It's war time...

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 And if you still believe that the US is a bad place and we are wrong...LEAVE!!!

Dude, that is SUCH a dead horse.. are you not reading posts? or are you on LWW's bus (the short yellow one) and can't comprehend.. This country is based on people being able to disagree with the Government (which is 'by the people, for the people, and of the people') to instill change.. if you are that friggn set on feeling that only those willing to **** the political tit for sour milk belong here, then it's YOU that should leave.. Lemmings get people killed.. You, seem to me, to be a Lemming..

Give that point up already..

 

[IS300included 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 We aren't dropping bombs in the city of Baghdad. We are dropping bombs in important buildings where we have evidince of Iraqi officials. And unlike Iraq...our missles hit the intended target. They're closest missle landed 60 miles from our troops i believe. We are going in there and figthing the war like a war is supposed to be done. They come up in civilian clothes and shoot at us and run. And you wonder why sometimes some real civilians get killed? Saddam doesnt care anything about his people and would trade all their lives for us to stop trying to get him. we are ignorant? your ignorant to the fact of how the Iraqi people are treated now with Saddam in control. Snova is right...some will be killed now...but Saddam was killing them anyways. Eventually tehy will be free and happy we did this for them. You guys have no clue what you are talking about. You are only looking at the fact of us going into Iraq and killing people because of the oil. We are killing the Iraqi government because of many other reasons, not oil. The biggest reason is because they are a huge threat to drop chemical bombs on us or other parts of the world and kill many more than a regular bomb could. Before you open your mouth and talk bad about what we are doing....think about it. And if you still believe that the US is a bad place and we are wrong...LEAVE!!!

If Iraq is such a huge threat, why didn't they do anything to us in 1993 when they had ten times the money, power, weapons, and military? They aren't going to attack us, they aren't that stupid.

And, um yes, we a re dropping bombs on Baghdad. And we're gonna roll troops and tanks through there pretty soon.... if we haven't already.... And you honestly believe that our bombs are right on target every time? That's what the news says.... what do you think they would say about us, "We are missing targets in Iraq because our bombs are inaccurate" **** NO! They're gonna lie to us and make our country look as good as they can.

And BTW - one of our missiles hit IRAN! Ok.... how's that for on target?

 

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by LWW Give it up dude. C-A-N-A-D-A. Canada. Our #1 petroleum source.

 

As to me I get my facts from reality.

 

PEACE

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Yes, and I admitted to being wrong about that.. if you can't get past that, you might as well go sit in your garrage and run the car with the windows down and garrage door closed..

Still, no statement about 'proof'.. guess that's a consession .. you know we don't, you refuse to say it.. admit it.. you are lower than what you would accuse me of since I clearly admit when i'm wrong and you say not admitting is the shittiest thing, yet you don't admit..

Okes, you just proved to me and probably most on this forum that you are truely just arguing to argue and have no real basis for your opinions.. You are SO set on defending your stance that you ignore FACTS to keep it.. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

 

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by IS300included And you honestly believe that our bombs are right on target every time?

One in IRAN, and 2 in SE Turkey (fell short and hit in turkish territory.. luckily none of the turkish troops in that area were hurt)..

And we bomed a bus on a bridge .. nice forward obersving.. killing the civilians on the bus..

 

[Bumpin03 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Savant One in IRAN, and 2 in SE Turkey (fell short and hit in turkish territory.. luckily none of the turkish troops in that area were hurt)..

 

And we bomed a bus on a bridge .. nice forward obersving.. killing the civilians on the bus..

how many of Iraq's bombs have even been remotely close to hitting us??? Once again...you refuse to open up your eyes and just look at how the US is wrong. Why dont u criticize Saddam for killing his own people? or is that ok??? its just not ok that some Iraqi citizens get killed (less then Saddam kills himself) in order to get freedom? It seems like the only people supporting Iraq are Iraqi officials and stupid people in the US that dont know better. Even the troops don't support Saddam. 12 soldiers surrendered to the US before the war even began when the US was practice firing...not even at the Iraqi troops. They came in with a white flag and the US told them that they couldn't forfeit...they weren't even shooting them. Look how many others have surrendered! If they really supported their country they would fight for it...not give up when they don't think they can win. Also...if Iraq was so good...why did they shoot one of the US soldiers they took as a POW? They shot him right in the head on television broadcasted in Iraq. Im sorry but I really don't even understand how you can say that we are wrong and Iraq is right.

 

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 how many of Iraq's bombs have even been remotely close to hitting us??? Once again...you refuse to open up your eyes and just look at how the US is wrong. Why dont u criticize Saddam for killing his own people?

WE DO criticize Saddam.. We say it time and again.. why is it that people can't understand there are all kinds of angles? We don't support Bush cause he's on a crusade and risking life and limb for no reason.. WE DESPISE Saddam, he's a psycho.. that's never cause the US to START a war before, and history is FULL of leaders like him that no one des anything about.. is that right? probably not.. are most people willing to risk thier lives for people they don't know and will never meet? not normally..

The entire point of all of this is simply this.. Bush wanted to go in to Iraq. He tried to appleal to the UN to do it, but his attemps were being resisted because his 'ultimate' reason was disarming Saddam.. Saddam (how ever slow or under duress or whatever) WAS destroying missles.. Bush said "to late, we are comming in".. he did NOT work at getting Saddam disarmed, he worked at getting his fingers in Iraq.. People of this country are blind to that, that's the problem.. They buy the propaganda on TV (the same thing they accuse the enemy of using) and swallow the tainted milk from the Government teat without question because they have been desensitised to the taste.. that's all I'm saying..

 

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 its just not ok that some Iraqi citizens get killed (less then Saddam kills himself) in order to get freedom? It seems like the only people supporting Iraq are Iraqi officials and stupid people in the US that dont know better. Even the troops don't support Saddam. 12 soldiers surrendered to the US before the war even began when the US was practice firing...not even at the Iraqi troops. They came in with a white flag and the US told them that they couldn't forfeit...they weren't even shooting them. Look how many others have surrendered! If they really supported their country they would fight for it...not give up when they don't think they can win. Also...if Iraq was so good...why did they shoot one of the US soldiers they took as a POW? They shot him right in the head on television broadcasted in Iraq. Im sorry but I really don't even understand how you can say that we are wrong and Iraq is right.

Sorry, should have kept them all together..

Again, we are NOT supporting Saddam, the fact that you can't see that is bothersome.. The fact that someone can see that life is NOT black and white seems to scare and confuse most people.. I do NOT support Bush, I do NOT support Saddam.. THEY CAN BOTH HAPPEN.. it's not an either/or scenario..

Who cares how many surrendered before it started? that could well have been a rouse to get us sloppy.. which we DID become.. This is a WAR.. you NEVER let your guard down, not even when people are walking across the desert with a white flag.. you keep that gun in their face till they are flat on the ground.. anyone makes a fast move, shoot them.. THIS IS WAR.. so your 'they hide and people that were surrendering shot us.. waaaahhh..'.. get a clue... this is WAR, and most of our troops don't understand that..

Again, no one is saying Iraq is good.. them killing POWs is a perfect example of that, but what does that have to do with shit??? if we didn't give them POWs, they could NOT be killing them!!! *sigh* //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/banghead.gif.8606515f668c74f6de0281deb475b6fd.gif

Once again.. no one is saying Iraq is right, you just can't see that we can be upset with both Bush and Saddam.. Saddam is nuts and needed to be dealt with, but not the way Bush went about it, not yet anyway.. War might have been inevitable, but we will never know now since we are loosing troops and civilians.. we did not exhaust our diplomatic avenues, but people that were itching for a fight don't believe that..

 

[IS300included 10+ year member]

Here's some news from Iraqi people that were in Baghdad.

Baghdad - an eyewitness report

 

Baghdad witnessed intense bombardment last night. Glass panes on windows and doors of the Al Jazeera Satellite TV office were shattered as shock waves ripped through the city. We still can smell gunpowder and smoke here.

The situation is back to normal and Baghdad is bustling as usual. People are still taking stock of the damage in some residential areas. We have no information on how many people were wounded or killed, but we expect to_get them to come in in a little while.

The Iraqi anti-aircraft systems fiercely retaliated and I guess that they managed to down some cruise missiles. We also noticed some missiles being intercepted over the sky here.

While the sites that were hit are mostly presidential palaces, some nearby civilian areas were also hit. This made Iraqi Information Minister Mohammed Saeed Al Sahaf_comment sarcastically that the attacks were to destroy weapons of mass destruction in palaces that had already been checked by UN inspectors.

Al Zouhour palace, one of the oldest palaces that go back to the era of King Ghazi and rebuilt to be used as a museum or a guesthouse, was also hit. Iraqi officials wondered why such an old palace was targeted.

The raids also targeted Al Salam palace, which is used for hosting heads of state. We visited this palace along with the Iraqi Minister of Information and saw the damage. It was completely empty and devoid of the alleged weapons of mass destruction. Probably the Americans were trying to target anything linked to the Iraqi political set up and shake the people’s trust in the leadership.

As if in response, people took to the streets in anti-US war protests during the air strikes. Most of the protesters carried pictures of President Saddam Hussein as a sign of challenge and an expression of resistance.

Last night’s raids did not cause any damage to public utilities like water and electricity. The Iraqi government took precautionary measures in this regard and I guess it has an emergency plan to meet any shortage of water or electricity. I also think that the Iraqi Ministry of Industry is working on securing auxiliary power generators.

The Iraqis have taken on board the fact that everything can be targeted. They expect the Americans to target the whole infrastructure of the country. Iraqi officials said this is “an aggressive war which targets everything in Iraq”.

The officials reiterated that reports about the surrender of two military battalions are part of a psychological war similar to what happened in 1991 when the US authorities accused Iraq of setting ablaze oil wells.

They said these reports were fabricated and that they were still fighting in Faw and other areas. In general the US forces are encountering stiff opposition.

Al Jazeera

Yeah, they love us.

 

[Bumpin03 10+ year member]

you say that the US hides the truth and only tells the people what makes them look good. Iraq does the same thing....everybody does. Bush just has the "testicular fortitude" to go in there and do something about it because nobody else has. And yes...people like him have been overthrown because of fighting. What happend to Hitler and Stalin? If everyone just sat back and watched...they would have continued to take over countries. The whole world would have been probably under the same dictator by now. I understand if you dont support what Bush is doing...but please dont go on and say how horrible we are treating Iraqi citizens. We are fighting FOR them...and AGAINST Saddam.

 

[IS300included 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 how many of Iraq's bombs have even been remotely close to hitting us??? Once again...you refuse to open up your eyes and just look at how the US is wrong. Why dont u criticize Saddam for killing his own people? or is that ok??? its just not ok that some Iraqi citizens get killed (less then Saddam kills himself) in order to get freedom? It seems like the only people supporting Iraq are Iraqi officials and stupid people in the US that dont know better. Even the troops don't support Saddam. 12 soldiers surrendered to the US before the war even began when the US was practice firing...not even at the Iraqi troops. They came in with a white flag and the US told them that they couldn't forfeit...they weren't even shooting them. Look how many others have surrendered! If they really supported their country they would fight for it...not give up when they don't think they can win. Also...if Iraq was so good...why did they shoot one of the US soldiers they took as a POW? They shot him right in the head on television broadcasted in Iraq. Im sorry but I really don't even understand how you can say that we are wrong and Iraq is right.

Why did they execute one of their POWs??? Well, we set the precedent for the treatment of POWs long ago. We do the same thing.

Iraq IS wrong. But what we are doing now is WAY more wrong. You do not solve problems by going to war.. that just creates more problems.

So if Iraq is so against Sadaam, and they're so willing to surrender, then why the **** (again) are we at WAR with them. Couldn't we just say, "hey... why don't all you guys just kill Sadaam on your own?"

There are MANY better ways to solve this problem than what we are doing now. What we are doing now is terrible, immoral, wrong, and STUPID.

 

[Savant 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Bumpin03 you say that the US hides the truth and only tells the people what makes them look good. Iraq does the same thing....everybody does. Bush just has the "testicular fortitude" to go in there and do something about it because nobody else has. And yes...people like him have been overthrown because of fighting. What happend to Hitler and Stalin? If everyone just sat back and watched...they would have continued to take over countries. The whole world would have been probably under the same dictator by now. I understand if you dont support what Bush is doing...but please dont go on and say how horrible we are treating Iraqi citizens. We are fighting FOR them...and AGAINST Saddam.

Yes, we all hide the truth a bit.. but we, the BEST country in the world, should be above that.. If our government is really supposed to be 'ours', then they shouldn't lie about things, EVER.. but they do.. why? it's run by people.. usually 'rich' people.. who believe their lives are better and above the rest of us.. and when those kind of people get in charge, they fuk over the American people.. quietly, in secret.. as much as they can.. Why do you think we have scandals? that normally have people in positions of authority making hundreds of millions of dollars, usually from illegal activity or from stealing from tax payers?

Again, comparing Hitler and such and the other 'big' wars is pathetic.. in general, there were clear lines and alliances.. The US is almost alone here.. Saddam is in a tiny country and is NOT moving out of his borders, that's what we did in 91.. contained him.. We already 'did' what you are talking about.. but this is totally different.. Saddam is not expanding.. he's contained..

And, we aren't saying we are treating Iraqi citizens badly, we are saying we are killing them.. again, that black white thing.. By the time all is said and done (if we don't all die from this), the Iraqi people will be better off, no question.. until the US pulls out and puts in another evil dictator that is amenible to the US and will keep his people in line so we can get oil cheaper.. The same ******* Rumsfeld that is sitting on TV now talking about how horrid Saddam is was shaking his had when he was put into office in Iraq.. Think about that..

 

[Bumpin03 10+ year member]

Originally posted by IS300included Why did they execute one of their POWs??? Well, we set the precedent for the treatment of POWs long ago. We do the same thing.

 

Iraq IS wrong. But what we are doing now is WAY more wrong. You do not solve problems by going to war.. that just creates more problems.

 

So if Iraq is so against Sadaam, and they're so willing to surrender, then why the **** (again) are we at WAR with them. Couldn't we just say, "hey... why don't all you guys just kill Sadaam on your own?"

 

There are MANY better ways to solve this problem than what we are doing now. What we are doing now is terrible, immoral, wrong, and STUPID.

because they citizens are scared...if they do anything or even say anything about killing saddam...they will be killed. saddam has an army that probably doesn't even like him that much either but they do their job because he gives them power. So after they drop a chemical weapon on us and kill hundreds of thousands...what do we do? Ask them to please stop? Name a couple ways of taking care of this problem without war.

 

[LWW 10+ year member]

There is nothing on that link that shows 'confirmed' proof of chem weapons being made..

Man you and reality need to stop feuding. Here is what the Jerusalem Post is quoted as saying:

The Jerusalem Post ran a story earlier Sunday that was written by a journalist on-hand with the U.S. unit -- the 1st Brigade of the 3rd Infantry Division -- that took the plant.
The article states that one soldier was lightly wounded when a booby-trapped explosive was triggered as he was "clearing the sheet metal-lined chemical weapons production facility."

PEACE

 

[Bumpin03 10+ year member]

they also found like a farmers plane that they used to spray chemicals over the crops to grow near US troops. (cant think of the name). maybe they were planning on fertilizing the sand...?

 

[Randy Savage 5,000+ posts]

Let me say this, argue all you want, but you have to realize one thing...you are able to voice your own opinion on this forum because of PAST WARS....not our NEGOTIATING SKILLS....so, like I said, you have a problem with the US, move to Iraq, and find an Iraqi forum(if they exist) and write about the problems with their government...think you'll be alive the next day? I think not...and your wife will enjoy the thorough raping, as they take pictures during the process and send them to your whole family.

I don't care what Bush's priorities are in this war, the idea is to get rid of Saddam.