Current events discussion

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

Spokey made it very clear that the consensus of the world's economists was wrong

Where did I say that...

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Where did I say that...

It's just a strawman argument. Clearly tariffs worked great for China for the last 30 years.

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

It's just a strawman argument. Clearly tariffs worked great for China for the last 30 years.

I know it is...I just wanna see what kind of mental gymnastics Robbo went to come up with that nonsense

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Has anybody watched "Am I Racist?" Looks like it's hilarious. Might have to subscribe to Daily Wire for a month.

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

It's just a strawman argument. Clearly tariffs worked great for China for the last 30 years.

No, it's actually from a post that Spokey made.

He failed to show an example of ANY economist saying massive debt is a good thing, and he very clearly said that just because they have degrees, they are not always right.
And that was directly referencing the universal consensus of economists regarding tariffs, not whether they prefer vanilla over chocolate.
Obviously, he knows better than they do.
But is unable to answer the question of who pays a tariff...

And we aren't China.
The tariffs under Trump failed to do what he intended.
We have proof of that.

He intends to do the same thing he did in 2018, which failed that time.
Why is there an assumption that the results of doing the same thing in 2025 will be different?

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

Has anybody watched "Am I Racist?" Looks like it's hilarious. Might have to subscribe to Daily Wire for a month.

I haven't heard of it but ya got me curious

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

No, it's actually from a post that Spokey made

Ok so where did I state the consensus of economists were wrong?

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

just because they have degrees, they are not always right.

That statement is 100% fact...a degree doesn't make make your theory, opinion, dreams, or whatever the fck correct...a piece of paper doesn't make you error proof ffs...

And you claim economists agree tariffs don't work...and that's a falsehood because right this very second there's hundreds of tariffs worldwide working just fine for their intended purpose...

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

I know it is...I just wanna see what kind of mental gymnastics Robbo went to come up with that nonsense

I don't even care what the economists say. The right wing free market ones will bemoan anything that isn't purely free market and ignore the fact China restricts it's markets. The lefty ones will oppose anything that Trump does. Let's do what is logical: the number 1 & number 2 economies should have trade policies that mirror each other, not radically different policies. We should build up our enemy's economy. Only fools would look at current policy and think this a path we should continue down. As a matter of fact this should have been addressed under Bush 2 or Obama.

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

I don't even care what the economists say. The right wing free market ones will bemoan anything that isn't purely free market and ignore the fact China restricts it's markets. The lefty ones will oppose anything that Trump does. Let's do what is logical: the number 1 & number 2 economies should have trade policies that mirror each other, not radically different policies. We should build up our enemy's economy. Only fools would look at current policy and think this a path we should continue down. As a matter of fact this should have been addressed under Bush 2 or Obama.

That's my point "experts" play party lines these days to and when you factor that in with normal human error...it's just not the best idea to blindly accept "facts"

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

As a matter of fact this should have been addressed under Bush 2 or Obama.

There should've been some foresight back in Reagan's day...China has been the fastest growing economy since the 80's and a communist government was never gonna be our "buddy"

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

No, it's actually from a post that Spokey made.
View attachment 61613
He failed to show an example of ANY economist saying massive debt is a good thing, and he very clearly said that just because they have degrees, they are not always right.
And that was directly referencing the universal consensus of economists regarding tariffs, not whether they prefer vanilla over chocolate.
Obviously, he knows better than they do.
But is unable to answer the question of who pays a tariff...

And we aren't China.
The tariffs under Trump failed to do what he intended.
We have proof of that.

He intends to do the same thing he did in 2018, which failed that time.
Why is there an assumption that the results of doing the same thing in 2025 will be different?

Paul Krugman would be the most prominent example of the "don't worry about the debt" economists. I don't even know who the most recent Noble Prize winning economists are, but I'd bet dollar to donuts that they also fall into the "don't worry about the debt" crowd.

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

That's my point "experts" play party lines these days to and when you factor that in with normal human error...it's just not the best idea to blindly accept "facts"

You're simply backpedaling.
You stated that economists say a massive debt is good. Show me ONE economist who said this.
You said that they all are wrong about tariffs not working.

Historical economic data is not an "opinion", any more than it's an "opinion" that if you jump up, gravity pulls you back down.
That data shows that the tariffs did not benefit us.

So once again I ask: WHY DO YOU THINK DOING THE SAME THING WILL YIELD DIFFERENT RESULTS?

You think the economists worldwide are playing a party line to make Trump look bad, and they have been doing so since Smoot-Hawley?

I find it interesting that we are the strongest economy in the world without tariffs, but you use other countries having tariffs as the standard we should aspire to?

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

You stated that economists say a massive debt is good.

Where did I say "economists say a massive debt is good"?

I said SOME and that idea is the backbone of the modern monetary theory that gaining prominence in some of our elected officials eyes...but apparently you haven't googled mmt or even heard of it before...if something's not a problem it's good

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

Historical economic data is not an "opinion", any more than it's an "opinion" that if you jump up, gravity pulls you back down.
That data shows that the tariffs did not benefit us.

Not every benefit of a tariff is an economic one...but apparently you not bright enough to know that