Menu
Forum
What's new
New posts
Live Activity
Search forums
Members
Registered members
Classifieds Member Feedback
Car Audio Discussion
General Car Audio
Car Audio Build Logs
Car Audio Equipment
Subwoofers
Speakers
Amplifiers
Head Units
Car Audio Help
Wiring, Electrical and Installation
Enclosure Design & Construction
Car Audio Classifieds
Car Audio Classifieds
Car Audio Wanted
Classifieds Member Feedback
Gallery
New media
New comments
Search media
SHOP
Shop Head Units
Shop Amplifiers
Shop Speakers
Shop Subwoofers
Shop eBay Car Audio
Log in / Join
Test
Forum
Search
Search titles only
Search titles only
Log in / Join
Search
Search titles only
Search titles only
What's new
New posts
Live Activity
Search forums
Members
Registered members
Classifieds Member Feedback
Menu
Reply to thread
Forum
Car Audio Help
Enclosure Design & Construction
T-line boxes
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Moble Enclosurs" data-source="post: 7469606" data-attributes="member: 634917"><p>Negative. It does not all come down to just that. Also, in the audio world, in particular to the engineering side of it, they are not called "ducts". That is more related to the HVAC portion of a related field to area of pressure, such as installing an AC unit that is big enough to supply sufficient pressure for a given room area. Two completely different terms. SO, now that that is out of the way, I have to now mention that since you question my ability to explain such designs, it has to now at this point, as I have figured it to be inevitable anyhow, that when I first came here to this forum, you were asking me about how they work! Not sure you are yet in a position to question my knowledge.</p><p></p><p>The names given to each design is unique. The basis of a general transmission line was based from the electrical term in a sense that a coupling has to be designed for efficient operation. Now, a similar way to construct each enclosure is obvious do to the limitations we have in such a small environment(trunk, cabin, etc.) that most of them will start to be construed as identical in some fashion, when trying to maintain a proper acoustical reproduction of the original source.</p><p></p><p>Human interpretation is not a correct term either. More so, a human "perception". And yes, it does slightly change for each individual, though very similar. Differences can be heard, not so much with increased pressure as with decreased intensity. The above enclosure, yes, will give similar responses, but does not mean they are similar all together. You have to consider the other factors such as the load on the amplifier, and excursion possibilities, etc and many many other factors you have likely stumbled upon on your "google" research of such designs. I never wanted to attack your reasoning nor being another one who is a designer and supporter of the forum, but now it is going far enough for me to have to defend myself in a professional sense so those "competitors" do not give the community a sense of confusion.</p><p></p><p>Now, since you design as well, it must be mentioned that if you are saying the enclosures are so similar, that no one will notice any differences, first you must understand that the design goal can make one of the biggest differences in this, along with making it seem that what we do, is not any different than designing for a simple "box" persay. So, that will make others question our purpose for being "special" in the field. For this, I would not recommend giving the assumption that what we do is no different than a "standard" design. Even the sealed enclosures, can be modeled and designed much different than a concentration on spec volumes. It's like saying your boxes are more efficient, but designed the same. If that is true, the efficiency is one thing I would investigate. Do not protray that what you do is "simple" enough to be the same as another design, because the construction of a Tline against a BR is much different, even a compressed Tline. They will give similar responses, but some other factors will be different, in some cases much different, between the two, AS LONG AS THEY WERE DESIGNED CORRECTLY(huge key).</p><p></p><p>So, if differences are negligible, then you are saying paying attention to detail is useless and even your designs are simplified. Differences are not negligible, but some are more important than others. It's like noticing the difference in an HT setup by sitting in different locations...a lot of it has to do with phase, which is not the same as a frequency response curve(the one you mention looks similar). Each factor in the propagation of sound, whether reflected or direct, has their own individual contributions to the overall response. There are different responses to consider, not just a frequency response....such as phase and impulse. which control the quality of sound in most cases. SO, though I do appreciate your reasoning, and do COMPLETELY see where you are coming from, and agree that yes, frequency responses can look very very similar, but the designing of each enclosure SHOULD be different, as each one IS different in its own aspect. It's the limitations that make everything seem so alike.</p><p></p><p>As far as modeling bass reflexs as horns, there are similarities, but again are done very differently. DO NOT let a "program" make you think otherwise. And its tough to prove as hearing perception also has a factor, along with sensitivity. If you want to stay simple, sure, it works...but I would like to continue making designs that actually are different in their own sense of physical and acoustical construction. The problem is, you can argue this....what I have said! It can be aruged with a lot of sense! But that is because if you do not understand the differences, than ignorance is bliss.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Moble Enclosurs, post: 7469606, member: 634917"] Negative. It does not all come down to just that. Also, in the audio world, in particular to the engineering side of it, they are not called "ducts". That is more related to the HVAC portion of a related field to area of pressure, such as installing an AC unit that is big enough to supply sufficient pressure for a given room area. Two completely different terms. SO, now that that is out of the way, I have to now mention that since you question my ability to explain such designs, it has to now at this point, as I have figured it to be inevitable anyhow, that when I first came here to this forum, you were asking me about how they work! Not sure you are yet in a position to question my knowledge. The names given to each design is unique. The basis of a general transmission line was based from the electrical term in a sense that a coupling has to be designed for efficient operation. Now, a similar way to construct each enclosure is obvious do to the limitations we have in such a small environment(trunk, cabin, etc.) that most of them will start to be construed as identical in some fashion, when trying to maintain a proper acoustical reproduction of the original source. Human interpretation is not a correct term either. More so, a human "perception". And yes, it does slightly change for each individual, though very similar. Differences can be heard, not so much with increased pressure as with decreased intensity. The above enclosure, yes, will give similar responses, but does not mean they are similar all together. You have to consider the other factors such as the load on the amplifier, and excursion possibilities, etc and many many other factors you have likely stumbled upon on your "google" research of such designs. I never wanted to attack your reasoning nor being another one who is a designer and supporter of the forum, but now it is going far enough for me to have to defend myself in a professional sense so those "competitors" do not give the community a sense of confusion. Now, since you design as well, it must be mentioned that if you are saying the enclosures are so similar, that no one will notice any differences, first you must understand that the design goal can make one of the biggest differences in this, along with making it seem that what we do, is not any different than designing for a simple "box" persay. So, that will make others question our purpose for being "special" in the field. For this, I would not recommend giving the assumption that what we do is no different than a "standard" design. Even the sealed enclosures, can be modeled and designed much different than a concentration on spec volumes. It's like saying your boxes are more efficient, but designed the same. If that is true, the efficiency is one thing I would investigate. Do not protray that what you do is "simple" enough to be the same as another design, because the construction of a Tline against a BR is much different, even a compressed Tline. They will give similar responses, but some other factors will be different, in some cases much different, between the two, AS LONG AS THEY WERE DESIGNED CORRECTLY(huge key). So, if differences are negligible, then you are saying paying attention to detail is useless and even your designs are simplified. Differences are not negligible, but some are more important than others. It's like noticing the difference in an HT setup by sitting in different locations...a lot of it has to do with phase, which is not the same as a frequency response curve(the one you mention looks similar). Each factor in the propagation of sound, whether reflected or direct, has their own individual contributions to the overall response. There are different responses to consider, not just a frequency response....such as phase and impulse. which control the quality of sound in most cases. SO, though I do appreciate your reasoning, and do COMPLETELY see where you are coming from, and agree that yes, frequency responses can look very very similar, but the designing of each enclosure SHOULD be different, as each one IS different in its own aspect. It's the limitations that make everything seem so alike. As far as modeling bass reflexs as horns, there are similarities, but again are done very differently. DO NOT let a "program" make you think otherwise. And its tough to prove as hearing perception also has a factor, along with sensitivity. If you want to stay simple, sure, it works...but I would like to continue making designs that actually are different in their own sense of physical and acoustical construction. The problem is, you can argue this....what I have said! It can be aruged with a lot of sense! But that is because if you do not understand the differences, than ignorance is bliss. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forum
Car Audio Help
Enclosure Design & Construction
T-line boxes
Top
Menu
Home
Refresh