Please Help, subwoofer underperforming/messed up?. boston acoustics 10.5LF

[00poop6x 10+ year member]

Most likely box problem. Try a larger sealed box. The recommendations from their spec sheet will not always do well in certain vehicles. I had the same experience with a Memphis M3 in a .75ft3 sealed. Moved A LOT, like it made no sound at all. Ported, //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fro.gif.c695f1f814b01c4ad99fe7f8cccadd29.gif

Also, the new Camry's do have quite a bit of bass coming from the stock speakers.

Last thing, looking at the woofer, is it even moving at all?

 

[boogiem0nst3r 10+ year member]

yeah the woofer moves...when i turn it up to volume 18 ish it sounds likes hitting overexcursion (but it doesn't even sound that loud?)

right now these subs are in a .5 cubic ft sealed box....according to the manual

has anyone had any experience with the 10.5LF? what are your box measurements and results?

thanks

 

[mrray13 10+ year member]

does boston list a small ported box for these? if so, build that and see if that gives you the output your craving.

with 500wrms, your not going to be gaining a thing by going from 16g to 12g wire from the sub to the amp. and simply changing the ground isn't going to do much unless your ground was complete crap in the first place. the only thing wiring that can possibly be of issue would be running too small of a power wire/ground wire combo. you should be running at least 8g, and to be honest, i'd be running 4. but even then, you'd have other issues then not enough output.

and the popping noise could be one of two things. overdriving the sub, or at worst, a bad sub to begin with. if you believe the sub to be good, go ported. or go with a different sub.

good luck!

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/peace.gif.2db28b618ed8d1964ebbe2f5021d2c39.gif

 

[HCCA 10+ year member]

OK, I had to research your amp. I was not familiar with it's abilities. So, now that I am up to speed. Here's what I would recommend.

1.) Increase the size of your sealed enclosure to .75cft...maybe more. Sorry, you might just have to experiment. I did. Bostons generally have smaller box recommendations than what I find works best. I used the 10.4LF, which was the predacessor to the 10.5LF. The basic difference being the power handling. The manual that I had recommended a 1cft sealed enclosure. I used a 1.5cft sealed with a LOT of polyfill stuffing (and 100W per sub). I had to "tune" the sealed enclosure by adding stuffing until I got the sound that was best. Too little, it didn't go low enough. Too much, and it sounded muddy. THEN, I had to EQ from there.

2.) If you haven't already, tune your amp EQ to around 30hz, and boost it a LITTLE at a time while using a bass track that you are VERY familiar with. The popping sound you are hearing is likely that you have over-EQed to generate the output you are expecting it to have, and it is over-excurding. I would recommend Pink Floyd- Momentary Lapse of Reason CD to tune with. All of it has great bass to test with, but "Signs of Life" or better yet... "Another Movie/Round and Around" are nothing short of stunning with this sub tuned right. I still get chills hearing them!!

3.) Ported will be louder, and still sound good, BUT.....a 10" sub with the Xmax you have will not get a lot louder than you have it now. Some consider a single 12" to be just barely acceptable for good bass output. Personal taste, really, but I had two 10's, and they didn't have tremendous output either. I would suggest that you get another one of these 10's, and you will be happier. OR, see if you can snag one of the 12.5LF's that are finding their way onto Ebay. I suspect that you are just looking for more than a single 10 can deliver. Blue has used these subs as well, and we agree that there are VERY few subs that have the tonality, and accuracy of the Boston 10.4LF/10.5LF subs. You will not notice them that much BECAUSE they are so accurate. They will not bury the music beneath distortion. Most other subs will! A friend of mine/installer had a set of Velodyne 13" subs that were probably BETTER that the Bostons. Know what? They didn't SEEM that loud either. Two 13" subs with 1000 watts...not loud?!!? No, they were loud (141db), but ONLY when a heavy bass track kicked in. Because of their servo feedback design, they were EXTREMELY accurate. They had something like less than 1% distortion. Most (but not all) other subs have closer to 10-15% distortion - FACT. The distortion is percieved by many to be "loudness". When you can "hear" a sub, you are hearing distortion. When you feel a sub, but only hear the music, you are getting much closer to the way subs should sound. With that, I'd say that you are just not used to hearing an acurate SQ sub. It will take getting used to, if you are used to ported Kicker subs.

I am going to be using a single Boston SPG555 w/800 Watts in my new setup. Before that I was planning to use four 10.4LF subs, for the reason that they don't have the output of many other subs. What I loved about them was the incredible detail at super low frequencies. Most other subs I've heard would turn the afore mentioned Pink Floyd tracks to mush. BUT THEY WERE LOUD! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/*******.gif.a649d21efc0d1fd4890a6428166586c1.gif

Again, if you are expecting this sub to shake the rear view mirror off of the windshield.... don't.

 

[00poop6x 10+ year member]

Most likely box problem. Try a larger sealed box. The recommendations from their spec sheet will not always do well in certain vehicles. I had the same experience with a Memphis M3 in a .75ft3 sealed. Moved A LOT, like it made no sound at all. Ported, //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fro.gif.c695f1f814b01c4ad99fe7f8cccadd29.gif
Also, the new Camry's do have quite a bit of bass coming from the stock speakers.

Last thing, looking at the woofer, is it even moving at all?

Apparently OP does not listen to us. Just do it.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif We're as anxious as you are.

 

[boogiem0nst3r 10+ year member]

thank you for the input and help everyone...reallly appreciate it!!! and i mean that.

i will definitely try a bigger box...the reason i haven't tried one yet is because well, i've had to built the previous box and that took me a good week (was first box i ever built) so i was trying to hold that out as a last option.

i still honestly think i probably messed up the box construction...and anyways i will be building a bigger box... .75 as you recommended

and thanks for the hefty long post and research HCCA

 

[Macklessdaddy 10+ year member]

HI
I have 2004 camry automatic

Jl 500/1 AMP with about 50% gain (followed instruction manual)

ground wiring for amp i put under the back seat (scraped off metal with screw driver first)

proper wiring/wire size. power wire on left side of car, RCA on right side

one boston acoustics 10.5LF in sealed box (built box myself to specs of manual)

alpine deck +SUB is +3 to +6 out of +15 possible.

here is the link to the manual of these subwoofers http://bostonacoustics.com/Manuals/CarSubMan.pdf

i built the internal specs to what they gav eme. the material is 3/4" MDF. so naturally i added the proper amount to each side to make sure the internal measurements remain...and also put a lot of sealant on the inside and etc.

MY PROBLEM: so far this setup sucks!! i'm extremely frustrated. i kept hearing rave reviews about this sub (or its brother 12.5LF) being able to play very loud and hard...so far this sub is not performing satisfactory at all. i HOPE it is only a fault setup somewhere and not the best this sub has to offer. its at the point where if i turn the sub ON/OFF i can BARELY (sometimes not even) tell a difference between sub ON or just stock speakers...yes...STOCK!

the sub appears to make this popping noise..(clipping? bottoming out? fault box? ground wire? ) at around volume 17-20...the max my HU goes up to is 35!!! so i don't believe im driving it hard at all. in fact i can barely hear the bass outside of the car, the only time i really hear any bass outside o fthe car is when i open the trunk.

is the sub blown? when i push the sub in and out it appears to function correctly. i put my hands around all sides/corners/areas of the box when the sub plays to test for air leaks adn don't see anything.

i emailed boston about my problem..their best answer? that i have overexpectations for this sub and its just not performing to my expectation...but please i can barely tell if the sub is on and it doesn't play much louder then friggin STOCK speakers!

i have looked up such keywords as blown speakers, clipping, popping noises and such.

i believe the speaker is popping/clipping? but im confused on why its doing this when its barely being pushed? is the speaker already blown to begin with?

-Vinh

dude i'm a noob,but i know for a fact that if you can tell no difference with the sub on or off something HAS to be wired wrong,i dont care if it's only a 10,you should get decent output,i guarentee it's not a box problem,a different box might help but is not the main problem

 

[00poop6x 10+ year member]

1) dude i'm a noob...

2) i guarentee it's not a box problem...

Make up your mind, haha.

 

[mike dressure 10+ year member]

is this a single or dvc sub? if it is dvc then you may have it wired incorectly! check that if it fixes the issue then.......good if it dont then let us know

 

[HCCA 10+ year member]

dude i'm a noob,but i know for a fact that if you can tell no difference with the sub on or off something HAS to be wired wrong,i dont care if it's only a 10,you should get decent output,i guarentee it's not a box problem,a different box might help but is not the main problem

If he's getting cone motion, and it is making that popping noise...it is reaching over-excursion. It would not do that if there was no cone motion. It is not the wiring. He said that he checked that. boogiem0nst3r, you DID swap speaker wire polarity...pos for neg, and neg for pos, to see if it was running out of phase, right? I assume that you did, as it was recommended by another on this thread. I'm with 00poop6x on going with a larger box. Add polyfill to it as well.

On another note...did you seal the sub mounting flange with rope caulk? You can get this stuff from Wal-Mart, Home Depot...anywhere really. Tear off 3-4 "ropes" together. It CAN make a difference. It is VERY possible that you MIGHT have a leak. THAT would most DEFINATELY cause you the output problem. Most subs are very sunsitive to leaks, and you would not necessarily know that you have a leak just by putting your hand next to the box. That I have had time to think about it now, that would definately explain your problem better than anything. Since you did not build the box, I would investigate to see if the box builder sealed the box joints with caulk. I always add a bead of silicone to every point where two pieces of wood are joined...extra insurance. It's worth a look, before you start building a new box! Check where your speaker wire enters the box. Is it sealed with silicone? If not, do it as well. Cover all your bases to be sure that an air leak is not your problem!!

OH yeah... Mike Dressure...these were only offered in single voice coil models.

 

[boogiem0nst3r 10+ year member]

If he's getting cone motion, and it is making that popping noise...it is reaching over-excursion. It would not do that if there was no cone motion. It is not the wiring. He said that he checked that. boogiem0nst3r, you DID swap speaker wire polarity...pos for neg, and neg for pos, to see if it was running out of phase, right? I assume that you did, as it was recommended by another on this thread. I'm with 00poop6x on going with a larger box. Add polyfill to it as well.

On another note...did you seal the sub mounting flange with rope caulk? You can get this stuff from Wal-Mart, Home Depot...anywhere really. Tear off 3-4 "ropes" together. It CAN make a difference. It is VERY possible that you MIGHT have a leak. THAT would most DEFINATELY cause you the output problem. Most subs are very sunsitive to leaks, and you would not necessarily know that you have a leak just by putting your hand next to the box. That I have had time to think about it now, that would definately explain your problem better than anything. Since you did not build the box, I would investigate to see if the box builder sealed the box joints with caulk. I always add a bead of silicone to every point where two pieces of wood are joined...extra insurance. It's worth a look, before you start building a new box! Check where your speaker wire enters the box. Is it sealed with silicone? If not, do it as well. Cover all your bases to be sure that an air leak is not your problem!!

OH yeah... Mike Dressure...these were only offered in single voice coil models.

i DID build the box. i put excess amounts of silicone around the edges of inside the box lots of silicone around the gluded joints (which were screwed when glued, to hold it together).and also LOTS of it around the where the the wires enter/exit the box (around the + - outlet, forgot the name for this). as for rope caulk, i did not use rope caulk BUT i did use this thing that came with the bostons.

they came with 2 pieces of this particular foam/material that are placed under the speakers between where the speakers are screwed in and the wood...i assume this has the same effect as the rope caulk are you talking about.

anyways...is there a forsure test to see if my box has a leak? i assumed the putting my hand next to the box at all sides/angles would be sufficient but i guess not.

thanks for the help so far!

-vinh

 

[RidgelineNate]

i am not a car audio knowledge pool, but I would go towards wiring first. I know on the 500/1 you are suppose to use the two outside outputs, the outisde + and the outside -. Make sure your coils are wired correctly if its dvc....other than that, I've never heard a good sub not sound better than factory speakers. If you are getting overexcusrion and still not hearing anything, thats not good, a dual sub from walmart would be audible over your factory speakers.

Just my .02, I'm still in my learning stages.

 

[00poop6x 10+ year member]

Another true story to get your spirits on making a larger enclosure.

Had 10" Orion HCCA (1999 model) in a 1ft3 sealed box. Powered off of a HiFonics Series VII Boltar(700 RMS). In a 2001 Lexus IS300(Pretty good amount of bass from 6x9's in the rear). After it is all installed, I could barely tell if the sub was playing or not. After switching the amp on and off through a switch, I could BARELY tell. With all that, I was fustrated and built a 1.4ft3 ported enclosure. Problem solved. After that was resolved, I had a hard time hearing my door speakers.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

 

[boogiem0nst3r 10+ year member]

UPDATE

here's what i believed happened, there was a leak around the area where i screw in the subwoofer. i also noticed that some of the screws were loose (well not loose, but when screwed i nall the way, i could constantly turn and it never got tiight)

so i unscrewed it, put in some poly fil (about half a pound)

sealed the original holes with silicone and drilled new ones

put the sub back in using the new holes, and also treated the threads with silicone before id rilled them in

i noticed this time ONE of the screws doesn't tight in all the way (but all the others do, compared to 3-4 from before)

anyways i noticed a BIG performance increase...huge...this is what the bostons should sound like all along

im debating on whether to drill a 3rd pair of holes...because one of the screws isn't tight as the other ones...do you guys think this box still has a minor leak?

-=Vinh