What is?

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

That’s not accurate. Many people lost their jobs over this or resigned, especially in the healthcare industry. You’re playing fast and loose with the history now. What was vaccine confidence in 2012? For any number to be an accurate metric, you must know what vax confidence in 2017, 2018 and 2019 was. Is this all vaccines, or just the covid vax? I don’t see any extra “right wing” anything on my social media that wasn’t there before. That sounds like a NBC talking point to me.

For clarity's sake, I never supported the vaccine mandate. People resigned; if they weren't willing to use the religious exemption for whatever reason, that's on them. I do feel bad for them, but they had an option. I work in healthcare and my wife has worked in healthcare for decades, so I'm well aware of what options healthcare workers did or didn't have. Military personnel lost their jobs over the mandate. One of the great things about the country is our legal system and division/limitation of power. If you'd like I could pull up some articles on how the courts limited Biden's vaccine mandate.

Yes, for that metric to be accurate, I would have to know previous numbers and I'm referring to general vaccine confidence. Again this is something that can be easily documented and I assumed this was common knowledge.

I didn't say that you/we are being tagged on social media and neither did NBC. What I did say is that big social media corporations deplatformed right wing speech; again I assumed this is common knowledge and beyond dispute.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

It really was an option...the media did a really nice job of framing as the beginning of Stephen king's The Stand.

I completely disagree. People would have raised hell if Trump (and other world leaders) would have come out and said, "Yeah we know we're filling freezer trucks with dead bodies in NYC, but give it the normal 5-10 years and we'll have a vaccine for everybody." It was a shytty situation with nothing but a bunch of shyt "solutions" to choose from.

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

They should have said "Hey, there is a virus spreading across the globe. It's potentially bad for some people. We are rushing a possibly helpful injection that may work to ease the symptoms. We don't know if it will help everyone but it might help some. We hope natural immunity will also be beneficial but if you think this injection might help you please contact your medical provider."

 

[SlugButter]

For clarity's sake, I never supported the vaccine mandate. People resigned; if they weren't willing to use the religious exemption for whatever reason, that's on them. I do feel bad for them, but they had an option. I work in healthcare and my wife has worked in healthcare for decades, so I'm well aware of what options healthcare workers did or didn't have. Military personnel lost their jobs over the mandate. One of the great things about the country is our legal system and division/limitation of power. If you'd like I could pull up some articles on how the courts limited Biden's vaccine mandate.

Yes, for that metric to be accurate, I would have to know previous numbers and I'm referring to general vaccine confidence. Again this is something that can be easily documented and I assumed this was common knowledge.

I didn't say that you/we are being tagged on social media and neither did NBC. What I did say is that big social media corporations deplatformed right wing speech; again I assumed this is common knowledge and beyond dispute.

Your assumptions of common knowledge? the Antivax movement started with the vegan liberals and conservative Christians. The assumption that it is just right wingers is absolutely wrong. It only recently became “right wing” to fit a political narrative. Granola eating leftie antivaxers have been a big part of the movement since the 60s. This is what I’m saying. The assumptions are bullshit. What’s a leftie granola eating liberal who doesn’t want a vaccine supposed to do? Is common knowledge just what’s limited to what’s seen on social media?

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Your assumptions of common knowledge? the Antivax movement started with the vegan liberals and conservative Christians. The assumption that it is just right wingers is absolutely wrong. It only recently became “right wing” to fit a political narrative. Granola eating leftie antivaxers have been a big part of the movement since the 60s. This is what I’m saying. The assumptions are bullshit. What’s a leftie granola eating liberal who doesn’t want a vaccine supposed to do? Is common knowledge just what’s limited to what’s seen on social media?

I didn't mean to imply that the Antivax movement was entirely right wing. What I intended to convey was that the big social media companies took the opportunity to suppress other right wing speech as well when they attacked antivax speech. So for clarity's sake, I assume it's common knowledge that the antivax movement gained members after the covid disinformation campaigns.

 

[SlugButter]

I didn't mean to imply that the Antivax movement was entirely right wing. What I intended to convey was that the big social media companies took the opportunity to suppress other right wing speech as well when they attacked antivax speech. So for clarity's sake, I assume it's common knowledge that the antivax movement gained members after the covid disinformation campaigns.

Yeah. That’s true. The disinformation campaigns are very confusing. Big pharma stands to gain billions of dollars from a pro-vaccine campaign, but who is making the billions of dollars on the anti-vax side? It’s just odd to not question the side making a stupid amount of money, yet hold the side with far less monetary interests feet to the fire on “facts”.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Yeah. That’s true. The disinformation campaigns are very confusing. Big pharma stands to gain billions of dollars from a pro-vaccine campaign, but who is making the billions of dollars on the anti-vax side? It’s just odd to not question the side making a stupid amount of money, yet hold the side with far less monetary interests feet to the fire on “facts”.

Big Pharma acted as expected – they took full advantage of a once in a lifetime opportunity. Personally, I was apprehensive about the vax – mainly because of the mRNA tech. Nevertheless, when the first batches of data came out ~March-April, it looked safe to me and Covid was definitely deadly, so I opted for the vax. That’s the standard I held Big Pharma/Money to. Big Pharma/Money was held accountable; they had go thru the expedited trials, the results of the vaccine are public. The Covid pandemic was the most covered event in human history, so anybody that wanted to get grasp on this had the opportunity to do so.

Unfortunately, the anti-vax side engaged in a pretty aggressive disinformation campaign and it was clearly disinformation, making it pretty easy for social media (and gov’t) to justify deplatforming them, setting a horrible precedent and creating further divide and creating greater distrust in gov’t.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I don't understand how you'd say there's an antivax disinformation campaign, when big pharma is a huge media sponsor and social media was heavily censored to favor selling vaccines . Most antivaxxers were smaller institutions or groups or just individuals, not people with the power of billion dollar multi-national corporations or entire governments and their agencies.

The experiment still isn't over, yet, either.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

I don't understand how you'd say there's an antivax disinformation campaign, when big pharma is a huge media sponsor and social media was heavily censored to favor selling vaccines . Most antivaxxers were smaller institutions or groups or just individuals, not people with the power of billion dollar multi-national corporations or entire governments and their agencies.

The experiment still isn't over, yet, either.

I'm saying there isn't a antivax disinformation campaign, because there isn't one. The data on the vax (good, bad and ugly) has been made very public, that's not disinformation, that's information.

 

[SlugButter]

I'm saying there isn't a antivax disinformation campaign, because there isn't one. The data on the vax (good, bad and ugly) has been made very public, that's not disinformation, that's information.

I’d tell everyone the vax is full of rat shit if I thought it would help keep a government patsy from stabbing me with drugs. I will lie all day long and spread disinformation far and wide over this, and not care at all. The only thing I would gain is my autonomy. No profit. You care more about the misinformation from people who have no profit to gain than holding the people who make billions accountable for their incomplete information. If the “information” is so easily obtained from these vaccine trials, then tell me where I can find the blood type that’s has the most adverse reactions? Does type AB have less reactions to the vaccine than type O+ does, for instance? Do you think you could actually find this information if it was important to you? And when you can’t find it, would you spread disinformation to try to protect yourself?

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

Just think, if healthcare was free how much less misinformation/disinformation talk there would be.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

I’d tell everyone the vax is full of rat shit if I thought it would help keep a government patsy from stabbing me with drugs. I will lie all day long and spread disinformation far and wide over this, and not care at all. The only thing I would gain is my autonomy. No profit. You care more about the misinformation from people who have no profit to gain than holding the people who make billions accountable for their incomplete information. If the “information” is so easily obtained from these vaccine trials, then tell me where I can find the blood type that’s has the most adverse reactions? Does type AB have less reactions to the vaccine than type O+ does, for instance? Do you think you could actually find this information if it was important to you? And when you can’t find it, would you spread disinformation to try to protect yourself?

I have an equal disdain for misinformation regardless of where/who it comes from. People should make well informed decisions. That said, you do bring up an interesting point - hypocrisy, which I'm not accusing you of. IOW, you simply feel that autonomy is important enough that you're willing to sacrifice the truth.

IMHO, I think the truth, facts, data, etc is a better path to autonomy than disinformation. For example, if "you" spread disinformation about the vax, then you're just denying "fence sitters" the autonomy of making an informed decision. IMHO, if you're goal is autonomy, then fight for autonomy.

To look at this in a different way, Dr Walensky (CDC Director) went on MSNBC and said if you were vaxxed you couldn't transmit Covid, which of course isn't true. Not only was it not true, CDC's website had data to the contrary at the time she made the statement. What if I got the jab based on that information and then experienced an adverse reaction; is that not an affront to my autonomy, my right to self determination? Is it acceptable for "them" to sacrifice truth in the name of public health or the greater good? I'd argue truth is the higher standard.

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

Data can be manipulated to show false facts or support an agenda. A fact that should be obvious now, well after the start of COVID. People who we are supposed to trust have been proved to have told outright lies to push the vaccines.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

There was an absolutely massive campaign to try to force and coerce people to receive an experimental vaccine or face great punishment(s). They lied about covid "vaccines" to make huge profit and try to control people's lives and set a standard that experimental genetic technology doesn't need to be proven before rolled out and given to the public. This is a technocratic world gov structure using mind control and technology to completely hijack and run society, and covid, the "vaccines", all the lockdown measures, and now all the economic problems leading to WW3 are all part of a singular plan.

Don't forget the lockdowns started WW3 when the global economy fails or there's wars related to terrible economic conditions. It's all just standard warfare but with the newest technology.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

There was an absolutely massive campaign to try to force and coerce people to receive an experimental vaccine or face great punishment(s). They lied about covid "vaccines" to make huge profit and try to control people's lives and set a standard that experimental genetic technology doesn't need to be proven before rolled out and given to the public. This is a technocratic world gov structure using mind control and technology to completely hijack and run society, and covid, the "vaccines", all the lockdown measures, and now all the economic problems leading to WW3 are all part of a singular plan.

Don't forget the lockdowns started WW3 when the global economy fails or there's wars related to terrible economic conditions. It's all just standard warfare but with the newest technology.

It takes force to force people to do things. Other than discharging members of the military who refused to get the vax, anybody else could have filled out a piece of paper and gotten an exemption and those that were discharged from the military are being invited back.