions have been answered //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif I'll just sit back and watch the flaming continue...

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Audioholic.
Maybe you just don't understand what I am trying to explain.

A 15" speaker will not play any lower than a 10" speaker.

I never said anything about output. Or cone area. Plain and simple a 15 will not play any lower than a 10. Thats it. Nothing else was being discussed tell you chimed in...

Its funny you act like my comments were completely unjustified, yet there is Jack thanking me for explaining his questions to him. rofl Dude just stop, you aren't doing anything good by these tactics with me. I really have no idea what your issue is with me, but Im growing bored of it, and you.

Have a nice day.

Jack, glad I was able to help. Sorry about all the bullshit that's come along with it. I wont reply to trigger anymore here unless its a useful conversation.

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

Heh... thanks audioholic... My questions have been answered //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif I'll just sit back and watch the flaming continue...

Audioholic did not answer your question. You thought a 15" driver played lower notes than a 10" driver. And a 10" driver played higher notes than a 15" driver.

Because the 15" driver has so much mass it moves slower. And the 10" has less mass so it moves faster and will play higher frequencys.

I tried to explain that this was wrong with out calling you a loser. And just informing you that frequencys played by either size driver was box dependant.

Then audioholic chimmed in with output by different sized speakers. This was not your original question was it not?

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

Its funny you act like my comments were completely unjustified, yet there is Jack thanking me for explaining his questions to him.

You did not answer his question. Read his post. He thought a 15" driver would play lower than a 10" driver. Not if the 15" would have more output than the 10" driver on low frequencys. So no you did not help him.

 

[T9X 10+ year member]

Summary -

Speaker A will play subsonic frequencies just as low as Speaker B. One may play lower frequencies louder because of several other factors (enclosure, power, cone area, displacement, ect.). That's all, good game, please play again, it's over, thanks for trying. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif