PCM WAV out thru USB possible?

[raverx3m 10+ year member]

i have been trying to find out if car stereo manufacturers like alpine pioneer etc are adding support for FLAC to their units in near future.

so far there hasnt been much action from any of them.

even though the codec is becoming very popular for lossless backup

phones,pdas,media players, even home theater systems support FLAC, but like always

the car stereo world is waaaaaay behind the schedule, they re waiting untill its SAFE to invest in that codec.

leaving people with no options when it comes to playing full cd quality music in their car besides CD(and iphode which i dont like due to known limits)

what pioneer rep explained to me is that ipod converts encoded media to raw format like pcm wav for example and sends it to the unit for final processing (pretty much same as playing a CD)

BUT, lately the trend has been changing, most newer units utilize AUX analog input for ipod, making it a nightmare(aac>analog>head unit processed> back to analog out from head unit)

media files from USB mass storage are decoded and processed by the headunit but limited to only few suppored formats.

i asked him why cant they make firmware that would control other media players same way

got no answer.

phones are starting to support FLAC as well and they are alot more programmable than mp3 players.

so i am wondering if it is posible to modify firmware, add an app or any other way for a phone to decode the FLAC and output it as a PCM WAV to a head unit because the new units all support WAV playback thru usb.

or maybe even better, a piggyback decoder that supports more codecs

plug it in the unit and plug the thumbdrive into it.

the piggyback decoded would convert it to WAV and send it to the unit.

Click to read more...

 

[gunz4me2 10+ year member]

Why are you worried about a pristine audio signal in one of the most hostile environments for audio reproduction?

 

[raverx3m 10+ year member]

u mean i shouldnt?

u re got corrupted data my friend.

please explain

or maybe i should ask you

why do people prefer focal speakers over jensen or dual. i mean its a really hostile environment who gives a faq about great sound

 

[blazeplacid 10+ year member]

I think it might come in the following years

I remember when units could first read mp3s, my friends and I were blown away!

Truth is most people are happy with 192k or 320k for daily.

I dont know how much processing going into playing FLAC or lossless files but I guess its not cheap or easy to put in a head unit that already does so much.

I can see maybe Alpine or Pionner adding flac soon...why not just carry CDs or use WAV files? Most units will read wav fine

 

[gunz4me2 10+ year member]

u mean i shouldnt?u re got corrupted data my friend.

please explain

The fact still remains that most can NOT tell the difference between AAC, MP3, FLAC, and the CD in double blind testing under ideal conditions. Stick this in an environment that has a 60 decibel, or higher, noise floor and you are going for an exercise in futility.

The only one exception would be if one sits there for hours and hours on end performing critical listening in their vehicle.

Then again, if you really want all this high tech, gizmo gadgetry that supports FLAC or DVD-A, I suggest looking into a car PC versus waiting for manufacturers to come out with something new and innovative in this current craptastic global economy. IMHO, if they can't make money off of it, they won't do it. Plain and simple!

or maybe i should ask youwhy do people prefer focal speakers over jensen or dual. i mean its a really hostile environment who gives a faq about great sound

How people choose to spend their money is no business of mine. Just because one chooses to spend 200%, or more, on their equipment doesn't mean they will get twice, or greater, the performance of a lower priced, quality piece of gear.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

I can tell the difference between 192kbps mp3 and 320kbps mp3 and .wav

I ditched my mp3 capable cd players and went old school - just to force myself into CD's. it made enough of a difference for me.

most people don't know what distortion is, but some do. for those that do, .wav playback is desirable.

I want to put a 2Tb drive in my car with .wav catalogs of my CD collection. A car PC is not a solution for me, PC's are stupid fawking noisy.

 

[JimJ 5,000+ posts]

PC's are stupid fawking noisy.

Go fanless...

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

Go fanless...

sorry for not clarifying, i'm not talking about audible fan noise - i'm not impressed with suppression of electrical noise. a PC is very noisy electrically.

nevermind that a car is a hostile environmental location, without fans and 100+ degree temps... just seems like a poor investment. I hate how unreliable computers are anyway, and i'm an EE.

 

[gunz4me2 10+ year member]

I was an IT director at a CPA firm that had 120 auditors who traveled with laptops. I can't even count how many laptops would die between June and August due to being left in the vehicle. I was going to attempt to do a carputer back in 2007, but I just couldn't get past the reliability, or lack thereof, for computers being left in the vehicles over the hotter months.

I still stand by my statement of car audio companies not adopting FLAC and other forms of lossless audio if there is no money to be made in it for them. Then again, I wouldn't be shocked if the RIAA discourages it by pulling the "FLAC recordings are obtained illegally" card. Hell, iTunes still doesn't natively support FLAC and that has been a request for at least three or four years now.

 

[raverx3m 10+ year member]

i tunes is different story.

flac is not copy protected

apple has its own lossless format and they will do what sony did with memory stick

they will try to stand their ground untill people will say **** apple i dont want their crappy codecs and itunes.

just like sony finally gave in with atrac and memory stick new sony cameras support SD cards now lol all that mooney wasted and lost .

for information

besides apple lossless there arent many lossless formats outthere for people who dont use ipod

flac is pretty much the only other option to back up your cds in full quality.

and thats what people are doing.

gunz you did not understand the point of having flac capable deck

CONVENIENCE is #1

and then goes quality just like having a cd in your car why do some people prefer cds to MP3?

its a single format theres no quality differences between cd encoding like with mp3

same with flac its an exact cd copy

and belive me theres still a difference

maybe if you were played a song that you never heard before and you dont know how it supposed to sound you wont be able to tell

if its your favorite track that you know by heart you will hear the difference

 

[gunz4me2 10+ year member]

I don't need a FLAC compatible deck because i have been running an iPod since February 2007 along with Alpine full speed compatible head units. If I happen to come across content in FLAC format, I just convert it to the Apple Lossless codec and go forward with life. Sure, it adds another 2 minutes to the process, but it sure beats the hell out of whining about the lack of FLAC support by the car audio manufacturers knowing good and well that THEY DO NOT CARE.

Also, why would I want to do something like burn my FLAC tracks to CD just to fit a few more songs on it? CD media in the car is so 2001.

I have a test that may humble you. Rip a track to Wav with Exact Audio copy, then convert it to 320 KB/s MP3. Use the ABX comparison addon in Foobar 2000 and tell me how many times you can pick out the difference between the Wav track and the MP3. If you can do it 100%, 25 out of 25 times, I'll give you a cookie.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

your ability to pick out 320kbps mp3 vs .wav strongly depends on two things:

1. your experience analyzing recorded music

2. the playback system

sit yourself down in front of a $150k two channel system with BAT and Wilson Audio and you'll hear every nuance in the recording - a 25 out of 25 is very possible for even untrained ears. Get in a Focus with a stock system and even the original recording engineer would have a hard time telling the difference. I use two extremes because it's an example for point #2.

i reached a point in building my mobile sound system when 320k mp3 became unacceptable. I could A/B the mp3 and the original CD and the difference was clear as day - for me, it was all in the dynamics of the recording and audible distortion of the waveform.

What I want is a head unit that can directly access a 2Tb SATA hard drive, and do it logically and quickly. I want it to remember where it's at, i want it to access cover art, and I want it to be easy to search by voice command. I'd store everything as .wav and archive my CD collection. Done. I don't want a DIY carputer.

The audio world has been upended by convenience and ignorance. Storage is no longer a concern. There is no reason for compression anymore. No one needs to have 1000 hours of music in their pocket that sounds like *** - not that the headphones being used by most people are worth storing lossless audio anyway.

The problem is that manufacturers don't see any profit in lossless media and the recording industry doesn't want lossless to be easy to save/share/use.

For now, just get a head unit that can access 16 or 32Gb .wav filled thumb drives, and call it a day. All I ask is that I can search folders and see artist/song info.