Rta??

[Caraudiopro1984]

So I'm going to be setting up a system in my new commuter (2014 Camry) soon and want to RTA the system once its in to get a good baseline before I start messing with the EQ's to my liking. Its going to be an active 4-way setup, 6.5"midbass/door, 5"midrange/door, 3"midrange/dash, tweet/dash. I do have a fully adjustable pre-amp crossover and since I'll be active I'll have full control over levels of each speaker set.

My question, anyone used the Audiocontrol SA-4100i?? is it worth $220?

or is there a Iphone app that does a decent enough job?

I wont be using the RTA for my subs cause there just gonna overpower the mic, just want to make sure my front stage is close to flat, then I can sit in and mess with the EQ a bit for personal preference.

I posted my build plans if you wanna look and check it out in the build logs page.

Thanks

William

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[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

should be able to just get a RTA mic and use some cracked software or home theatre pro idr what its called to check the rta. itll save you a good amount of cash.

youll need some sort of dsp for any real adjustment

 

[Caraudiopro1984]

Yeah I have a 4 way crossover with High/Mid1 bandpass/Mid2 bandpass/low settings and they'll be all active to I can adjust levels from the amps, I think the only thing a DSP will get me is time alignment and maybe a level output for each set. (the one I have only has one front level out that controls it all) and the pioneer DD decks have a simulated position option, I'm really not to worried about it, I really wanted to just check to make sure my crossover points weren't overlapping. The Pioneer DD decks also have a 13band graphic EQ that should allow me to get to a decent flat starting point.

thanks for the info on the RTA mic

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

Do you own a laptop computer? There is a better way.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

Now that I'm at my PC I have more comments to add.

1. A 4-way front speaker setup is not worth doing for sound quality. Two good quality driver pairs, a mid-woofer and a tweeter, can sound awesome. 3-way in the front is pretty great as well, but the amount of supporting hardware goes up quickly. Tuning also becomes more difficult without an established process and the proper tools.

2. I and many other people do not think a 13-band graphic EQ is enough tuning control for an active speaker system. It's only capable of broad, system-wide changes. You will almost certainly find response issues with a modern RTA that the graphic EQ will not ever be able to fix.

3. Individual driver level control is mandatory since normally amplifiers don't allow gain adjustments on each channel. However, that still doesn't give you the EQ control you really should have to tune each speaker independently. That's where the real magic happens and a decent sounding system can go to the next level and sound incredible.

4. With a calibrated USB mic, such as Dayton UMM-6, and a laptop running Room EQ Wizard, you can build an extremely powerful measurement setup for cheap. REW is free, and the mic is less than $100.

 

[The Camry]

First-timers guide to measuring your system - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

 

[TreyE 10+ year member]

Now that I'm at my PC I have more comments to add.
1. A 4-way front speaker setup is not worth doing for sound quality. Two good quality driver pairs, a mid-woofer and a tweeter, can sound awesome. 3-way in the front is pretty great as well, but the amount of supporting hardware goes up quickly. Tuning also becomes more difficult without an established process and the proper tools.

2. I and many other people do not think a 13-band graphic EQ is enough tuning control for an active speaker system. It's only capable of broad, system-wide changes. You will almost certainly find response issues with a modern RTA that the graphic EQ will not ever be able to fix.

3. Individual driver level control is mandatory since normally amplifiers don't allow gain adjustments on each channel. However, that still doesn't give you the EQ control you really should have to tune each speaker independently. That's where the real magic happens and a decent sounding system can go to the next level and sound incredible.

4. With a calibrated USB mic, such as Dayton UMM-6, and a laptop running Room EQ Wizard, you can build an extremely powerful measurement setup for cheap. REW is free, and the mic is less than $100.

Sorry to jack this thread but this information interests me a lot. I have independent speaker level control and am running active, I have set my RTA by ear but I feel as though there could be improvements made. So if I research this microphone and software I should be able to figure out how to quite accurately RTA my speakers, including subwoofer?

 

[TreyE 10+ year member]

First-timers guide to measuring your system - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

Nice! Thanks, looking through this now.

EDIT: After reading through this it seems fairly easy to use, just takes time. Going to buy the UMM-6 soon and can't wait to hear the difference.

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

i have an rta mic (linearX oldschool stuff) got it from someone local so ill be toying around with it and my dsp here soon. ill let you know if i find anything notable @TreyE but i think you'll benefit most from adding a dsp, although your headunit certainly does have a lot of features

@trumpet I was going to ask the same thing though, if you'd be so kind to forward me to some useful resources that make it easy, or can make a brief explanation for us when you have time, id certainly appreciate it

ill actually mail you this mic for a few days once im done and whatnot it mostly sits around anyway

 

[TreyE 10+ year member]

[quote name='wew lad']i have an rta mic (linearX oldschool stuff) got it from someone local so ill be toying around with it and my dsp here soon. ill let you know if i find anything notable @TreyE but i think you'll benefit most from adding a dsp, although your headunit certainly does have a lot of features

@trumpet I was going to ask the same thing though, if you'd be so kind to forward me to some useful resources that make it easy, or can make a brief explanation for us when you have time, id certainly appreciate it

ill actually mail you this mic for a few days once im done and whatnot it mostly sits around anyway[/QUOTE]

Yea the more I look into it it seems I do need a dsp to EQ both sides of the car R/L.

 

[blazian87 10+ year member]

Here's a small DIY RTA walkthrough of the REW program with a step by step video clip included. The RTA Walkthrough and Usage thread. With Video. - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

Sorry to jack this thread but this information interests me a lot. I have independent speaker level control and am running active, I have set my RTA by ear but I feel as though there could be improvements made. So if I research this microphone and software I should be able to figure out how to quite accurately RTA my speakers, including subwoofer?

My mentor in DSP tuning doesn't recommend tuning by ear until after initial tuning is done, and even then the RTA is used to confirm what sounds "off". Anything we can hear can be confirmed with measurements performed correctly with the right tools. I didn't even listen to my car once the RTA measurements and tuning commenced until I had fully matched the front speakers and subwoofer to the sound curve I targeted. It took two evenings to tune my car with the Core-1 DSP, only because I knew some things weren't good enough after the first session.

Another point worth mentioning briefly is professionals should be tuning to a process that is repeatable and doesn't waste time. DIY enthusiasts often look at tuning as an art, or something that never ends. Shop techs don't get to tweak a car endlessly because someone has to pay for that time. I don't judge DIYers for tuning by ear, or however one chooses to spend their time. What I feel is beneficial is helping others to get to a point where the tuning is done so it's time to enjoy the music. That's a more difficult mental roadblock to overcome for some than for others.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

[quote name='wew lad']i have an rta mic (linearX oldschool stuff) got it from someone local so ill be toying around with it and my dsp here soon.

@trumpet I was going to ask the same thing though, if you'd be so kind to forward me to some useful resources that make it easy, or can make a brief explanation for us when you have time, id certainly appreciate it
[/QUOTE]

Before you get into any serious measurement and tuning I recommend buying or borrowing a recently calibrated microphone. The kind of measurements we need to make don't require a mic calibrated by NASA(if they even do that) but an RTA mic =/= a calibrated mic when it's matched with a completely different system(your PC or tablet). Dayton UMM-6 and miniDSP UMIK-1 are popular USB mics that include a unique calibration file that can be loaded by Room EQ Wizard.
REW Forum - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

 

[The Camry]

http://cross-spectrum.com/measurement/calibrated_umik.html

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk

 

[Caraudiopro1984]

So a buddy of mine came out of the woodowrking with Audiocontrol RTA, Im going to use it to get a decent flat baseline then I'll go in and tune it to my ear, I wasnt going for a pure audiophile SQ more just loud and clean. and I have the drivers and the space so why not.

Its gonna be

Alpine MRV-F357

1/2: tweets (dash) Alpine type X

3/4: 3" (dash) HiVi B3S

5: 6 midbass (door) Alpine type X

Alpine MRV-303

1/2: 5" mid (door) Alpine type X

3/4: rears (rear deck) Not sure yet

JBL GTX47 Crossover