Current events discussion

[ThxOne Premium Member]

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

 

[RobGMN Premium Member]

Why do you guys keep citing those cases? Nobody is depriving anybody of life, liberty or property; they're being deported. You're cherry picking in the Plyler case, which was specific to elementary education and not the broad protections that you claim.

You mean cases where the SCOTUS confirmed that anyone on our soil can have their rights protected by the COTUS?

Uhh, those decisions kind of back up the idea that the COTUS protects the rights of people on US soil. That's the point.

I'm can only assume you didn't actually read Mathews v Diaz since it (also) conflicts with your position. You have to be careful of your sources. I assume some leftie cherry picked this case using a keyword search and didn't bother to reading it. Quiet embarrassing.

Further, the Court held that disparate treatment between noncitizens is not necessarily unconstitutional. Noncitizens are a heterogeneous group. While there is no affirmative duty to extend the benefits of citizenship to noncitizens, Congress is free to extend benefits to any sub-group of noncitizens it finds reasonable.

That's not the argument. We're talking about the right of due process.

Again I think somebody did a word a search came up with this case and didn't bother to read it or hoped others wouldn't. Shaughnessy grants LAWFUL RESIDENT NONCITIZENS a constitutional right to due process. The courts says traditional standards of fairness for those who entered illegally. I assume that means a parallel system that operates more like mediation would be considered "fair." I have to assume there is some reason they just don't say due process, but word salad it with "traditional standards of fairness."

The Court held that a noncitizen’s Fifth Amendment right to procedural due process differs according to his or her circumstances. Lawful resident noncitizens possess a constitutional right to procedural due process that is not easily removed. In limited circumstances, if a lawful resident noncitizen is temporarily absent from the United States, the right to due process may still exist. Any noncitizen within the United States also has a constitutional right to traditional standards of fairness, regardless of whether they entered the country lawfully or unlawfully.

It is true that aliens who have once passed through our gates, even illegally, may be expelled only after proceedings conforming to traditional standards of fairness-encompassed in due process of law.

Correct. Their right to due process is protected by the COTUS. You just posted confirmation of that, if you actually read the text you quoted.

Actually, we're not born with rights. Rights are granted and taken by those in power. The right to vote for example.

Incorrect. We are born with rights. They may be trampled or denied by someone in power, but that doesn't mean we don't still have them.

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

@RobGMN have you nothing to say? Do you still want to claim Obama did it "LEGALLY" as you said?

"A deportation system that herds 75 percent of people through fast-track, streamlined removal is a system devoid of fairness and individualized due process. Nonjudicial removals violate our constitutional tradition and cannot be reconciled with an administration that has repeatedly stated its commitment to immigration reform." - ACLU

This was Obama. Why... Why lie? Just because Trump? Is your blind hatred that bad that you will tell lies to make Trump seem worse??

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Cry more, snowflake.



The BLM riots certainly caused more damage. But storming the capitol building and forcing congress to evacuate in an attempt to prevent the certification of the election.....along with all of the other attempts to overturn the election results......goes beyond just vandalism.

Link (https://www.politico.com/news/2025/02/20/justice-department-january-6-clemency-guns-00205357) discusses the justice department pushing for "related" crimes to be dropped if they were discovered during the January 6th investigation. The child **** guy was a bad example. That was my error. He's using this claim as a defense, but I find it hard to believe that even the justice department would go to bat for him. But again....why is this guy getting a pardon at all, for anything? Pieces of shit like him....like the people attacking capitol police?

The BLM rioters weren't acting on behalf of any of the democrat politicians that you've named. Should some of their sentences been more harsh? Yeah, probably. I don't know specifics of many of those cases. But comparing them to Trump pardoning the rioters that attacked the capitol and assaulted capitol police ON CAMERA and on Trump's behalf.....is not comparable in the least. Especially considering the current narrative surrounding protests going on right now. You can't seriously eat up the BS narratives for Trump activating military to deal with protests/riots.....when he's shown that riots that are conducted under his name are perfectly fine. Law and order my ***. Trump is a lawless goon.

The Pedo should have remained in jail and it certainly demonstrates some recklessness on Trump's part. There were lots of others that should have remained in jail IMHO, the ones convicted seditious conspiracy, the ones who actually assaulted officers, breached barriers, etc. If I thought the J6ers were actually there at Trump's behest to overthrow the country/election, then I'd agree there is a huge difference. I believe it was a protest that got out of control. OTOH, the BLM rioters came back night after night. The BLM rioters set up an Autonomous Zone in Seattle (and then demanded the gov't send them food). I certainly think that Trump is activating the military because LA looks like a warzone. Would he be as quick to activate the military if the rioters were "his people?" Probably not, but then again if this was pro-life rally gone awry, Newsom wouldn't have hesitated to active the National Guard would he?

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

Actually, we're not born with rights. Rights are granted and taken by those in power. The right to vote for example.

Rob shouldn't even be arguing due process. His boy Obama ignored that like the plague.

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

You mean cases where the SCOTUS confirmed that anyone on our soil can have their rights protected by the COTUS?

Uhh, those decisions kind of back up the idea that the COTUS protects the rights of people on US soil. That's the point.

That's not the argument. We're talking about the right of due process.

Correct. Their right to due process is protected by the COTUS. You just posted confirmation of that, if you actually read the text you quoted.

LOL, clearly you didn't read the text I quoted of my response. You posted 3 cases, two of them clearly state the rights of illegals vary from those of citizens. The third adds a vaguery about "Standard Traditions of Fairness." I don't know why the judges put that there, but I have to assume there is a reason they didn't just say "due process." You're welcome to deny it, but it's right there in black and white.

Incorrect. We are born with rights. They may be trampled or denied by someone in power, but that doesn't mean we don't still have them.

Rob wins again. What is that 1572 wins to zero loses.

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

LOL, clearly you didn't read the text I quoted of my response. You posted 3 cases, two of them clearly state the rights of illegals vary from those of citizens. The third adds a vaguery about "Standard Traditions of Fairness." I don't know why the judges put that there, but I have to assume there is a reason they didn't just say "due process." You're welcome to deny it, but it's right there in black and white.

Rob wins again. What is that 1572 wins to zero loses.

1576 (literally)... (Figuratively)

 

[Jimi77 Premium Member]

Rob shouldn't even be arguing due process. His boy Obama ignored that like the plague.

Clearly he has comprehension problems. Even the Shaughnessy case, that is closest to what's going on currently, is about a legal resident alien being prevented from re-entering the country. And it contains a vague statement that illegal aliens have right to "traditional standards of fairness." I can only assume that's there for a reason. The judges clearly state legal resident noncitizens have a constitutional right to due process (ie the same rights you and I enjoy). I assume there is a reason they didn't include illegal resident aliens in that sentence or just state that they have the right to due process. Could be bad english - legalese is always clear as mud. But claim that's proof positive that illegals have a constitutional right to due process is a stretch of the imagination. Unfortunately, the left lives in pure delusion.

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

Clearly he has comprehension problems. Even the Shaughnessy case, that is closest to what's going on currently, is about a legal resident alien being prevented from re-entering the country. And it contains a vague statement that illegal aliens have right to "traditional standards of fairness." I can only assume that's there for a reason. The judges clearly state legal resident noncitizens have a constitutional right to due process (ie the same rights you and I enjoy). I assume there is a reason they didn't include illegal resident aliens in that sentence or just state that they have the right to due process. Could be bad english - legalese is always clear as mud. But claim that's proof positive that illegals have a constitutional right to due process is a stretch of the imagination. Unfortunately, the left lives in pure delusion.

I have been around some... let's call them law breakers in the past. I do know that criminals do still have rights but they definitely have less rights than non criminals. Now... how does that work for a person or persons who never should have been here in the first place? I just find it hard to grasp why we are supposed to even entertain granting them rights when they spit on our flag and violate our laws to get in this country.

 

[stocker08 10+ year member]

Why don't you and your dad Rob go hold each other lovingly in the corner.

 

[stocker08 10+ year member]

The Pedo should have remained in jail and it certainly demonstrates some recklessness on Trump's part. There were lots of others that should have remained in jail IMHO, the ones convicted seditious conspiracy, the ones who actually assaulted officers, breached barriers, etc. If I thought the J6ers were actually there at Trump's behest to overthrow the country/election, then I'd agree there is a huge difference. I believe it was a protest that got out of control. OTOH, the BLM rioters came back night after night. The BLM rioters set up an Autonomous Zone in Seattle (and then demanded the gov't send them food). I certainly think that Trump is activating the military because LA looks like a warzone. Would he be as quick to activate the military if the rioters were "his people?" Probably not, but then again if this was pro-life rally gone awry, Newsom wouldn't have hesitated to active the National Guard would he?

There's definitely a double standard that goes both ways, there's no question about that. It'll be interesting to see if many of these protests devolve into rioting today. And hopefully anyone involved in rioting gets arrested. Those people are opportunists and assholes.

 

[spokey9 5,000+ posts]

goes beyond just vandalism.

Portland's grim reality: 100 days of protests, many violent

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) — Once hailed as one of the most livable U.S. cities, Portland, Oregon, is grappling with an uncertain future as it reaches a stunning benchmark: 100 consecutive nights of racial injustice protests marred by vandalism, chaos — and the killing of a supporter of President Donald Tr

apnews.com

Trying block federal workers inside of a federal courthouse and then trying to set it on fire...100 days or so of violence in just this one city...you're right there's no comparison between the summer of love and j6...

 

[ThxOne Premium Member]

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