WTB: Old(er) TC Sounds Drivers (eD, SoundSplinter, Stryke, OEMs, LMS/LMTs etc)


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WTB: Old(er) TC Sounds Drivers (eD, SoundSplinter, Stryke, OEMs, LMS/LMTs etc)

ciaonzo

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resko1

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I have 2 5400 motors and frames.
I would LOVE to have both of these! but the 4" LMT coil is extremely hard to find. Be better off having John at PE wind a dozen of them. Only issue is they were proprietary and patented so last time i inquired a year or so ago about winding some 2" LMT coils for the tc2+, he said nope cant do it. Complete bullshit if you ask me. Patent got sold to a holding company after thilo bottomed out from parts express and TC sounds dissolved for good. The holding company has nothing to do with audio and refuses to release it. So... until that patent gets released, we may be screwed from what is arguably the best low frequency driver ever made!
As for Thilo, hes an engineer for tympany audio now. Exact title is audio design architect.
 

ciaonzo

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The holding company has nothing to do with audio and refuses to release it. So... until that patent gets released, we may be screwed from what is arguably the best low frequency driver ever made!
Interesting to note that LMS coils are being used in a couple products right now. Whether they licensed the rights to it or not isn't clear to me but, nonetheless.
The SVS 3000 line uses a 2" or 2.5" ( I forget) LMS coil and that line is quickly gaining favor for those that can't afford or don't want their Ultra or 4000 line. Check out the overview video on u toob and have a look at that coil. They call it split coil, but is decidedly not split anywhere. It has less windings in the middle. Go to the 2:30 mark and wait for the soft parts shot, it's after that.


Next product is the new line Purifi woofers. Again, have a look at that coil and tell me it's not the same patented LMS technology that we all know and love. Even more interesting is how few people are mentioning that fact, as if they were always unaware of it before. Just do a google images for Purifi woofer and shoot for the HiFiCompass or troelsgravesen pics. They are nice and clear.
 
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ciaonzo

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Those Purifi woofers come in a 6.5 and 4.5 inch.

Can you imagine a little 4.5 LMS driver for nearfield listening? Little thing stroking about an inch, clean. Power hungry, of course. But fun. And very expensive.
 

resko1

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Interesting to note that LMS coils are being used in a couple products right now. Whether they licensed the rights to it or not isn't clear to me but, nonetheless.
The SVS 3000 line uses a 2" or 2.5" ( I forget) LMS coil and that line is quickly gaining favor for those that can't afford or don't want their Ultra or 4000 line. Check out the overview video on u toob and have a look at that coil. They call it split coil, but is decidedly not split anywhere. It has less windings in the middle. Go to the 2:30 mark and wait for the soft parts shot, it's after that.


Next product is the new line Purifi woofers. Again, have a look at that coil and tell me it's not the same patented LMS technology that we all know and love. Even more interesting is how few people are mentioning that fact, as if they were always unaware of it before. Just do a google images for Purifi woofer and shoot for the HiFiCompass or troelsgravesen pics. They are nice and clear.

This is sneaky. They are labeling it as a split coil design but its a copy of LMT tech.
 
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ciaonzo

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This is sneaky. They are labeling it as a split coil design but its a copy of LMT tech.
Yep, same with the Purifi woofers.

Sneaky is the clever new version of the LMS coil that Kyle recently patented and is currently licensed to Tymphany. Rather than extra windings on the ends to produce more force (or rather produce more L to equalize force) , it has the same winding density from top to bottom. Instead, it has lower impedance windings on the top and bottom than it has in the middle. This way the gap can be tighter and overall force/sensitivity/Qes doesn't suffer as much as before. It's all one coil but with more current flowing through the lower resistance windings on the ends, I imagine the effect is the same as traditional LMS coils with their resulting BL profiles.

Pav, I'm sorry for clogging your WTB thread! I'll stop.
 
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resko1

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Yep, same with the Purifi woofers.

Sneaky is the clever new version of the LMS coil that Kyle recently patented and is currently licensed to Tymphany. Rather than extra windings on the ends to produce more force (or rather produce more L to equalize force) , it has the same winding density from top to bottom. Instead, it has lower impedance windings on the top and bottom than it has in the middle. This way the gap can be tighter and overall force/sensitivity/Qes doesn't suffer as much as before. It's all one coil but with more current flowing through the lower resistance windings on the ends, I imagine the effect is the same as traditional LMS coils with their resulting BL profiles.

Pav, I'm sorry for clogging your WTB thread! I'll stop.
From what im reading, Kyle holds the patent now for all of the LMT/split coil designs including the right to reproducing LMS drivers. Interesting.... And the fact Kyle followed (or vice versa) Thilo over to Tymphany. Would explain if SVS got there hands on it by paying royalties to Tymphany. We may see a rebirth of the technology which would be amazing! The rebirth of the 5400 ultra would be the greatest thing to happen to audio. Still is, IMO, hands down the best LF driver for accurate reproduction.
 
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Pyropin

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Yep, same with the Purifi woofers.

Sneaky is the clever new version of the LMS coil that Kyle recently patented and is currently licensed to Tymphany. Rather than extra windings on the ends to produce more force (or rather produce more L to equalize force) , it has the same winding density from top to bottom. Instead, it has lower impedance windings on the top and bottom than it has in the middle. This way the gap can be tighter and overall force/sensitivity/Qes doesn't suffer as much as before. It's all one coil but with more current flowing through the lower resistance windings on the ends, I imagine the effect is the same as traditional LMS coils with their resulting BL profiles.

Pav, I'm sorry for clogging your WTB thread! I'll stop.
No need to apologise at all, Shane - it doesn't bother me in the slightest! I had no idea SVS had started using LMS coils in their products. It looks very neatly wound for an LMS coil, but that's no split coil, for sure. Very cheeky. Since they opted to name their coil as such, I would hazard a guess that they haven't licensed it, and may be trying to stay off the radar? They could have given it another name, but the fact they've tried to pass it off as a split coil itself seems a bit dodgy.

To all who have offered TC drivers, I appreciate it - sorry for the heavily delayed reply. At this point in time, the only models I would really be interested in would be an original red basket LMS-4000, or TV-12. True oddball/prototype drivers still considered, though! Not much TC stuff seems to get listed anymore, but surely there are more than a few about sitting in storage unused.
 
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ciaonzo

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It looks very neatly wound for an LMS coil, but that's no split coil, for sure. Very cheeky. Since they opted to name their coil as such, I would hazard a guess that they haven't licensed it, and may be trying to stay off the radar? They could have given it another name, but the fact they've tried to pass it off as a split coil itself seems a bit dodgy.
My guess is they chose to go with the "split coil" nomenclature because it is open source and requires no licensing. Pure speculation.

I think the neatness of the wind is the result of a two layer edge-wound approach, rather than the usual approach of 4, 6, or 8 layers of round or flat wire. It can look gnarly going back and forth with the single strands making their way to each bundle on the extremes.
 

tc3k101

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My guess is they chose to go with the "split coil" nomenclature because it is open source and requires no licensing. Pure speculation.

I think the neatness of the wind is the result of a two layer edge-wound approach, rather than the usual approach of 4, 6, or 8 layers of round or flat wire. It can look gnarly going back and forth with the single strands making their way to each bundle on the extremes.
I thought jbl still had the patent for split coil?
 

ciaonzo

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I thought jbl still had the patent for split coil?
Josh, waaaaaaazzzuuuuupppp. So glad you're still around, bro! Hope everything's good with you.

I think JBL has the "split motor" patent. I'm not 100% on that.

In a "normal" split coil, the sections work in tandem with a single short top plate. The JBL "split coil" is not in tandem, but instead work push/pull with opposing gaps and forces. Think high BL with distortion-canceling effects.
 
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tc3k101

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Josh, waaaaaaazzzuuuuupppp. So glad you're still around, bro! Hope everything's good with you.

I think JBL has the "split motor" patent. I'm not 100% on that.

In a "normal" split coil, the sections work in tandem with a single short top plate. The JBL "split coil" is not in tandem, but instead work push/pull with opposing gaps and forces. Think high BL with distortion-canceling effects.
Hey Shane! I'm good man still alive and kicking. How have you been man?
Always messing around with tc stuff.

Gotcha split motor split coil same difference right lol.
 
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resko1

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Josh, waaaaaaazzzuuuuupppp. So glad you're still around, bro! Hope everything's good with you.

I think JBL has the "split motor" patent. I'm not 100% on that.

In a "normal" split coil, the sections work in tandem with a single short top plate. The JBL "split coil" is not in tandem, but instead work push/pull with opposing gaps and forces. Think high BL with distortion-canceling effects.
Beat me to the punch.

There is no patent that i know of on split coil. its opensource since the design has been around for eons. You have to prove its proprietary in order to gain a patent. A split coil does not have windings in the center like LMS technology. And split coil utilizes a huge BL product to make up for the loss of coil at rest.
 
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