12 cvx vs 15

[cotjones 10+ year member]

lol...Go right ahead buddy. Think that.
You keep your "JL Audio is the god of car audio" attitude.

think what you ****ing douche? that 1 12 can't beat 2 15's? that statement realy makes everything you say really believeable... just go away!

and i have never referred to JL as the best product, only a great product that there is nothing wrong with. if its what i run in my system then of course i'm gunna preffer it i didn't spend all that money for no ****ing reason! i have maby recomended jl to others like twice. so i'm NOT pushing the product. but when i start hearing people talk about how the quality of the w7 isn't any good, of course i'm gunna comment because thats an extremely short-sighted statment

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

as far as midrange minimum frequency responce....

cdt, mtx, and focal = 65hz,

infinity... 67

orions, rockford and jbl= 70!

soundstream= 75

here's a good one... diamond audio =80 (they are 4" midbass but still the bigger ones only get 63)

even JL"S zr's only go to 53... (my fav.)

so there is a list of quite a few companies who make component systems whos midbass won't do much woth a shit at 80 hz, and one of them won't even play it!

 

[Immacomputer 10+ year member]

as far as midrange minimum frequency responce.... cdt, mtx, and focal = 65hz,

infinity... 67

orions, rockford and jbl= 70!

soundstream= 75

here's a good one... diamond audio =80 (they are 4" midbass but still the bigger ones only get 63)

even JL"S zr's only go to 53... (my fav.)

so there is a list of quite a few companies who make component systems whos midbass won't do much woth a shit at 80 hz, and one of them won't even play it!

The Fs of the driver does NOT dictate the lowest the driver can play. I have an $80 component set (tweeters, crossovers, and woofers) that plays down to 60hz with authority and blends flawlessly with my 12" IDQ in a ported enclosure. The response is very flat and very natural. The imaging is dead center and there is only a slight peak around 1khz. The drivers are very difficult to locate and they sound great with everything. The bass region is at the same level as the highs. That is sound quality. Not having four 10s, a 13, and a component set crossed over at 120hz or where you said you set it at.

Oh yea, the midbass Fs of these speakers is around 70hz or so.

 

[TeoTorriatte 10+ year member]

Imma > cotjones

/story

Where's a 'rep' button when you need one? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

The Fs of the driver does NOT dictate the lowest the driver can play. I have an $80 component set (tweeters, crossovers, and woofers) that plays down to 60hz with authority and blends flawlessly with my 12" IDQ in a ported enclosure. The response is very flat and very natural. The imaging is dead center and there is only a slight peak around 1khz. The drivers are very difficult to locate and they sound great with everything. The bass region is at the same level as the highs. That is sound quality. Not having four 10s, a 13, and a component set crossed over at 120hz or where you said you set it at.
Oh yea, the midbass Fs of these speakers is around 70hz or so.

thats great and all but i didn't mention anything at all about Fs,

i said "minimum frequency responce."

so that being the case yes i'm sure your mids play down to 60 just great, because it wouldn't be uncommon for a midd-bass with an fs of 70 to have a minimum frequency responce of around 45...

sad truth is... my components minimum frequency responce is 51, which i believe is under-rated because they just don't have much authority at that low range, so i have no problem letting the 10's share that load, and at levels at or in excess of 135db the imageing of a small range of about 20 something frequencies that are rarely harmonic isn't going to make much of a difference in sq since i'm not competeing in any sq competitions...

brand of your 80$ components? no offence but going by the history of your posts you'll say anything to dissagree with me or try to make me look wrong, so i don't believe you. not to mention your description of your system is pretty much completely subjective, so someone else could sit in your car and say you don't have enough mids. here's another point... i can only fit 4"s in the front of my car and 6.5's in the back, but i modified it to fit 5.25's and 6.5's... but then i had to add another set of tweets if i wanted to be able to use the potential of my substage and still hear music, so that leaves an obvious gap in mid performance, so i've been told well then you shoulda just got some midbass 8's, hmmm well the only thing about that is where am i going to fit them? hmmm IN THE BACK! which defeats the whole purpose... so i'm doing the best i can for my car's setup options... i specifically chose the 10's when i bought so i could compensate for some of the inability to dominate mids

 

[Immacomputer 10+ year member]

thats great and all but i didn't mention anything at all about Fs,i said "minimum frequency responce."

so that being the case yes i'm sure your mids play down to 60 just great, because it wouldn't be uncommon for a midd-bass with an fs of 70 to have a minimum frequency responce of around 45...

Where do you think they get the lowest frequency from? I have only seen a few that label the FR lower than Fs and it's usually only about 5hz down or so.

I would bet my car that the reason your midbass sucks is because of your install. It's that way in almost every single case.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Where do you think they get the lowest frequency from? I have only seen a few that label the FR lower than Fs and it's usually only about 5hz down or so.
I would bet my car that the reason your midbass sucks is because of your install. It's that way in almost every single case.

wrong... once again

here is a morel midbass:

Frequency Response: 40–4000Hz

FS: 65Hz

cdt:

Frequency Response: 10-4000Hz

FS: 52Hz

i'm looking, and i can't find a middbass with a lower fs than minimum responce

 

[Immacomputer 10+ year member]

Well the CDT one is kind of jacked but I'll give you the morel example.

Even so, FR ratings are to be taken with a grain of salt, just like any other single spec for a driver. Once in an enclosure (yes, doors count as an enclosure), the FR curve and limits change. That's the point I'm trying to get across.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Well the CDT one is kind of jacked but I'll give you the morel example.
Even so, FR ratings are to be taken with a grain of salt, just like any other single spec for a driver. Once in an enclosure (yes, doors count as an enclosure), the FR curve and limits change. That's the point I'm trying to get across.

yes, but in an enclosure, the Fs will most ALLWAYS go up in frequency but down in impedance... makeing the fs even higher than the minimum frequency responce when you go to enclosure from free air... not that it matters because most installations for component middbass are infinite baffle such as the rear deck of a car... but i made fiberglass boxes for my 5.25's in the front mounted on the front of the doors and angled back. (sealed so the FS definitly goes up but the driver as a whole gives a flatter responce.)

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Well the CDT one is kind of jacked but I'll give you the morel example.
Even so, FR ratings are to be taken with a grain of salt, just like any other single spec for a driver. Once in an enclosure (yes, doors count as an enclosure), the FR curve and limits change. That's the point I'm trying to get across.

you sure it's jacked? here is the tech sheet pdf...

http://www.cdtaudio.com/pdf/m6_spec1.pdf

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

he won't ever admit i'm right, even if he knows i am, because his goal is for me to be wrong!! look at the posts and decide for yourself if i'm right:read: