Current events discussion

[RobGMN Premium Member]

So it's all cool letting China flood the US (through mexico) with fentanyl as long as your TV is cheaper? I see what you're really about...

OK, tell me EXACTLY how Trump's previous attempts at tariffs:
1. Halted the the flow of drugs into our country.
2. Halted the demand for drugs by our citizens.
3. Increased US manufacturing.
4. Increased our exports.
5. Decreased illegal immigration into the US.

I want to see numbers, not memes, not empty claims/talking points/repetition of others' claims.
Show me the facts and figures for each metric.

That's all great, but WTF does exports have to do with Trump's tariffs? Biden kept Trump's tariffs in place. Could it be that exports increased because the MFG plants built here increased output, but those plants wouldn't have existed without the tariffs in the first place?

Those FRED charts are problematic because they are goods & services. That's why I used the PDF tables, as that's the place I found the data with goods only. That said, I wouldn't mind to see tariffs on services either. It'd be great to talk to an American for tech support or customer service again.

Wll, the war cry is that the new tariffs Trump wants to try will cause exports from other countries into the US to decrease. We will make more goods for ourselves, while continuing to make goods to export to the world.
That would be growth, as opposed to a zero-sum exchange.

BUT when his tariffs hit, we ended up with fewer exports AND fewer manufacturing jobs. That was the opposite of what the tariffs were supposed to do (not to mention the end of illegal drugs and immigrants coming here).

This chart (courtesy World Bank)is for goods only, not goods and services. You can see where things took a turn, COVID nothwithstanding.
Tariffs were supposed to increase exports. What happened?

This is from BLS.
You can see where things took a turn, COVID notwithstanding.

Manufacturing jobs increased, then started to decline (not just stagnate) again before COVID killed them.

Obviously not part of the plan. What happened?:

Going back to these FRED charts, you need to look at the tables I provided. Exports of goods are down under Biden in 2023 & 2024.

I tried, but the links just open the page where I can build my own charts, instead of linking to a pdf, even though your link ends in "pdf".
I think that's a Chrome browser plugin thing where it wants to link to a file on the "creator's" PC.

Are they really trying to keep illegals OUT? Poland is trying to keep illegals out. In the US, you can enter illegally and just claim asylum if your caught - in essence making all immigration legal. Immigration is problem in the west right now and many countries are doing little to nothing prevent illegal immigration. And if I'm Canada (or Mexico), what do I care if illegals enter the country when I know their ultimate destination is the US?

Exactly. Why do we think that we are going to force Canada and Mexico to keep people IN their country?
Show me one border checkpoint in the USA, Mexico, Canada, China, etc, where the local forces tell you that you may not leave.
Go to Canada. You can go right to the border without restriction by any US agency. It's the CANADIANS that won't allow you to get IN.
Now come back. You're free to roam until you hit the border, and the US won't allow you IN.
That's how borders work.

Imagine Trudeau saying to Trump "You must establish a border patrol force that will stop people from leaving the US, so that we don't have to have our own border security". That would be utterly ridiculous.
Yet it's what Trump wants THEM to do...

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

OK, tell me EXACTLY how Trump's previous attempts at tariffs:
1. Halted the the flow of drugs into our country.
2. Halted the demand for drugs by our citizens.
3. Increased US manufacturing.
4. Increased our exports.
5. Decreased illegal immigration into the US.

No Rob...You're good with fentanyl flooding the US...as long as it don't affect the price of the goods you buy...so doing anything different is out of the question...

there's zero point complying to your demands...

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

No Rob...You're good with fentanyl flooding the US...as long as it don't affect the price of the goods you buy...so doing anything different is out of the question...

there's zero point complying to your demands...

In other words you once again have no answer, and no way to support your argument other than introducing a stupid strawman.

I guess you think **** and financial fraud should should be legalized, since you voted for an adjudicated ******/convicted felon.
It's all good as long as you "own the libs" and go to confession on Sunday, right?

You and Thx should stay out of conversations that you can't even make a cogent argument in, unless your goal is to appear entirely incompetent in the safety of the anonymity here.

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

In other words you once again have no answer

Rob let me be clear...You're good with fentanyl coming here killing people as long as it doesn't affect your TV prices...so you trying to call me out don't mean fck all...

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

But you're just dragging me along and commenting on it and not being straightforward. You asked how are we slaves and I explained and you just keep dragging it on and on like I'm not being direct. Believe what you want, I was just trying to honestly and clearly answer your ******* question you asked me. It's not a presupposition, it's just explaining a story about how humanity came to be based on what several ancient civilizations wrote about, took time to explain and record in great detail. It's not an assumption; it's what was written thousands of years ago. That's all I'm saying, like not trying to be tricky. They actually said what I'm saying, I'm not making up my version of it.

I really don't get what you're bent out of shape about. I didn't say you're trying to trick anybody. I merely pointed out that your definition of slavery was attached to an assumption about the origins of men that I don't prescribe to.

 

[Eggs 5,000+ posts]

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

Rob let me be clear...You're good with fentanyl coming here killing people as long as it doesn't affect your TV prices...so you trying to call me out don't mean fck all...

Nice fail at a false dilemma.

You have nothing to back your belief that a tariff will somehow end drug addiction and demand, OR that it will somehow stop drugs from being sent here from other countries.
So instead of trying to back it logically, you in some weird way equate the price of a TV to drug addiction and demand in the US. As if we pay $50 more for a $200 TV, or build the TV here, drug addiction will somehow cease.

With YOUR false logic, we should all be a helluva' lot smarter than we are, given the number of cars we've bought from Japan.
They are #1 in IQ. We don't even make it into the top ten list. Go figure.

So tell me EXACTLY how Trump's previous attempts at tariffs:
1. Halted the the flow of drugs into our country.
2. Halted the demand for drugs by our citizens.
3. Increased US manufacturing.
4. Increased our exports.
5. Decreased illegal immigration into the US.

 

[Speed Chaser]

Who else wasn't surprised when biden went back on his word and pardoned his son hunter

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

Guess hunter wasn't as innocent as Biden claimed...

Definitely some corruption going on in that family...

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

I haven't even posted anything for a bit and Rob is saying I should stay out of the conversation. I will say kiss my *** Rob. This isn't your grandmas basement where you think you get to make all the rules.

None of this bullshit conversation matters at all to you, none of it. The only reason you are even in it is so you can talk shit about Trump. It has been so on this forum since July of 2021. You are a shit talking, conservative bashing, republican hating far left liberal democrat. You and Jimi have a problem with others speaking in this thread then take it to private chat or **** it up snowflake.

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

Fentanyl Facts

The facts about fentanyl and overdose.

www.cdc.gov

But no risk to somebody's TV cost going up...

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

Nice fail at a false dilemma.

You have nothing to back your belief that a tariff will somehow end drug addiction and demand, OR that it will somehow stop drugs from being sent here from other countries.

Nobody is claiming drugs will stop coming into this country. However, they can sure as hell slow them down and reduce the amount. Your ******* way of arguing is played out. You know god damn well nobody said completely stop drugs from coming here but you want to talk to everyone like they are stupid. Maybe you really don't comprehend simple shit and if that's the case maybe I could see why you act like you do.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Fentanyl Facts

The facts about fentanyl and overdose.

www.cdc.gov

But no risk to somebody's TV cost going up...

A buddy of mine recently died from fentanyl. I'm sure his family would pay the cost of tariffs to get cooperation from foreign countries to help reduce the flow of opiates.

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

Nobody is claiming drugs will stop coming into this country. However, they can sure as hell slow them down and reduce the amount. Your ******* way of arguing is played out. You know god damn well nobody said completely stop drugs from coming here but you want to talk to everyone like they are stupid. Maybe you really don't comprehend simple shit and if that's the case maybe I could see why you act like you do.

So tell me EXACTLY how Trump's previous attempts at tariffs:
1. Halted the the flow of drugs into our country.
2. Halted the demand for drugs by our citizens.
3. Increased US manufacturing.
4. Increased our exports.
5. Decreased illegal immigration into the US.

It was obviously a success when he did it the first time.
Share the numbers.

Show me that YOU comprehend simple shit.
Without any of your mind-numbing non-sequiturs, homphobia, ad-hominem, strawmen, diversion, sidestepping, misdirection, backpedaling.
Tell me: WHO pays the tariff on the imported goods we will be buying in stores?

 

[Eggs 5,000+ posts]