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robert J

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Posted (edited)

Hi all,

 

Haven't installed a stereo since my Alpine 3002 back in the '80s. Things have changed but I think I am up for the task. My new car sound system is terrible.

 

Here is my potential set up and I would appreciate a once over by some experienced builders so I can avoid problems and money.

 

2018 Kia forte sedan OEM head unite, 7" touch display, 10-20W / 6 channels (4x 6.5" in doors + tweets in dash)

Rear center arm rest down position opens up flow from the trunk SUB. seats also fold down.

 

Fosgate R250W mono block

Clarion 50W RMS x4 (high level inputs for front doors components 50W rms) Doors and dash tweets / rear doors Kicker coax.

 

Audio Control LC2i for Fosgate Mono block (12" sub) and rear (doors) channel of clarion (kicker 6.5" coax 100W rms). I am running the LC2i for the rear channels and high level inputs for the rears so I can retain fade control?

 

Alpine components front doors and dash tweets (front channels Clarion)

Kicker 100W RMS coax rear doors (rear channels Clarion)

single alpine 12" 100W RMS sub (Trunk) Fosgate. (not going with duo dubs in diagram cuz would have to buy new subs)

 

Is there a better way to set this stem up that is not substantially more money?

 

Thanks for your time and input.

 

Cheers, Rob.

 

2qm0t90.jpg

Edited by robert J

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Save up some money and get a digital sound processor instead of a sh*tty LC2i

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Save up some money and get a digital sound processor instead of a sh*tty LC2i

 

 

This seems like good advice.

 

Of course using some Y splitters from the LC2i will not hurt anything, but if you're not happy with the results that does seem to be the weakest link in your plan, plan around the thought that you may want to upgrade that down the road.

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Thanks for the replies,

 

I am not planning to use the RCA splitters, that was just FMI.

 

The plan is to use the LC2i for the sub and rear channel of the main, while using the high level signal OEM inputs for the front channel so I can retain fade control. Is this incorrect?

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Thanks for the replies,

 

I am not planning to use the RCA splitters, that was just FMI.

 

The plan is to use the LC2i for the sub and rear channel of the main, while using the high level signal OEM inputs for the front channel so I can retain fade control. Is this incorrect?

 

problem is, every stock head unit has a built in EQ curve the manufacturers implement that you have no control over. This is because they use cheap speakers and need to compensate for how sh*tty they sound naturally with a flat signal. They also have a built in high pass filter that cuts all bass from existence past a certain frequency. All the LC2i does is boost that garbage signal.

 

While a proper Digital sound processor signal sum, and flatten the EQ along with restoring lost bass properly. The LC2i accubase is just a glorified 45hz bass boost, nothing else more. Not only that, you get 31 bands of EQ, full network mode crossovers, time alignment and literally complete control over the sound spectrum.

 

If you are really into SQ, I would never touch anything as horrible as an audiocontrol line out convertor on a stock head unit. thats more for cheap basshead teens on a budget.

 

Also might as well get a 5 channel amp, you'll get way more power than your clarion fosgate combo at a lower price.

 

AKA this amp thats tested do way more than rated power. Which you will need if you are used to two 12s and you are only doing a single 12 in your setup. More power for your door speakers will make things sound a lot cleaner as well.

https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_40253_NVX-JAD900.5.html

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Jeff worded it better than I could, you should definitely invest in a DSP

 

throw in a $70 dso nano oscope to set your gains right and i think you're definitely doing better than most people starting out

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problem is, every stock head unit has a built in EQ curve the manufacturers implement that you have no control over. This is because they use cheap speakers and need to compensate for how sh*tty they sound naturally with a flat signal. They also have a built in high pass filter that cuts all bass from existence past a certain frequency. All the LC2i does is boost that garbage signal.

 

 

I did not know that, thank for the info. I will consider options.

 

I have not heard of NVX

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Posted (edited)

With the NVX 5 Ch I could run 2ohm rear doors for more RMS power and still use my 4ohm components up front yes?

 

or does the amp need to have all four channels the same ohm resistance?

Edited by robert J

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Jeff worded it better than I could, you should definitely invest in a DSP

 

throw in a $70 dso nano oscope to set your gains right and i think you're definitely doing better than most people starting out

 

Makes sense yes. Would an Lc6i do the trick or can you suggest a decent DSP for a decent price? Thanks.

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Makes sense yes. Would an Lc6i do the trick or can you suggest a decent DSP for a decent price? Thanks.

 

if you have a newer android/apple phone or tablet, the rockford DSR1 isn't bad just buggy

 

if you can afford a little more than $200, i would recommend the miniDSP 2x8 or 6x8. The 6x8 will let you retain fade if you have enough preouts from your headunit (factory headunit probably wouldnt work)

 

the DSR1 does offer factory integration that MIGHT work with your vehicle. look into it!

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if you have a newer android/apple phone or tablet, the rockford DSR1 isn't bad just buggy

 

Cheers, I do have an Iphone. I will look into your suggestions.

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The NVX is the same cost as my intended fosgate and Clarion but with more options and power, making it a better option given comparative quality and longevity.

 

I just have to work out the signal processing which will blow my budget. I was hoping not to have to get into the dash but pick up input signal from speakers wires. Lots to consider.

 

Is an LC6i a good option or should I stay away from audio control products?

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The NVX is the same cost as my intended fosgate and Clarion but with more options and power, making it a better option given comparative quality and longevity.

 

I just have to work out the signal processing which will blow my budget. I was hoping not to have to get into the dash but pick up input signal from speakers wires. Lots to consider.

 

Is an LC6i a good option or should I stay away from audio control products?

 

Stay clear away from audiocontrol lc6i is the same garbage as the lc2i, they are all just line out convertors, not any kind of digital signal convertors. What you are looking for is a signal sum, de-equalization unit with 31 band eq, time alignment, crossovers etc.. All the lc6i, lc2i, lc7i do is boost the garbage head unit signal without fixing anything. The only audiocontrol product that would qualify is the DM-608

 

audison bit one/bit ten, helix dsp, arc audio ps8, hertz h8, alpine pxa 800, mini dsp, rockford dsr1 etc....

 

You'll save money on wiring with the nvx since its just 1 amp vs two.

This is a video on a proper amp dyno testing for true wattage.

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Stay clear away from audiocontrol lc6i is the same garbage as the lc2i, The only audiocontrol product that would qualify is the DM-608

 

audison bit one/bit ten, helix dsp, arc audio ps8, hertz h8, alpine pxa 800, mini dsp, rockford dsr1 etc....

 

Crystal Clear... Thank you for saving me some time and money

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With the NVX 5 Ch I could run 2ohm rear doors for more RMS power and still use my 4ohm components up front yes?

 

or does the amp need to have all four channels the same ohm resistance?

 

wouldn't get kicker anything (maybe amp) i'd put more power to sub/s than 250 fs nvx 5 channel is probably like the ppi phantom 5 channel so that would be better.. u can run diff ohm loads on the 4 channels but u want more power up front not in rear most of us don't even use rear speakers.. i'd get a 500-800rms mono amp (u can get gain lower) but if u want better sub/s later u would have more power ready., and a 100x2 channel for fronts run factory rears off hu (faded mostly to front)

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Hi all,

 

Haven't installed a stereo since my Alpine 3002 back in the '80s. Things have changed but I think I am up for the task. My new car sound system is terrible.

 

Here is my potential set up and I would appreciate a once over by some experienced builders so I can avoid problems and money.

 

2018 Kia forte sedan OEM head unite, 7" touch display, 10-20W / 6 channels (4x 6.5" in doors + tweets in dash)

Rear center arm rest down position opens up flow from the trunk SUB. seats also fold down.

 

Fosgate R250W mono block

Clarion 50W RMS x4 (high level inputs for front doors components 50W rms) Doors and dash tweets / rear doors Kicker coax.

 

Audio Control LC2i for Fosgate Mono block (12" sub) and rear (doors) channel of clarion (kicker 6.5" coax 100W rms). I am running the LC2i for the rear channels and high level inputs for the rears so I can retain fade control?

 

Alpine components front doors and dash tweets (front channels Clarion)

Kicker 100W RMS coax rear doors (rear channels Clarion)

single alpine 12" 100W RMS sub (Trunk) Fosgate. (not going with duo dubs in diagram cuz would have to buy new subs)

 

Is there a better way to set this stem up that is not substantially more money?

 

Thanks for your time and input.

 

Cheers, Rob.

 

2qm0t90.jpg

I think the RF has speaker level high inputs on the amp so just tap in your rear speaker wires to the Amp and save your money on the LC2

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Thanks for the replies,

 

I am not planning to use the RCA splitters, that was just FMI.

 

The plan is to use the LC2i for the sub and rear channel of the main, while using the high level signal OEM inputs for the front channel so I can retain fade control. Is this incorrect?

 

You listed low pass on your rear speakers in the diagram..I figure a typo ..but high pass set for 90 on the Clarion amp should be perfect for front and rear again this amp has built in high level input as well so no LOC converter is needed

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Posted (edited)
I think the RF has speaker level high inputs on the amp so just tap in your rear speaker wires to the Amp and save your money on the LC2

 

Thx CRX,

 

Yes, LP is a typo

 

I was going to use the LC for the bass boast due to oem roll off at higher volumes but.... I am now considering the NVX 900.5, leaving the rear speakers in doors alone as I have found out that the signal is almost null to them. Going to pick up signal from fronts as they are full freq signal. Bridge the 900.5 and just use my Alpine components and 12's. I may try and find an amp with HL inputs comparable to the NVX but then I still have the bass roll off at volume. The NVX has a nice set of features.

 

This gives me two problems:

1. interface between the OEM and AMP

2. I only have one set of inputs (Front Speakers) that I will need to run both the fronts and the subs.

 

I appreciate your input, need more thought and more education.

Edited by robert J

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Thx CRX,

 

I was going to use the LC for the bass boast due to oem roll off at higher volumes but....

 

I am now considering the NVX 900.5, leaving the rear speakers in doors alone as I have found out that the signal is almost null to them. Going to pick up signal from fronts as they are full freq signal. Bridge the 900.5 and just use my Alpine components and 12's.

 

Then figure out how I am going to get the HL signal to the amp. I may try and find an amp with HL inputs comprable to the NVX but then I still have the bass roll off at volume. The NVX has a nice set of features.

 

I appreciate your input, need more thought and more education.

If I keep rear speakers I never amplify them ..and only dual cone on deck power or equivalent amp ..if I run rear mid bass drivers .. or midrange ..I’ll band pass and amplify those ..I have over 100 first place Car Audio Trophies in SQ and SPL from IASCA ..USACi and other sound organizations..it’s best to focus on a good front stage ..usually components and a good sub stage ..a 5 ch amp would be nice for running an active front stage ..usually if your into a better SQ system ..aftermarket equalization can help out quite a bit

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If I keep rear speakers I never amplify them ..and only dual cone on deck power or equivalent amp ..if I run rear mid bass drivers .. or midrange ..I’ll band pass and amplify those ..I have over 100 first place Car Audio Trophies in SQ and SPL from IASCA ..USACi and other sound organizations..it’s best to focus on a good front stage ..usually components and a good sub stage ..a 5 ch amp would be nice for running an active front stage ..usually if your into a better SQ system ..aftermarket equalization can help out quite a bit

 

I was thinking that future maybe a set of mid bass specific speakers amplified in rear doors but not a priority right now. Can I ask you because you have so much experience, If I run HL input amps like listed in the diag,

 

how bad will the sound be from the OEM head unit without a DSP?

Will my bass be absent?

Are LOCs garbage or adequate for less powerful systems?

 

 

I can't afford award winning clarity, nor could my ears appreciate it at this stage, looking for just something much better than any OEM PREMIUM sound system like the Dodge kickers or Alpines. Bright but punchy. LOUD is not a priority. I have read so many articles about using a LOC but only today discovered that they only boost the crap too.

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I was thinking that future maybe a set of mid bass specific speakers amplified in rear doors but not a priority right now. Can I ask you because you have so much experience, If I run HL input amps like listed in the diag,

 

how bad will the sound be from the OEM head unit without a DSP?

Will my bass be absent?

Are LOCs garbage or adequate for less powerful systems?

 

 

I can't afford award winning clarity, nor could my ears appreciate it at this stage, looking for just something much better than any OEM PREMIUM sound system like the Dodge kickers or Alpines. Bright but punchy. LOUD is not a priority. I have read so many articles about using a LOC but only today discovered that they only boost the crap too.

 

As long as it’s not a premium system like Bose ..fender..infinity..etc and just a basic factory system ..deck to speakers no external amp ..you’ll be fine by using the aftermarket amp hi inputs ..if it has an external amp you’ll need the an aftermarket loc to bring down the speaker outputs

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My vehicle has no ext amp, 10-20W / channel (4 doors and dash tweets)

 

What is your opinion on the LC6i? or 2i? waste of money and decrease SQ? Obviously they are not for competition systems or even hi-end systems, but for an average punch system?

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As long as it’s not a premium system like Bose ..fender..infinity..etc and just a basic factory system ..deck to speakers no external amp ..you’ll be fine by using the aftermarket amp hi inputs ..if it has an external amp you’ll need the an aftermarket loc to bring down the speaker outputs

 

again, factory deck with built in factory EQ and crossovers nowadays fk people's sh*t up. if the search feature worked, you would have seen the hundreds of complaint threads where the issue was the audiocontrol line out convertor. No nothing else in the install was bad it was literally all signal related with the lc2i/lc6i/lc7i and stock head unit. Do you know how many countless threads have been made with people swapping out their recent 2015 and up car's sound systems and it literally sounds like trash compared to their stock setup? Literally thinks just swapping speakers adding an amp using an LOC for signal will be and upgrade but it sounds like a downgrade. we had them swap out the head unit or do a proper dsp and viola, even without any tuning, just the FLAT de-equalization of the signal alone made massive sound quality gains. Nothing else changed in the setup. already a handful of these threads this year and its only march.

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Thanks everyone,

 

I am going to ignore the rear door speakers for now and just run them off the HU. Will focus on the component fronts and sub.

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What about the Hertz HDP5? I can get one for $275.00 usd. it doesn't look like it has a subsonic setting for a ported sub.

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