Morel Supremo Piccolo tweeters as independent entity - wisdom requested.

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
I have heard the Morel Supremo Piccolo is amazing tweeter. As you know, Morel in fact sells this tweeter as a separate entity as well as part of their high end component speaker.

I do not want to give up my Focal 165 KRX2 component speaker woofers (in front doors) but am considering moving the Focal component tweeters from dash location down to front door with the rest of components and putting the Morel tweeters in the dash. Morel says to remove the Focal tweeter completely (or could I put the Focal tweeters in front door but have crossovers set so that the tweeter is basically all going to the Morels?). HU has 8-channel output so Morel tweeters could have own output as currently only 6 channels are used.

My installer states I should not mix the Morel tweeters with my current setup. Says separate speaker systems do not mix.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts.

 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
17,261
252
South Coast Metro, CA
If you are going to change, get rid of the focals completely. Too many tweeters in the system can cause phase issues which leads to beaming and distortion. You can mix and match all you want but you gotta get rid of the passive crossover and run active.

Different drivers like different crossover points

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
If you are going to change, get rid of the focals completely. Too many tweeters in the system can cause phase issues which leads to beaming and distortion. You can mix and match all you want but you gotta get rid of the passive crossover and run active.
Different drivers like different crossover points
Thank you very much Jeffdachef. So I would remove the Focal tweeters completely. Then could I still run the remaining Focal passive and the Morels active? That is, I understand I would need to purchase a separate active crossover for the Morel tweeters but do I need to buy active for the remaining Focals?

 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
17,261
252
South Coast Metro, CA
Thank you very much Jeffdachef. So I would remove the Focal tweeters completely. Then could I still run the remaining Focal passive and the Morels active? That is, I understand I would need to purchase a separate active crossover for the Morel tweeters but do I need to buy active for the remaining Focals?
You'll want an active capable amp or an active capable head unit or a digital sound processor. You want to remove the passive crossover completely too because your crossover point for the mid needs to match and blend well with the new tweeter as well. Also passive crossovers waste some energy as well soits better to have the speakers directly to a power source

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
You'll want an active capable amp or an active capable head unit or a digital sound processor. You want to remove the passive crossover completely too because your crossover point for the mid needs to match and blend well with the new tweeter as well. Also passive crossovers waste some energy as well soits better to have the speakers directly to a power source
I have a Pioneer Dex P99RS HU and then a JL HD600/4 powering both the Focal components and two small Focal (5") Utopia Be subs in the rear panels. so if the Focal mids remain directly powered by their half of this amp, then separate crossovers are not necessary for the Focal mids? I was hoping to still power the two small subs with half the amp as I do today, then power the Focal mids and Morel tweeters with the other half, with an active crossover for the Morels between the amp and tweeters? but this contradicts what I just read in a sticky that active crossovers are before the amp? I have no idea if this is possible as I am struggling to understand these active and passive and all these concepts.

 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
17,261
252
South Coast Metro, CA
I have a Pioneer Dex P99RS HU and then a JL HD600/4 powering both the Focal components and two small Focal (5") Utopia Be subs in the rear panels. so if the Focal mids remain directly powered by their half of this amp, then separate crossovers are not necessary for the Focal mids? I was hoping to still power the two small subs with half the amp as I do today, then power the Focal mids and Morel tweeters with the other half, with an active crossover for the Morels between the amp and tweeters? but this contradicts what I just read in a sticky that active crossovers are before the amp? I have no idea if this is possible as I am struggling to understand these active and passive and all these concepts.
Since you have the proper head unit to do so, you will have to put the head unit in network mode which is an active crossover. You will need to put the tweeters on two channels of the hd 600.4 and the mids on the other two then you can select crossover points on the head unit which is all being done before anything reaches the amp. You will need to add a monoblock for the subwoofers. This is how all active setups and competition level setups are ran.

This also allows you to time align the proper distances between each tweeter and mid so you get a perfect sound stage. With passive comps, the time alignment is crap in comparison because its no where near as precise.

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
Since you have the proper head unit to do so, you will have to put the head unit in network mode which is an active crossover. You will need to put the tweeters on two channels of the hd 600.4 and the mids on the other two then you can select crossover points on the head unit which is all being done before anything reaches the amp. You will need to add a monoblock for the subwoofers. This is how all active setups and competition level setups are ran.
This also allows you to time align the proper distances between each tweeter and mid so you get a perfect sound stage. With passive comps, the time alignment is crap in comparison because its no where near as precise.
Thank you very much for taking the time to provide these great insights. With the HU in network mode, then I do not need an additional active crossover, the HU handles all that before the amp is even reached. But I do need to get an additional monoblock for the subs, correct? Sorry for re-stating what you have said, just want to be sure I got it. If so, this makes complete sense to me.

 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
17,261
252
South Coast Metro, CA
Thank you very much for taking the time to provide these great insights. With the HU in network mode, then I do not need an additional active crossover, the HU handles all that before the amp is even reached. But I do need to get an additional monoblock for the subs, correct? Sorry for re-stating what you have said, just want to be sure I got it. If so, this makes complete sense to me.
Yes thats all correct, be patient though a lot of hours of tuning will be involved but you have endless sound quality potential with that head unit in network mode. Youll always seem to find something that makes your setup sound even better than how crazy it already sounds. The magic of great sound processing.

It'll be a great learning process as well.

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
Yes thats all correct, be patient though a lot of hours of tuning will be involved but you have endless sound quality potential with that head unit in network mode. Youll always seem to find something that makes your setup sound even better than how crazy it already sounds. The magic of great sound processing.
It'll be a great learning process as well.
Awesome. Thank you again very much.

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
Yes thats all correct, be patient though a lot of hours of tuning will be involved but you have endless sound quality potential with that head unit in network mode. Youll always seem to find something that makes your setup sound even better than how crazy it already sounds. The magic of great sound processing.
It'll be a great learning process as well.
just one more question, all these tuning adjustments can be done from the HU menu correct? That is, the install could be done at shop, the car put back together, and then the adjustments can be made from the HU? or do some adjustments need to be made on the speaker and amp hardware?

 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
17,261
252
South Coast Metro, CA
just one more question, all these tuning adjustments can be done from the HU menu correct? That is, the install could be done at shop, the car put back together, and then the adjustments can be made from the HU? or do some adjustments need to be made on the speaker and amp hardware?
All head unit after the shop properly sets up the rcas and speaker wiring

 

GTI7

Junior Member
Aug 25, 2016
9
1
Phoenix, AZ
Just now re-reading this well after the fact, having essentially followed this advice, it is much appreciated because it is so completely right on.  I was really starting nearly ground zero and this was extremely wise and helpful.  Thank you.

 
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youdoofus

Skibidi
Dec 13, 2014
3,816
190
planet earth
Just now re-reading this well after the fact, having essentially followed this advice, it is much appreciated because it is so completely right on.  I was really starting nearly ground zero and this was extremely wise and helpful.  Thank you.
jeff helped someone? thatd be a first ;)