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Need opinion on good 3000+ amp
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<blockquote data-quote="Buck" data-source="post: 8800840" data-attributes="member: 591582"><p>Yes. I’m not disagreeing with that. All I’m saying is that it makes some difference, and there’s a level of damping factor that tends to be correlated with cheap amps, and the damping factor tends to rise some with price. You can go study that for yourself; I made a large study of it with amps even within the same company. My advice was to not get the cheapest amp, and you can usually indicate that with a very low damping factor. Some amps under some circumstances don’t play right, and it’s complicated, because you have your different 12v power different supplies, boxes, environments, final loads people are running, woofer design, etc. I’ve compared the amp lines from the same companies, and the less expensive amps tends to have a lower damping factor than the more expensive amps from the same company.</p><p></p><p>Like with Sundown- the Salt’s have a higher damping factor. I know people who’ve run the SIA’s, didn’t like them, and went back to the SALTs, and their problems magically disappeared (like cutting off under stress or sounding like doodoo on lows). And some of those we are talking about is people playing in the low 20 Hz region here, but I’ve experienced this with certain systems under certain circumstances when the amp would sound like **** or cut off due to excessive woofer movement, and the bass wasn’t that low. I’m not saying it’s a good thing that the amps do that or subs, but I learned what damping was from comparing amps and hearing them vs actually a lab test. I installed for a while at a shop and was involved with a ton of systems (+from box designing and building), and I didn’t even know what damping factor meant. I just knew it was a number. I still noticed that amps with higher ratings still tended to work better under stress with subs, and there’s a lot of variables to that. I actually started looking into this after all these experiences. Many people define damping factor as the ability for an amp to control or stop a woofer- and that’s literally what I learned from hearing so many systems before I even knew the definition of damping factor. I saw it acted out in real life, and have for a decade, so I just can’t see how it doesn’t matter some. We can respectfully debate it, but I’m not trying to be treated like a clown over this, especially with how my claims have been over exaggerated and replied to out of context (not by you).</p><p></p><p>And to your point of output filters: full bridges try to run as little output filtering as possible due to the mosfet layout vs half bridge, and that seems to be why these cloned and seemingly made cheap-as-possible full bridge amps have problems, is because they don’t have the same amount of output filtration. I mean that’s why I posted this:</p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]40625[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>^^^That’s literally why half bridge amps tend to come with more output filtration (they have to to avoid noise), and half bridges can dump the excessive energization (from floppy subs) in the amp into the power supply, to some extent, where a full bridge has to run all the woofer current through the mosfets, and that’s going to be harder on the amp, fundamentally, IMO. (especially if it’s a cheap Chinese turd trying to play lows)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Buck, post: 8800840, member: 591582"] Yes. I’m not disagreeing with that. All I’m saying is that it makes some difference, and there’s a level of damping factor that tends to be correlated with cheap amps, and the damping factor tends to rise some with price. You can go study that for yourself; I made a large study of it with amps even within the same company. My advice was to not get the cheapest amp, and you can usually indicate that with a very low damping factor. Some amps under some circumstances don’t play right, and it’s complicated, because you have your different 12v power different supplies, boxes, environments, final loads people are running, woofer design, etc. I’ve compared the amp lines from the same companies, and the less expensive amps tends to have a lower damping factor than the more expensive amps from the same company. Like with Sundown- the Salt’s have a higher damping factor. I know people who’ve run the SIA’s, didn’t like them, and went back to the SALTs, and their problems magically disappeared (like cutting off under stress or sounding like doodoo on lows). And some of those we are talking about is people playing in the low 20 Hz region here, but I’ve experienced this with certain systems under certain circumstances when the amp would sound like **** or cut off due to excessive woofer movement, and the bass wasn’t that low. I’m not saying it’s a good thing that the amps do that or subs, but I learned what damping was from comparing amps and hearing them vs actually a lab test. I installed for a while at a shop and was involved with a ton of systems (+from box designing and building), and I didn’t even know what damping factor meant. I just knew it was a number. I still noticed that amps with higher ratings still tended to work better under stress with subs, and there’s a lot of variables to that. I actually started looking into this after all these experiences. Many people define damping factor as the ability for an amp to control or stop a woofer- and that’s literally what I learned from hearing so many systems before I even knew the definition of damping factor. I saw it acted out in real life, and have for a decade, so I just can’t see how it doesn’t matter some. We can respectfully debate it, but I’m not trying to be treated like a clown over this, especially with how my claims have been over exaggerated and replied to out of context (not by you). And to your point of output filters: full bridges try to run as little output filtering as possible due to the mosfet layout vs half bridge, and that seems to be why these cloned and seemingly made cheap-as-possible full bridge amps have problems, is because they don’t have the same amount of output filtration. I mean that’s why I posted this: [ATTACH=full]40625[/ATTACH] ^^^That’s literally why half bridge amps tend to come with more output filtration (they have to to avoid noise), and half bridges can dump the excessive energization (from floppy subs) in the amp into the power supply, to some extent, where a full bridge has to run all the woofer current through the mosfets, and that’s going to be harder on the amp, fundamentally, IMO. (especially if it’s a cheap Chinese turd trying to play lows) [/QUOTE]
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