**The MLB Thread**

[Rochambeau 10+ year member]

ripken and gwynn played in the steroids era. what evidence do you have that mcgwire took steroids? where did he admit to it? where is the positive test? just because ripken didn't hit 583 homeruns, means he didn't take steroids. not saying he did, but you never know and if you are throwing mcgwire under the bus for steroid suspension, why not gwynn and ripken and whoever is elegible here after?

No, I don't think he should be banned, declared ineligible, thrown under a bus or shot. I think the BBWA members simply shouldn't vote him in if they think he did it. Were I a member, I wouldn't have voted for him.

The evidence against him is as outlined above. Do I have syringe with his DNA on it? No. We are not talking about a reasonable doubt standard here, simply do you think he did it? I think he did. If he didn't, he would have told the Congressional committee so. When has an innocent person EVER taken the 5th? If you are innocent, there is NO REASON to take the 5th.

Conversely, there truly is not a shred of evidence against Ripken or Gwynn. None, nada, nil, zero, zip...

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

No, I don't think he should be banned, declared ineligible, thrown under a bus or shot. I think the BBWA members simply shouldn't vote him in if they think he did it. Were I a member, I wouldn't have voted for him.
The evidence against him is as outlined above. Do I have syringe with his DNA on it? No. We are not talking about a reasonable doubt standard here, simply do you think he did it? I think he did. If he didn't, he would have told the Congressional committee so. When has an innocent person EVER taken the 5th? If you are innocent, there is NO REASON to take the 5th.

Conversely, there truly is not a shred of evidence against Ripken or Gwynn. None, nada, nil, zero, zip...

there is none against mcgwire. all you got is jose canseco naming off everybody who is anybody he played with. i can't believe you'd do this on suspscion.

 

[bigbangtheory 5,000+ posts]

No, I don't think he should be banned, declared ineligible, thrown under a bus or shot. I think the BBWA members simply shouldn't vote him in if they think he did it. Were I a member, I wouldn't have voted for him.
The evidence against him is as outlined above. Do I have syringe with his DNA on it? No. We are not talking about a reasonable doubt standard here, simply do you think he did it? I think he did. If he didn't, he would have told the Congressional committee so. When has an innocent person EVER taken the 5th? If you are innocent, there is NO REASON to take the 5th.

Conversely, there truly is not a shred of evidence against Ripken or Gwynn. None, nada, nil, zero, zip...

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eyebrow.gif.fe2c18d8720fe8c7eaed347b21ea05a5.gif

So why did you just post this? McGwire is straight up being pwned and it isnt fair. One of the better baseball people in the history of the sport and he isnt getting in based on assumption. Pure and udder BS if you ask me. Anything with out seeing evidence is just based on our assumption which is nothing but really an opinion. Do I think he did it? Maybe, but so what! Barry Bonds has going through all kinds of shit, I betcha in a second he would get in. Shit just isnt fair, plain and simple.

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

to me reguardless if he did it or not he should get in ......if you want to blame anyone for it blame the MLB

 

[audiolife 5,000+ posts]

No, I don't think he should be banned, declared ineligible, thrown under a bus or shot. I think the BBWA members simply shouldn't vote him in if they think he did it. Were I a member, I wouldn't have voted for him.
The evidence against him is as outlined above. Do I have syringe with his DNA on it? No. We are not talking about a reasonable doubt standard here, simply do you think he did it? I think he did. If he didn't, he would have told the Congressional committee so. When has an innocent person EVER taken the 5th? If you are innocent, there is NO REASON to take the 5th.

Conversely, there truly is not a shred of evidence against Ripken or Gwynn. None, nada, nil, zero, zip...

you arent looking at the big picture you are acting like all these rules were in effect while big mac played. from the looks and sounds of it the owners and managers all had to know what was going on. they are people that are around the players alot more than any sports writter. they never made it illegal nor legal until congress stepped in because congress themselves knew baseball itself was just turning away from the whole issue. steriods help heal injuries quickly oddly enough we had someone break an untouchable record by almost 500 games..

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

you arent looking at the big picture you are acting like all these rules were in effect while big mac played. from the looks and sounds of it the owners and managers all had to know what was going on. they are people that are around the players alot more than any sports writter. they never made it illegal nor legal until congress stepped in because congress themselves knew baseball itself was just turning away from the whole issue. steriods help heal injuries quickly oddly enough we had someone break an untouchable record by almost 500 games..

my point exactly. steroids would've helped a lot in playing 2600 consecutive games

 

[bigbangtheory 5,000+ posts]

agree, he deserves it very much. Oh well, yet again something the baseball world fawks up!

 

[Rochambeau 10+ year member]

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eyebrow.gif.fe2c18d8720fe8c7eaed347b21ea05a5.gif
So why did you just post this? McGwire is straight up being pwned and it isnt fair. One of the better baseball people in the history of the sport and he isnt getting in based on assumption. Pure and udder BS if you ask me. Anything with out seeing evidence is just based on our assumption which is nothing but really an opinion. Do I think he did it? Maybe, but so what! Barry Bonds has going through all kinds of shit, I betcha in a second he would get in. Shit just isnt fair, plain and simple.

I really don't think Barroids will get in for the same reasons Mac won't.

Can any of the Mac supporters give a plausible explanation for him taking the 5th?

Say what you want about Canseco (personally, I can't stand the guy) but he hit the mark with his book and helped clean up the sport somewhat. Of course, that wasn't his intention in the slightest but merely a fortunate consequence.

Hell, back when Mac was with the A's, my sister (an MD and a baseball fan) stated her belief that Mac and Canseco were juicing. I liked Mac for doing what he did with the home run chase and all and I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt until he took the 5th. That sealed my opinion on the man.

I think if a BB writer believes he cheated, it is that writer's obligation to NOT vote for him. Otherwise it sends a very Clintonesque message... Lie & cheat, noone will care if you can get away with it and cover it up.... or if you can hit 70 home runs.

**** the Giants for re-signing Bonds, I was hoping baseball would blackball his ***.

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

I really don't think Barroids will get in for the same reasons Mac won't.
Can any of the Mac supporters give a plausible explanation for him taking the 5th?

Say what you want about Canseco (personally, I can't stand the guy) but he hit the mark with his book and helped clean up the sport somewhat. Of course, that wasn't his intention in the slightest but merely a fortunate consequence.

Hell, back when Mac was with the A's, my sister (an MD and a baseball fan) stated her belief that Mac and Canseco were juicing. I liked Mac for doing what he did with the home run chase and all and I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt until he took the 5th. That sealed my opinion on the man.

I think if a BB writer believes he cheated, it is that writer's obligation to NOT vote for him. Otherwise it sends a very Clintonesque message... Lie & cheat, noone will care if you can get away with it and cover it up.... or if you can hit 70 home runs.

**** the Giants for re-signing Bonds, I was hoping baseball would blackball his ***.

actually a poll of the writers who didn't vote mcgwire, said they would vote in bonds //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

also palmeiro and ripken played together so ripken was around steroids.

 

[Rochambeau 10+ year member]

you arent looking at the big picture you are acting like all these rules were in effect while big mac played. from the looks and sounds of it the owners and managers all had to know what was going on. they are people that are around the players alot more than any sports writter. they never made it illegal nor legal until congress stepped in because congress themselves knew baseball itself was just turning away from the whole issue. steriods help heal injuries quickly oddly enough we had someone break an untouchable record by almost 500 games..

It was illegal (against the law), gave the users an unfair and unnatural advantage and was just wrong! They KNEW it was wrong, otherwise why try so hard to cover it up?

Again, I certainly don't think Mac should be banned, as I said, but if you think that he owes his numbers to pharmaceutical chicanery than the very numbers which one uses to evaluate his performance are invalid.

And of course the owners are not faultless any more than I would be faultless if I bought a stereo system that I knew had been stolen. But just because I know its stolen when I buy it, that doesn't pardon the thief for stealing it.

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

It was illegal (against the law), gave the users an unfair and unnatural advantage and was just wrong! They KNEW it was wrong, otherwise why try so hard to cover it up?
Again, I certainly don't think Mac should be banned, as I said, but if you think that he owes his numbers to pharmaceutical chicanery than the very numbers which one uses to evaluate his performance are invalid.

And of course the owners are not faultless any more than I would be faultless if I bought a stereo system that I knew had been stolen. But just because I know its stolen when I buy it, that doesn't pardon the thief for stealing it.

you have no proof mcgwire took steroids, and you seem way to naive. many players took steroids. this is the steroids era, so where do we draw the line on who did and who didn't?

 

[Rochambeau 10+ year member]

LOL, everyone who played in that era had teamies juicing.

And if they vote in Bonds, I will say they are wrong. I don't think they will, I really don't. Not only is the evidence against him more compelling than that against Mac, but he is an arse to boot and writers take that stuff personally.

 

[Rochambeau 10+ year member]

you have no proof mcgwire took steroids, and you seem way to naive. many players took steroids. this is the steroids era, so where do we draw the line on who did and who didn't?

again, why did he take the 5th?

You don't draw a line, you do it case by case.

 

[iceteebone 5,000+ posts]

LOL, everyone who played in that era had teamies juicing. And if they vote in Bonds, I will say they are wrong. I don't think they will, I really don't. Not only is the evidence against him more compelling than that against Mac, but he is an arse to boot and writers take that stuff personally.

exactly. you don't know who was juicing and who wasn't